Lizmo Posted October 2, 2009 Report Share Posted October 2, 2009 On another board a member was saying that Aussie and Border Collie pups, from about 11 weeks to 7 months, are 'holy terrors'. Do you consider Border Collie pups to be holy terrors? I've only been around a few Border Collie pups, but I never considered them a holy terror. I know they usually go through a 'lost your brain' stage, Blaze did. But I never considered him to be a holy terror when he was pup and I enjoyed his puppyhood alot - we learned alot and had tons of fun together. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WildFlower Posted October 2, 2009 Report Share Posted October 2, 2009 No, I do not think that are any worse than any other puppy. Daisy was my first BC pup - that was truly mine. I grew up with our "family" dog that was a BC. And I am soon to be embarking on my second pup. I'll let you know how he is! I have no experience with non-BC dogs, however.... What did these people say that caused the pups to be labeled as "holy terrors"? What were they doing? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lewie'sMom Posted October 2, 2009 Report Share Posted October 2, 2009 Well, Lewie was by far the worst puppy I'd ever had; very naughty and stubborn. But, suffice it to say, now he is in the top two best dogs E-V-E-R! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
juliepoudrier Posted October 2, 2009 Report Share Posted October 2, 2009 Any puppy of any breed can be a holy terror. Probably most puppies go through a holy terror stage of one sort or another. How much of a holy terror any particular pup is likely depends on the dog savviness of its owner. J. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Conner22 Posted October 2, 2009 Report Share Posted October 2, 2009 The BC pups I've had are TECHNICALLY terrors by my friends, or a person with kids, as they would chew stuff up, rearrange shoes, and a million other things they did for fun (someone chewed off chunks of my hair in my sleep once). It never bothered me, I found it charming, and I knew they'd outgrow it, or it was just part of who they were. So according to me they weren't terrors, but I can say without a doubt, if they lived at some of my friends houses, they'd be rehomed and called "too difficult to handle". lol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shetlander Posted October 2, 2009 Report Share Posted October 2, 2009 Any puppy of any breed can be a holy terror. Probably most puppies go through a holy terror stage of one sort or another. How much of a holy terror any particular pup is likely depends on the dog savviness of its owner. Agreed. Quinn was by far the worst little puppy I've ever owned (other than housebreaking which was his saving grace). However, I've known other Border Collie puppies that were angels. And when he turned 6 months, Quinn became by far the best older puppy I've ever owned. He is a super fun, good boy as an adult dog. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tranquilis Posted October 2, 2009 Report Share Posted October 2, 2009 Do you consider Border Collie pups to be holy terrors? I suspect it depends a lot on your expectations and mindset... One person's 'holy terror' is another's 'normal puppy.' Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Laurelin Posted October 2, 2009 Report Share Posted October 2, 2009 I suspect it depends a lot on your expectations and mindset... One person's 'holy terror' is another's 'normal puppy.' I was going to say that too. My (non bc) dog Beau has been described by some of my less dog savvy friends as a terror (I think insane/crazy was their word actually). I find him to be delightful and very easy to live with. To me he is one of the easiest dogs I've ever owned. *shrug* Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoloRiver Posted October 2, 2009 Report Share Posted October 2, 2009 Jett was an angel. That said, I do think that someone who is going to have trouble with a puppy would tend to have more trouble with a Border Collie than some other breeds because they are fast, strong, easily bored, and smart enough to get into the kinds of trouble that dumber dogs wouldn't. My guess is that those of us who didn't think our Border Collies were difficult puppies are not representative of the average pet owner. I don't consider my dogs particularly difficult, but my husband had a Lab before he met me, and compared to that Lab he says my dogs are very high maintenance. For example, the Lab never got bored and was always happy to just hang out (I think she was a particularly mellow Lab). My dogs do get bored, and need to be much more actively included in activities to enjoy them than the average dog, who is happy just going with the flow, might. I've also known serious dog people (like into dog sports etc.) who have other breeds and vow they would never want to live with a Border Collie. And these are smart people, so there must be something somewhat different about Border Collies. I wouldn't know -- the only other breeds I've had were toy breeds (Pomeranian and Papillon) and they were so different that I have a hard time comparing them to Border Collies. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
esox Posted October 2, 2009 Report Share Posted October 2, 2009 I've only had the experience of one BC. She wasn't a holy terror. Yes she had her days, but then again compared to our Lab she was an angel. He ate a mattress, bedding set, and box springs. Along with several remotes, glasses and my roommates dentures. At 13 months he turned into an ideal dog. Like some of you I also have people thinking I'm nuts for having a BC. Esox Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
