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Lenajo's Achievements


Newbie (1/14)

  1. The local rescue I help some with has 3, 1/2 Border collie, 1/4 Kelpie, 1/4 Heeler pup for adoptions This was a known, purposely made cross out of a Border Collie who works cattle out of a Kelpie/Heeler female. The breeder sold a few of the pups and became overwhelmed/couldn't sell them so he took them to rescue. The pups are 9ish weeks old, dewormed and on there second set of shots They have not been neglected physically but could use some more socialization. The dam of the litter has been spayed and the sire has died, so adopters would not be contributing to furthering the irresponsiblity of this breeder. contact me privately at wendy _ roller at earthlink dot net (take out the spaces and correct for email - spam is driving me nuts right now) the rescue would be glad to take photos or provide more info. Spay and neuter contracts are required and enforced. Thanks, Wendy (western TN)
  2. if you access I'd post a note on the local agility lists to help in your search. They almost always know of someone. It's a little far for you but I've used a great one in Memphis.
  3. Did one free token do it for you? This was pay-for-view weekend viewing on Hughes net.
  4. I would say over 6, but thats a guess. My next question is why in dogs name someone would want to keep that on the farm? Thats a self propelled bowling ball attached to a testosterone motor.
  5. So you would recommend and emergency fit in appointment then, or an ER visit at first symptoms? Curious, because my Mom dealt with Lucy first, and she called the local vet and they said "oh, its ok, bring her in tomorrow if she doesn't get over it". Then we used the homeopathic vet and didn't need even that. I would be careful with the emphasis on any. There are many vets who don't agree with how to treat this, or how to treat owners - it's the art of medicine as much of the science of it. Doesn't make them wrong, or you wrong, but it doesn't make anyone right either. I personally wouldn't want to be treated to the "you're dime, you're call" attitude if my dog had this - implying it was money for the utmost care...or else well..it's you're dime. Does that really sound as callus as it feels reading it here? And if you define firm diagnosis by legal charting, then that's not right either. I've seen this diagnosis on charts many times over, with no MRI. On both humans and dogs. otc (over the counter) med and animal husbandry...when does that stop and vet care begin? Internet? vet? cash register? anyway, hope the dog is better soon
  6. just went through this with a 13 year old, and she recovered mostly within about a day, fully within a week, on homeopathic medications. She's very arthritic too. My friend is dealing with this in 14 year old, and dramamine is helping considerably. Thank goodness she had more sense than her vet, who apparently didn't feel trying a cheap and easy solution was worth it. Boggles the mind. I wouldn't personally do a MRI on a 14 year old dog even if I could. What would I do with what I found? Brain surgery? on the dog equivalent of an 80 year old? I see this all the time in human medicine, and the entitlement syndrome that comes from having a cheap/paid for care sometimes means creating more suffering, not less. You have to use judgement and wield power with responsibility towards the patient. And if what you are looking for has no fix beyond what you are doing already (comfort, symptom control) then why put them through it? Good luck with getting her stabilized. Lucy sends her sympathies for what she called the "eeew pukies" disease LOL
  7. wholesale meat supplier (supplies restaurants and zoos mostly) or from Oma's Pride. Most meat counters can order them for you by the case. Speak to the manager. I don't even mention dog, it's not of their business and for some reason make them rather nervous about you until they get to know you better. Turkey necks are common in southern cooking and in gourmet cooking (for stock in particular) so a request is not that bizarre. Look for grocers that carry all parts - pigs feets, necks, turkey wings etc. They are your best bet.
  8. Ooky if the litter was *extraordinary* then certainly it would be of value to repeat. There are some crosses, though not the norm by far, that even an "average" pup of that genetic combination is going to have a significant chance to be better than normal as worker. Maybe not the same as the other pups, but still better than average in overall usefullness. However...if that were the case...would you be selling all of that second litter to sport homes? or considering doing a cross where that was the only serious interest and even you didn't want one? I think not. A good first working cross, is likely to have repeat customers. So again..you would be selling some work, some pet/sport as you were before at the least. The evaluation of that cross as a worker is likely to go up with that plan, rather than down. the 50/50 parental influence sounds very correct, but my experience (however minimal) and the experience of breeders I've worked with (long term, many good working dogs produced) says not. I've seen second litters who were totally unlike the first - so much so that you could only say "huh?"It may be because the BC has such a low inbreeding coefficient. When you do a total outcrosses the genetic variability can be huge. A breeder friend who's degree is in cattle reproduction/genetics has applied his learning to dogs and tells me that littermates can be as little as 18% similar within the same litter. There are simply so many genetic variations within the dog. I never challenged his information at the time, and would welcome more information on it. I simply took it at face value because he has the litters, and the results, to prove what he was saying. Regarding the novice herding puppy owner coming back willingly to prove the pup - I applaud and welcome the effort, but I also recognize the limitations regarding that dog's potential as being a barometer for the success of the litter.
