fearful border

[Jedismom]

Hello everyone,

 

I recently adopted a border collie from the SPCA. He's 7 mo. old and a total cutie. According to his paperwork he was purchased from a breeder at 2 mo. old and the people that had him, gave him up because they said they didn't have enough time for him. His name is Jedi and try as I might, my kids refused to change it soooo... I have a dog named after a Star Wars character.

 

His problem at this time seems to be that he was not socialized very much, if at all. He is fearful of everything. He spent his first few days with us hiding in the laundry room. We have another dog named Cadi who is a spaniel/retriever mix. We've been working on some toy possessiveness issues with her, but once I put up all the toys, she relaxed enough to befriend Jedi and now they're good friends.

 

He seems to be afraid of men, other dogs, anything he hasn't seen before etc. I've been taking him out little by little to introduce him to new things. He freaked out the other day at the sight of some men fishing. We live in Florida. The way I handled it is, in a very fun voice, I said let's go and when he settled down I walked him over to the men (still talking in a happy voice and saying come..come) When we got close and he saw Cadi being petted by them and that they weren't that scary he let them pet him very briefly. I didn't force him.

 

Am I doing the right thing? I've never had to deal with this before. I really want to help him get better and enjoy life. Someone said obedience training might help. I've also read that I should perhaps give people treats to give him so that he learns not everyone is a monster. I don't want to do the wrong thing.

 

Thanks,

 

Georgia

[sweet_ceana]

It sounds like you are doing things just fine. The only thing to keep in mind with having strangers give him treats is that he will learn that food from strangers is a positive thing. Some people are hessitant about teaching their dogs this because some strangers will poison dogs or give a dog something that they do not know is bad for them. IE grapes or something the dog has an allergy to. Whatever you do is your desicion in that respect. I personally had never thought of those consiquences until I heard it from some one else so I thought I would just throw it out there.

 

Good luck... and may the force be with you.... I couldn't resist!

[Soda-pop]

Be careful with the stranger handing food thing b/c if he's very scared but also very food motivated, he may come in to snatch the food then bite the stranger. It happens! Having them toss him a treat may be a better way to go in the beginning.

[Maralynn]

Welcome!

 

I think what you're doing sounds good. Just remember to take things nice and easy, especially in these first few months. If your other dog seems to inspire confidence in him that will be a big help to you . I'd probably look into clicker training for him as well. If you do a google search you'll come up with lots of good info on the subject.

[MickeyDogs]

I think you handled meeting the fishermen just great. You kept your voice and emotions upbeat and confident and that's just what Jedi needs to help him realize there's nothing to fear.

 

Treats are a good way to help him feel better about people he doesn't know and they could just drop the treats if you're worried about him taking the treats from their hand. One thing that helped my Jill get over the same issues was playing. Once she found the joy of chasing balls, sticks, etc., I would ask strangers to throw the ball for her. She soon thought any person was a potential ball thrower and eagerly approached them. It certainly changed her attitude toward people. Have people of all shapes & sizes toss the ball for him, especially men & children.

 

Enrolling him in classes is a good idea as long as the classes are taught in a motivational way (no leash corrections, etc.) and you go to them with socializing him in mind. Try to find a class where the dogs are somewhat settled - a basic class full of rammy, out of control dogs wouldn't help Jedi learn to relax around dogs. Maybe an advanced puppy class or something like that would be better. Clicker training is a great tool too.

 

He's going to teach you a lot! Keep us updated!

[OffTopic]

Georgia, every dog/pup is different, but I can tell you from my experience that it takes a while for a dog to learn to trust. Think about it from his perspective....he had a home, lost that home and landed in a noisy scary shelter. Then you came along and took him to yet another strange place. His little world has been turned upside down. It may take him a few months to realize that your home is his permanent home and that he can trust you. Once he trusts you, he'll be more likely to respond to new situations with less fear.

 

We recently adopted a 1 year old rescue (in October) and he is just now to the point where I would say with confidence that he trusts us completely. He was nervous and jumped at every noise at first. He bonded with Mike pretty quickly, but up until about a month ago he would still look at me "funny" and sometimes give a warning growl if I tried to hug him or invade his space in any way. I think he may have had an abusive female owner in the past, or something traumatic had happened involving a woman.