timberviewfarm Posted October 2, 2009 Report Share Posted October 2, 2009 Any puppy of any breed can be a holy terror. Probably most puppies go through a holy terror stage of one sort or another. How much of a holy terror any particular pup is likely depends on the dog savviness of its owner. J. Hey hey hey now...I have a holy terror in my house right now and I don't even own her......since I've had her for what like 2 months does that make me a non dog savvy owner??????? And she definately isn't a border colle! My 15 week old border collie pup has better manners than this 6 month old lab! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Laurelin Posted October 2, 2009 Report Share Posted October 2, 2009 My guess is that those of us who didn't think our Border Collies were difficult puppies are not representative of the average pet owner. I don't consider my dogs particularly difficult, but my husband had a Lab before he met me, and compared to that Lab he says my dogs are very high maintenance. For example, the Lab never got bored and was always happy to just hang out (I think she was a particularly mellow Lab). My dogs do get bored, and need to be much more actively included in activities to enjoy them than the average dog, who is happy just going with the flow, might. I think it's funny you say that. After having a lab before and now we've practically inherited another lab puppy (long story), I'd say as pups labs can be real holy terrors. Part of it may be that labs and I just don't tend to see eye to eye. I am so incredibly NOT a retriever person, it's not even funny. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shetlander Posted October 2, 2009 Report Share Posted October 2, 2009 I've also known serious dog people (like into dog sports etc.) who have other breeds and vow they would never want to live with a Border Collie. I was one of those people who frequently swore I'd never get a Border Collie. That was based on two things: 1. Seeing charged up, intense dogs at shows and thinking they were always like that and 2. Hearing all the stories of how Border Collies need 2 hours, 3 hours, X hours of exercise per day. Only after I got to know some lovely Border Collies and talked to their sane owners, did I decide to give the breed a try. There was some culture shock when I first got Quinn, but that was largely due to Quinn falling into the Holy Terror category for the first few months he lived with me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lizmo Posted October 2, 2009 Author Report Share Posted October 2, 2009 Yes she had her days, but then again compared to our Lab she was an angel. He ate a mattress, bedding set, and box springs. Along with several remotes, glasses and my roommates dentures. I feel the same way about our Beagle. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
timberviewfarm Posted October 2, 2009 Report Share Posted October 2, 2009 I think it's funny you say that. After having a lab before and now we've practically inherited another lab puppy (long story), I'd say as pups labs can be real holy terrors. Part of it may be that labs and I just don't tend to see eye to eye. I am so incredibly NOT a retriever person, it's not even funny. The one I am "fostering" never gets the hint....dogs can physically body slam her and she never gets the hint. And OMG they are hard headed..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elegy Posted October 2, 2009 Report Share Posted October 2, 2009 When I decided that I was really going to do it and get a BC puppy, I had so many people tell me I was absolutely nuts. They're horrible to live with. Etc etc. Steve is my first puppy. All my other dogs have come to me as adult dogs (anywhere from 1 year old to 15 years old). I was scared to death. I was 98% certain this puppy was going to eat me alive. He didn't. He is kind of high maintenance I guess, but I enjoy him very much. But in the hands of many of my friends who have dogs but are not "dog people" I can imagine that he would be a nightmare. I've put a lot of time and effort into this dog, but that's why I got him- because I wanted a dog to put time and effort into, with the hopes of having a great companion and capable sports partner when he grows up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DebC Posted October 2, 2009 Report Share Posted October 2, 2009 Maybe my mind has hazed over our time with Bo as a puppy - I mostly remember how fast he picked up on things,like potty training and recall. Looking at him today, and comparing him to Dozer (our new lab mix puppy) - he was (is) an absolute angel compared to this lab/hound mix from the depths of Hades. But I love 'em both, doG help me! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrRipley Posted October 2, 2009 Report Share Posted October 2, 2009 I've also known serious dog people (like into dog sports etc.) who have other breeds and vow they would never want to live with a Border Collie. And these are smart people, so there must be something somewhat different about Border Collies. There is something different... and those people are jealous! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lenajo Posted October 2, 2009 Report Share Posted October 2, 2009 I'm with the anti-retriever crowd. Sheesh, those are awful puppies. Border Collies pups are for the most part, a direct reflection of what is put into them. A rare few have "go" beyond normal limits, but again, it's managable if the owner chooses. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ejano Posted October 2, 2009 Report Share Posted October 2, 2009 I was just thinking the other day that the puppy days were so fleeting....I'll probably never have another pup and I"m already nostalgic for those chubby little bodies and puppy breath. Now that mine are six months, they're more fun to interact with and teach, but they act all grown up. They never got into the habit of barking so its quiet around the house unless Ladybug gets them started. The only real ruckus is when the cat starts something... With two pups the same age and littermates, I expected a great deal more confusion than I actually had. They're really very easy going and have given me a great deal less to complain about than friends who have raised other breeds of puppies. I do use a crate -- they're set up about three feet from my desk and snoozing right now. Now that they're six months, I'm gradually giving them a little freedom -- I"ll let one out of the crate to wander in the kitchen and the hallway while I'm working. Yesterday, Brodie just went back in his crate for his afternoon snooze with the door open. We take frequent play and training