jdarling Posted January 22, 2008 Report Share Posted January 22, 2008 I just got done looking through the endless puppy advertisements from all of the puppymills on PuppyFind (aka "Puppymill Central") ... puppies from $100 to $1500 and more ... all the colors of the rainbow, from every different "registry" around, and just when I thought I was sick enough, I found an ad by this "kennel" ... Old Tumble Weed Ranch, complete with "NewBorder" puppies What the hell are people thinking? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KrisK Posted January 22, 2008 Report Share Posted January 22, 2008 I think I'm going to puke....Newfoundland/Border cross selling for big bucks...these people are beyond idiots. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Northof49 Posted January 22, 2008 Report Share Posted January 22, 2008 I think I'm going to puke....Newfoundland/Border cross selling for big bucks...these people are beyond idiots. There is an add at my vet's office for a "bordernese" Border Collie/Bernese Mountain Dog cross. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stockdogranch Posted January 22, 2008 Report Share Posted January 22, 2008 Sometimes things like this are so depressing that all I can do is my version of hiding my head in the sand, which means going out to work dogs, A Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KrisK Posted January 22, 2008 Report Share Posted January 22, 2008 While not exactly the same thing, there was an ad at one of our pet stores "wanted - Wolf puppy" will pay good price. When I spoke to the manager, to tell her that wolf puppies or hybrids are illegal here and she might want to take the ad down,, she said "oh, he doesn't really want a wolf puppy, just a dog that looks like one'' like a husky I suggested that she might want him to reword his ad to read that....nope, she could care less! Someone is going to think wolf pups are great...let's get one SIGH................................ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lizmo Posted January 22, 2008 Report Share Posted January 22, 2008 Thats sick Grr, I'm so mad..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michelle K Posted January 22, 2008 Report Share Posted January 22, 2008 OMG! New puppies weekly??? Oh, now I feel sick. If this isn't a puppymill operation, then I don't know what is. That has puppymill written all over it. They have 5 different breeds listed available and then you see pics of other breeds, but NO WHERE does it say what they raise. I would be scared to see the list. I can't even express how much this pulls on my heart and what's the worst part of it is that they aren't the only ones out there. There are so many operations like that. It's horrible. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sheepandakom Posted January 22, 2008 Report Share Posted January 22, 2008 If you looked closer, the Newborders are registered! This is crazy and sad. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ninso Posted January 22, 2008 Report Share Posted January 22, 2008 Do you think people would be as into these mixes if they weren't given fancy names like "NewBorders" and "Bordernese"? Do names like these lead people to think they are getting a "fancy" new breed of dog? Perhaps shelters, instead of saying that a dog is a BC/Lab cross (which people probably read as "shelter mutt") should start advertising their dogs as rare "Labords", etc. Anyways, puppy mills make my stomach turn. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShoresDog Posted January 22, 2008 Report Share Posted January 22, 2008 They're registered with "ICA" which is probably another Continental Kennel Club type scam. I'm just hoping that the Newfie X Border Collie litter was a mistake and no one is doing this on purpose. It's inexcusable that people buy these puppies and enable this kind of thing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SalemsMom Posted January 22, 2008 Report Share Posted January 22, 2008 This is sad. There are more and more of these out there, and it getting so popular it is scary. A few weeks ago at the dog park someone asked me what kind of dog Salem was and I said lab/gsd mix, and the women asked where she could buy one of those. It took me a second to figure out what she was talking about and then I figured out she thought he was a designer. I told her she could find one at the humane society and she gave me a nasty look and walked off. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SalemsMom Posted January 22, 2008 Report Share Posted January 22, 2008 "Mom is a beautiful black & blue spotted Border Collie, she works our animals on the farm. Dad is a very handsome Newfoundland. " I don't know anything about breeding, but it sounds like that would be really dangerous for the mother! Newfies are huge! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jdarling Posted January 22, 2008 Author Report Share Posted January 22, 2008 I have since found out that the "ICA" is the "International Canine Association." This is just disgusting. Jodi Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Northof49 Posted January 22, 2008 Report Share Posted January 22, 2008 Blech And of course with these "registration papers" people are going to claim that their mutts are purebred! Thank goodness this kind of think can't happen up here in Canada. Unfortunately it's not illegal to create these puppies, just have a registry for them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PSmitty Posted January 22, 2008 Report Share Posted January 22, 2008 Yuck. Disgusting. But yes, many, many people with get taken in with the cutesy name and so called "registration". *sigh* Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Root Beer Posted January 22, 2008 Report Share Posted January 22, 2008 Do you think people would be as into these mixes if they weren't given fancy names like "NewBorders" and "Bordernese"? Do names like these lead people to think they are getting a "fancy" new breed of dog? Perhaps shelters, instead of saying that a dog is a BC/Lab cross (which people probably read as "shelter mutt") should start advertising their dogs as rare "Labords", etc. Anyways, puppy mills make my stomach turn. In theory, I think it would be very interesting for a shelter to do this with a certain percentage of the mixed breed dogs in residence and see if adoption of those dogs would increase. Of course, I don't think that people should be duped, but it would be very interesting in theory. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ninso Posted January 22, 2008 Report Share Posted January 22, 2008 In theory, I think it would be very interesting for a shelter to do this with a certain percentage of the mixed breed dogs in residence and see if adoption of those dogs would increase. Of course, I don't think that people should be duped, but it would be very interesting in theory. I was mainly joking. This would probably lead to the adopters of the (hopefully pre-neutered) "designer purebred dogs" to go online and find someone who sells puppies of the "breed" since their adopted dog would be so great they would just have to have another one just like him! It would probably end up encouraging sales of designer puppies in the long run. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kate40541 Posted January 22, 2008 Report Share Posted January 22, 2008 A while back I read what was supposed to be a defense of the "designer dogs" claiming that all of our breeds were at one time a mix so what were we getting so upset about? While that may be true and I do know that while many different breeds can go into a final product (breed) hasn't it usually been done with a purpose in mind other than money or creating something that will have a "cute" name? I've never bred a dog but it's more than what sounds to me like accidents. Besides BCs are so variable why isn't that enough? Suzanne Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest jackieandryan Posted January 22, 2008 Report Share Posted January 22, 2008 I am just wondering What exactly is it that is pissing you people off so much? Is it the fact that they are breeding border collies with another breed? Is it because they are selling them? It is absurd that people would pay that much, but if they are breeding responsibly, which they probably are not, what is so unethical about this? And just so you know, I am in no was advocating the breeder's actions. I am more just curious as to what is making you angriest. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barb Scott Posted January 22, 2008 Report Share Posted January 22, 2008 We have 3 ads in today's local paper. Two are for puppies ($100 and up) and have been there for a few weeks. The 3rd I called; pups are multiple colored and $500. Multiple colored means B&W, R&W, and blue merle. The man had absolutely no clue what the lines were and couldn't tell me the names of the breeders of the bitch and stud. He thought they were 6 weeks old! He actually seemed like a nice person; they loved their female and bred her because his 4 kids wanted puppies. He actually assured me this would be their only and last litter... Barb S Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jdarling Posted January 22, 2008 Author Report Share Posted January 22, 2008 jackieandryan - I'd imagine you've read the "READ THIS FIRST" post in the header of every section of this board. There is a part in there that reads: For the good of the breed, border collies should be bred only for working ability. The border collie breed was created by farmers and shepherds who wanted to develop a dog which could help them manage their livestock. They bred only to produce good workers, and that singleness of purpose created the breed we love. Changing the way border collies are bred will change the breed itself. Therefore, breeding dogs who have not proven themselves as useful herding dogs, or breeding for appearance/color, or breeding for sports or for "good pets," or breeding for anything other than working ability (which includes the health and temperament necessary for working) is harmful to the breed. I think that it is understood that the sire and dam are both, at the very least, Border Collies. This is just the first of a myriad of problems with this particular breeder. Jodi Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kate40541 Posted January 23, 2008 Report Share Posted January 23, 2008 One thing that makes me mad about this is that there are already so many dogs that need homes that there is absolutely no need to breed more of them in this way. Two, is as Jodi said, this forum is aimed at people who value the BC as it already is and want it to protect it against the incursions of the people who see it as the next dog to be bred for one part of what makes it what it is whether that is conformation or drive or whatever. Three, it makes us sad as much as angry. Suzanne Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
berocca Posted January 23, 2008 Report Share Posted January 23, 2008 Black and Blue spotted Border Collie? Anyone else imagining some polka dot dog? Im guessing she must have been a blue merle. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jdarling Posted January 23, 2008 Author Report Share Posted January 23, 2008 I think one of the things that really blows me away ... is the form to register a litter. It enlarges so you can see the whole thing. It asks for the "designer breed" ... and then asks for the sire and dam registration number ... and right afterwards it says "if any." You don't even have to tell them which breed is the dam and which breed is the sire. It appears the dam and/or sire do not even need to be registered at all. Do people really fall for this? Do they really pay top dollar to say they have a "registered" mutt? This is just crazy! I've written to the ICA and asked them to clarify what supporting documentation I would need to provide in order to register a litter of Labradoodles. We'll see what they say. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michelle K Posted January 23, 2008 Report Share Posted January 23, 2008 I am just wondering What exactly is it that is pissing you people off so much? Is it the fact that they are breeding border collies with another breed? Is it because they are selling them? It is absurd that people would pay that much, but if they are breeding responsibly, which they probably are not, what is so unethical about this? And just so you know, I am in no was advocating the breeder's actions. I am more just curious as to what is making you angriest. After 10+ years of rescue work, the last thing I want to see are more puppy mills. I have fostered puppy mill dogs, and it is extremely heartbreaking. Responsibly? How can ANYONE be breeding responsibly when they can list new puppies WEEKLY? If they're producing so many puppies that they have new listings weekly, then it's obvious that these puppies will not be properly cared for and will not be properly socialized. I have severe issues with people that are breeding multiple breeds and especially purposely breeding mixed breeds and selling them for $300-$500 and up per pup. I don't have a problem with responsible good breeders, such as the BC breeders that are breeding dogs with excellent working ability. They're trying to preserve the true BC...not out here to make a profit off of them. These people are only in it for the money. That is apparent based on their site. You asked, so that's my answer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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