So I started doing daily positive treat training sessions with him and "invaded his space" with treats in my hand and after about 2 weeks of that he became my best buddy. I can now lean over him, grab him and hug him, kiss his head (that one didn't fly before!) and take toys out of his mouth. He curls up on the bed with me after Mike leaves for work and is totally fearless in new situations. He's home and he knows it.

Two weeks ago we got a 3 year old dog that we're going to have to work on, too. She's just now to the point where she'll go all the way to the back of the yard by herself. Up until yesterday, she would run from the cat in absolute terror. Yesterday she walked up to him and gave him a good sniff.

 

Just take small steps and give Jedi time to adjust. Don't make a big deal about noise or activity in the house and he'll figure it out by watching Cadi's reactions. Training can be a great bonding experience.

 

It sounds like you're going to be a great Jedi master.

[WAKing]

FYI the Jedi are members of an ancient and noble monastic organization, known for their talent in and observance of The Force. So while many Star Wars characters are Jedi's it doesn't refer to any single character.

 

 

 

BTW totaly sarcastic I just couldn't resist.

 

 

My old dog was like that, very afraid of men, loved other dogs to the point that when she met someone who had their dog with them she would be fine with them and like them, but any man and some women without dogs she would become extremely aggressive. I think you never can know what has happened to a dog before you adopt her and even if you train those behaviors out of her (which we did much as you are) you still have to be careful in all situations.

[Sue R]

Congratulations on adopting a dog who needed you and your family in his life!

 

It sounds like you are concerned and doing nicely by him. As you said, don't push it and don't force it. It can take time for even a well-socialized youngster to accept strangers if that is their nature.

 

As you have seen, what often makes the difference is the other dog, that he can trust, who can show him that strangers are a good thing, kind, and not scary.

 

Best wishes!

[Jedismom]

Thanks so much for your responses. Such a great community of dog lovers. I love the throwing the ball idea and perhaps treats from people I know but are not familiar to Jedi. I'm going to hold off on obedience class and train him myself for awhile until he can handle a more advanced class. You're right ..spazzy dogs..I also may do doggie day care periodically to help him socialize. It's this great cageless boarding place on acres of land where the dogs can play with supervision.

 

Our favorite game is what I call "fetch and herd" Cadi fetches and he herds her to me. He will occasionally bring a ball to me that she's dropped or won't get but then he's immediately back to watching her. Like ok I've got to get back to work now...It's the funniest thing. I'm a newbie at this so I pretty much learn something new everyday about the way his mind works. So different...

 

May the Force be With You!

 

Georgia

[powerfulgazelle]

I don't want to do the wrong thing.

 

Thanks,

 

Georgia

 

 

Hey, you gave Jedi a loving pack that HAS the time for him and wants to help him fit in!

 

Sounds ALL right to me!

[WyoBC]

Welcome to the boards. I have a fearful BC too. Anytime we (me and him) do anything new he is very fearful. The first time he went into PetCo he freaked out. But then he figured out that they have a treat bar! I have worked with him for a long time. It took him almost three to four months just to be able to walk him with out him being afraid. But he was abused so it took longer to work through things with him. I would go on and on about what I do with him, but if you want I can tell you more about what I did with him and how I work with him now. Just PM me and let me know.

 

Thanks for saving a life!!!!

[mbc1963]

FYI the Jedi are members of an ancient and noble monastic organization, known for their talent in and observance of The Force. So while many Star Wars characters are Jedi's it doesn't refer to any single character.

 

LOL! I contemplated giving this correction, but worried about revealing my true geekiness.

 

Mary

[aBC4me]

Welcome to the boards, from one Floridian to another. Once thing that you can work on with him is teaching him the word "friend". It has been a HUGE help for us (altough mine is just simply protecting, rather than fearful).

 

I also take mine to a cagefree facility once or twice a week and we love. I am sure that you will too.

[Lewie'sMom]

Welcome to the forum, Georgia. I'm a newbie too but I'm already in love with the great folks and fabulous BCs here.

 

I have a 7-month old BC mix (adopted him at 8-weeks) and he can be VERY suspicious of new sights, sounds, objects. I've found that if I just play it cool and don't force anything on him, eventually he'll accept whatever it is that's puzzling him. He's never actually run away from anything but he can be quite "stand-offish". I don't make a big deal of it and he normally comes around pretty quickly.

 

Keep your cool (sounds like you are) and let him explore at his own pace.