breaks throughout the day. We have an organized, peaceable kingdom. Now, when "Squeaky Toy" (my husband) comes home, the world gets turned upside down! . They're turned loose for the evening and he doesn't watch them as carefully as I do and if I'm in the kitchen and he's in the TV room, I guarantee he's snoozing and they're up to something. , but nothing more or less than any other puppy that is given the chance to get into trouble. They're getting very clever...I'm teaching way too many classes at the moment and am in the study a great deal. Robin came in last night and spent the better part of a half hour stealthily removing all of the toys and bones from Brodie's crate and putting them in his. It was hilarious! Last week he dedicated himself to chewing every cord he could find - thank fully none of them were plugged in, but again, he wasn't being supervised or directed to a more interesting chewy. Perhaps the reputation for difficulty that follows the BCs is because people don't give enough respect to their energy and intelligence and provide appropriate outlets for both -- of course, they'll have a problem dog if they don't. Also, I think the amount of time they're around people helps a great deal. I was very proud of Robin yesterday on our outing. He handled an unfamiliar place that was crowded and full of people he didn't know and an elevator with equanimity! Liz Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
geonni banner Posted October 2, 2009 Report Share Posted October 2, 2009 When I decided that I was really going to do it and get a BC puppy, I had so many people tell me I was absolutely nuts. They're horrible to live with. Etc etc. Steve is my first puppy. All my other dogs have come to me as adult dogs (anywhere from 1 year old to 15 years old). I was scared to death. I was 98% certain this puppy was going to eat me alive. He didn't. He is kind of high maintenance I guess, but I enjoy him very much. But in the hands of many of my friends who have dogs but are not "dog people" I can imagine that he would be a nightmare. I've put a lot of time and effort into this dog, but that's why I got him- because I wanted a dog to put time and effort into, with the hopes of having a great companion and capable sports partner when he grows up. Hear, Hear! I have my first BC, a youngster that I rescued from a "rescue group" that kept her and her siblings in a concrete pen from the time they got them to the age of 6 mos. (when I adopted Sugarfoot) She had Kennel cough, giardia, a heavy parasite load, protruding ribs and yes, "issues." Many people think she's nuts, and ask me why I got her. I don't find her to be a holy terror - just in need of guidance, patience and understanding. She has learned more in the 9 mos I've had her than most of my dogs did in their whole puppyhood. She went for being terrified of anything that moved, (espescially men) to walking calmly on a busy street in that time, and she is beginning to greet strangers calmly. If a girl with this kind of history isn't a "holy terror" how bad can a happy, well-socialized BC pup be? She learned to heel in three lessons, her recall is good and she already has a 35 word vocabulary. Yes, she active, reactive and suspicious of some things. But she plays hard, works hard and is a bottomless well of affection. What more could I want? BCs rock! Pups included! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lenajo Posted October 2, 2009 Report Share Posted October 2, 2009 I just caught that you asked about Aussie pups too. I have to say that of the 2 breeds, I'd much rather raise a collie pup. My young Aussie is almost 3 and is driving me nuts some days still, and I'd definately forgotten during the decade off the breed how aggravating it to raise a pup with such inconsistancies of drive and focus. Sheesh.... is that breed screwed up! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ooky Posted October 2, 2009 Report Share Posted October 2, 2009 I just caught that you asked about Aussie pups too. I have to say that of the 2 breeds, I'd much rather raise a collie pup. My young Aussie is almost 3 and is driving me nuts some days still, and I'd definately forgotten during the decade off the breed how aggravating it to raise a pup with such inconsistancies of drive and focus. Sheesh.... is that breed screwed up! You know, people in my office, who range from dog people to non-dog people, have now seen first hand a collie pup and an aussie pup, and how they've changed as they grew up. I get a lot of whispered comments, "Odin was NEVER like that." She (the Aussie, who I think is pretty cute and has a wonderful personality although maybe not so bright) is pretty bouncy and blockheaded. I remind them that Odin does have a good 10 months maturity on her, but they tend to look at me like I'm not getting their point -- which I do, but I don't think they should hold all puppies up to Odin standard That being said, he did take more supervision and structured 1-on-1 time to not get into trouble than I remember any of our puppies needing when I was a kid. Since I wanted a play-training-activity partner, I thought it was perfect anyway. His adolescence imo was tough sometimes, but much better than most lab/golden adolescences I've seen. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tranquilis Posted October 2, 2009 Report Share Posted October 2, 2009 I'm with the anti-retriever crowd. Sheesh, those are awful puppies.I've had GSP and English Setter pups. No problems at all; Really quite manageable. If you know what to expect, you can generally be a step ahead of them, and that's all it takes. I suspect that's the same for any breed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
desertranger Posted October 2, 2009 Report Share Posted October 2, 2009 Let's just say that they go through the terrible twos or become teenagers at about 6-7mos. I usually lasts until a year or so. They seem to forget what they learned or become stubborn and want to test themselves. Just gotta work through it gently keep at the basics. They'll come around eventually. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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