  9. I may have missed it in the length of the thread, but exactly how long are we talking about sending sport pups back to the breeder for evaluation? let me make everyone mad now.... I can't even see 90 days of daily work providing the information I would want. I've seen a lot of 90 day wonders - got all the skills under good hands- but who knows how they respond under pressure or work and/or age? That is how about at the finals of a big event, or when a lambing ewe you need to help truly wants them dead? How do they handle the heat when you _have_ to deworm or move sheep and its over 90? Can they rate themselves back when the work is long and slow, but amp it up with its fast and hot? Do they listen during the latter? These sorts of things can't be replicated, takes years/miles to see, and they do provide information that is invaluable to what breedable qualities are in the dog. Insisting sport/pet pups back to "evaluate" makes me think more and more about a working version of ack titling. What do you think you are going to "certify" to yourself in a limited evaluation? And unless you take the dog away from the sport/novice herding home for many many months you aren't going to see it. If you are breeding for yourself as most good breeders are, that's one pup to prove out for potential breeding. If you get a few others in working homes that do right by the dog and you get further information that's wonderful. But don't knock a good pet/sport home because they want a pup, or hold them hostage to evaluation standards they can't meet without doing backflips to your requests. That's just another version of ack co-ownership. Either keep the pup and prove it, or pick a good home and as long as that homes remains to that standard, let. it. go. If you think the novice home can and wants to prepare the dog to the level for evaluation, but it will take a really long time due to inexperience/travel issue, then you do have the option with a male pup to collect semen before it is neutered, and then *if* it is a dog you see you truly needed for the genepool 10+ years later you can use it. No options like this for females unfortunately, perhaps that will change in the future. Of course the collection and freezing costs money that may never return to you, but it is a way to save your genetics to watch the entire career of a dog who may not be trained at the speed or thoroughness you desire young because it is in a novice herding home that is learning with it. I don't see the absolute need for a agility people to have pups at 8 weeks however. I see more pups messed up by some of the modern puppy for that training than anything else. They have just as many wash-outs as herding trainers, but I daresay more to injury because they can't seem to let a dog mature before they run it's legs and mind off. It's just not know as a washout, but a "placement in a more suitable home". Sounds much nicer that way. In regards to repeating the litter for sport homes after the first litter proved to produce good workers as well as good sport dogs. I would not, *unless* I wanted a puppy for myself. I simply don't see the necessity of the expense (the whelping and raising) and the risk to my btch simply for what amounts to a want of $$ And no one has considered that repeat litters are often totally different than the prior. You often get different temperaments, different health issues, etc etc. Semen is an allergen, and you get your greatest genetic variation in the first cross and then the btch will respond against what her body already knows (this per Dr Boyd and other expert breeders, and I am generalizing what I'm sure can be explained more clearly by scientists). A cross that repeats well is gold and rare, but just because it repeats doesn't mean you will get the *same* stuff each time. The average is good on the golden crosses, that's all.
  10. Knowledge is useful, but I doubt you could argue that there have been quite a few influential dogs in this breed that nobody can remember a bit about any littermates, nor was knowledge of the littermates used in breeding on further great dogs. Now back to you Mark - if you had a chance to breed your btch to a great dog who epitomized what you wanted in proven working skill in itself and it's direct parentage, yet you knew next to nothing about the littermates of either generation, would you use that dog...or would you search out a perhaps slightly lesser dog who you had more breadth of pedigree knowledge? What means more (and yes, you often must choose, though it's usually not so black and white...so bear with me for the sake of conversation) Basically I am asking then, would you use Wiston Cap, or ?? really good working dog who you knew more about the littermates? Oh he had a lot of littermates, but few were heard from later. To further expand on the conversation - if we want more knowledge of a cross then repeat breedings are great? But are % numbers enough? If you've got 40 pups from a cross and half were really good, is it equal to 1 litter of 10 (numbers exaggerated for clarity) where 5 pups were really good? Do we reward the 50% of the conservative 1 litter breeder, or the 50% of a more excessive one? I still think well homed pets are fine. It's what you do with the pups you want to breed that counts.
  11. In a general review of the history, many great dogs have come from litters that had many members never accounted for beyond their initial (prior to weaning) existence. Who here has seen any littermates to Wiston Cap in a pedigree? how about Mcknight's Gael? Wisp? Dryden Joe? Henderson's Sweep? Some intense pedigree followers may have, but I daresay many a good producer of working collies would have to go look and search a bit to find out. They simply wouldn't have caught these dogs on their radar because *they based their breeding on the dogs that were proven* instead of missing and unproven littermates or siblings. Oh yes, there are a few non-proven breeders in there - but they were not the norm. And that is the way it has always been. Breed the best to the best, keep what you like and train it, and if you like it, rinse and repeat. Full knowledge of a litter's abilities is nice, but it doesn't mean the one you keep is going to breed any better, or any healthier, than the one off the farm with not a littermate to be found. At least not in the areas that count..... I don't have a problem seeing well bred pups in well selected pet homes, provided that what is bred on are those that are working proven. The argument against the idea reminds me of the truth that great handlers and trainers often picked their stars by keeping the puppy that was left after the others were picked. And oddly, that pup...always seems to be the nicest once when comparisons are made.
  12. My Opa spoke no English and I no German. We did well with our own form of sign language, and as key words were learned, we had about a elaborate of conversation as a kid and grandpa could have. I've noticed that many people use the same gestures and conversational non-verbal cues when communicating with family members who have had strokes. I have pretty good success with even non-family members (there is an advantage to knowing the person before they didn't speak) - probably because of my Opa. I love LizP's information about primate sound cues. I think humans have more of these than we would admit at times. The universal AAAAHHHHHHT is definitely one.
  13. Usually start seeing signs around at 10. Ben was so good at covering it most of the time, that I considered some of his flank refusals at that age to be selective deafness. That doG I decided to baer test rather than chastise him, because I found out he was down to less than 20% in one ear, about 40% in the other. He got a big hug and we were cutting back on trialing due to life changes anyway...so retirement it was. He's now totally deaf at almost 13 and responds to hand signals. Away from home he is leashed unless it is a safe area where he has full view of me.
  14. I think your point of reference for "too cold" is far lower than mine Just the few weeks I dealt with moderate ice and snow last year has me quite convinced I've gone far enough north.
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