 

Good luck!

[Jedismom]

We had an episdode with (of all things) some discarded palm fronds today. Jedi froze and refused to budge as soon as he saw them. Thank goodness I had some treats in my pocket. He is very food motivated. I put him in a sit gave him a treat and slowly made a treat path to the fronds. It worked! He then went looking all through them to find more. I also saw him running through our yard with his tail a little more on the upside.

 

Progress!

 

Georgia

[Alaska]

Bear in mind that 7 months is about the onset of the second major fear stage for maturing pups. A quick overview of dog developmental stages is here. Add your pup's age to the uncertainty that goes with coming into a new home, and he may be acting fairly normally for the circumstances.

 

If I were in your shoes, I would rethink the idea about not taking a class in favor of training by yourself. A good class is a great environment for helping a dog build confidence. The dog is focused on you and on mastering some skill (e.g. basic obedience, tricks, whatever), meanwhile there are other people and dogs nearby who can be counted on not to do anything unexpected or scary. This really helps the dog learn that he can safely ignore such distractions.

 

Also, a good instructor will help you figure out how to gradually increase the challenges your pup is facing at a rate he can succeed at. If you try to do this yourself, e.g. at the dog park, you are quite likely to be faced with, and frustrated by, certain people and dogs who come barging up wanting to interact with your pup in a more forward manner than he is ready for. In a class, the instructor will make sure this does not happen, which should allow your pup to conquer his fear more quickly than if he is constantly freaking out at one new thing after another.

 

What you're doing now sounds great. I'm just pointing out that a class can offer more benefits than you may have been considering.

[bc4pack]

For those of you with fearful dogs here is a good site

http://www.fearfuldogs.com

 

HTH

[Jedismom]

Thank you again for all the great information. The author of the second dog fear stage is saying that if you reassure a dog (saying its okay) when it's afraid it makes the fear worse. The author of fearfuldogs.com is saying that it's ok to comfort a dog when it's afraid.

 

I was wondering what others personal experience has been with this.

[urge to herd]

Jedi's Mom,

 

Comfort or encourage? It all depends on the dog. Basically, if a matter of fact, cheerful, 'let's approach the New Scary Thing slowly, and you'll get a treat,' approach is working for Jedi and you, then that's what you want to do.

 

If Jedi's caution and shyness are more extreme, like being terrified to the point of not wanting treats, then you need to find a slower approach, and perhaps work with a trainer who has experience with fearful dogs.

 

I've got a shy girl, Samantha; a terrified, anxiety ridden girl, Shoshone;, and a very outgoing and confident boy, Buzz. Each of them required different tactics. The cheerful attitude, strangers giving treats worked like a charm for Sam, but Shoshone had such terrible fear of everything when we got her, she would curl herself into a frozen ball, wouldn't look at me, wouldn't take a treat, etc. We had to go oh so slowly with her. Every time I pushed too hard, she took dramatic steps backward.

 

Buzz, now, he needed to be taught some restraint. Not everyone he sees wants to be his best friend, to his great dismay.

 

It sounds like you're doing really well with your new guy. Watch for signs of stress, (Calming Signals, byt Turid Rugass - you can get it at Dogwise.com) is a great, easy to read book about doggy body language) and he'll let you know if you're asking too much of him.

 

However it seems appropriate, do expose him to a variety of different people and situations.

 

Thank you for taking him and caring so much - you'll have a wonderful time! Best of luck, and please let us know how you get on,

 

Ruth n the BC3

[bc4pack]

There is a difference between 'comfort' and strengthening or intensifying fear. Basically you do what works for your

dog to calm/relax/ ease fear... for some it can be soothing language, for some gentle massage etc etc

Yes, folks can make things worse... it is usually through owner's behavior making a HUGE, stressful,manic deal out of something a dog is scared of. As in 'OMG, Mom's anxiety is OFF the chart! I REALLY ought to be scared!'

 

 

If you really would like to get your head around how to help a shy/ fearful dog, you can always join the

Yahoogroup Shy-k9s.

[HighDesertSpice]

Keep in mind that at that young age, dogs go through fear stages. So, new owner, not well socialized and stages. I like to let my dog process whatever they're reacting to and give them lots of time to inspect or investigate. Food works well to counter condition them too depending on what you're dealing with. You can help by remaining calm even they are not.