SoloRiver Posted August 30, 2009 Report Share Posted August 30, 2009 Jett is home from nine weeks of herding school. She's sacked out on the floor by my feet like she never left, but I know she has a rebuilt engine under the hood because (1) I worked her a bit today and (2) she has thighs the size honey-baked hams. Greyhounds are jealous of the size of her hams. Anyway, I've had a dog I tried to start and screwed up (Solo), and a dog who was nearly finished when I got her and ready to trial, with everything but a shed and a look-back (Fly). Now I have a baby dog (Jett will be two in October) with a great start on her and fabulous natural ability. My question is, how do I avoid screwing her up? I've gotten great advice and a road map from Jett's trainer, but I would be interested in hearing from you guys. Are there common temptations that I should resist? Typical pitfalls I should avoid? I feel like she's at a place right now where the sky's the limit but I could also mess her up through my personal ineptitude and that would be very, very sad. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rebecca, Irena Farm Posted August 30, 2009 Report Share Posted August 30, 2009 Don't second guess yourself. If you don't like it, don't hesitate to do something about it. When in doubt, go back a step. And keep talking to your trainer of course! You'll do fine, just have fun with her! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeltaBluez Tess Posted August 30, 2009 Report Share Posted August 30, 2009 Go easy and slow. One step at a time. Get to know each other on stock. And follow Karen's advice and give her feedback so she can adjust your lesson plan. Welcome home to Jett!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hsnrs Posted August 31, 2009 Report Share Posted August 31, 2009 Great question as we are struggling with the same thing with a older dog. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
havenjm Posted September 10, 2009 Report Share Posted September 10, 2009 Jett is home from nine weeks of herding school. She's sacked out on the floor by my feet like she never left, but I know she has a rebuilt engine under the hood because (1) I worked her a bit today and (2) she has thighs the size honey-baked hams. Greyhounds are jealous of the size of her hams. Anyway, I've had a dog I tried to start and screwed up (Solo), and a dog who was nearly finished when I got her and ready to trial, with everything but a shed and a look-back (Fly). Now I have a baby dog (Jett will be two in October) with a great start on her and fabulous natural ability. My question is, how do I avoid screwing her up? I've gotten great advice and a road map from Jett's trainer, but I would be interested in hearing from you guys. Are there common temptations that I should resist? Typical pitfalls I should avoid? I feel like she's at a place right now where the sky's the limit but I could also mess her up through my personal ineptitude and that would be very, very sad. I think the most important thing in training is to remember that if something isn't working, do something else. I've seen trainers, some good ones, get into trouble because they get pigeon holed into a method. If you've trained more than one dog you'll know that different dogs have different needs and see things differently. If you try something a couple of times and things aren't working, don't keep trying the same thing with more intensity because it worked on your other dog(s) or because that's what your trainer told you to do. If your dog isn't seeing what you want her to, show it to her in a different way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
workindogs Posted September 10, 2009 Report Share Posted September 10, 2009 Ok, so you know I'm biased.....you're doing a great job! I'll keep it simple and short....3 things. 1) Keep a clock on it....set your clock 7 min? 10 min? Set your clock. I mean literally....on you wrist. Overtraining can sour a young dog...their brains don't have the stamina of an older experienced dog. 2) End on a good note....train fresh, just when things are going great...stop. You'll be tempted to do that neat thing again.....don't!! Stop there on that super great note. It's her last memory...she'll think about it. If for some unfortunate reason you have a bad experience....help the heck out of her and make the last experience before quiting a good one (even if it's baby stuff)...then quit immediately. 3) Go take a few more lessons from Karen before the weather gets bad. She looks great....you might be right...you might have the best one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smokjbc Posted September 10, 2009 Report Share Posted September 10, 2009 Oh but it's sooo hard to put the youngsters up- but definitely agree! My Jet is the same age as your Jett (she turns 2 this month) and she's just really cool and I found that the first 10-15 minutes she listens, she learns and she's just fun. But when she stops paying attention, I have been trying hard to quit her before she gets to that point because I realize it's because she's hot, not because she is being disobedient. It took several "duh!" moments to get to that point- and don't believe anyone that says you got to work it out of them, because I've found the opposite is true- hot dogs are not able to use all their brain! My old dog is getting alot of work lately so that I have something to do between Jet's break LOL. Now I've suddenly got unexpected time on my hands (laid off - this town is really going down the toilet) I can get out to my sheep 5 -6 times a week and it's a lot easier to let that time go knowing it won't be 3 days before I get to work her again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMSBORDERCOLLIES Posted September 10, 2009 Report Share Posted September 10, 2009 Oh but it's sooo hard to put the youngsters up- but definitely agree! My Jet is the same age as your Jett (she turns 2 this month) and she's just really cool and I found that the first 10-15 minutes she listens, she learns and she's just fun. But when she stops paying attention, I have been trying hard to quit her before she gets to that point because I realize it's because she's hot, not because she is being disobedient. It took several "duh!" moments to get to that point- and don't believe anyone that says you got to work it out of them, because I've found the opposite is true- hot dogs are not able to use all their brain! My old dog is getting alot of work lately so that I have something to do between Jet's break LOL. Now I've suddenly got unexpected time on my hands (laid off - this town is really going down the toilet) I can get out to my sheep 5 -6 times a week and it's a lot easier to let that time go knowing it won't be 3 days before I get to work her again. Elizabeth has given you some great advice and I'll just add one more thing. They don't stop listening because they're hot. They stop listening because they are overtrained and mentally fatiqued. It's not the physical part that's fried, it's the brain so like Elizabeth said quit on a good note (nice little gather that's easy for her) and quit when she's still relatively fresh. Keep your expectations reasonable and remember that it's the baby steps each day that count, not the light bulb all of a sudden! Also, remember that your dog has now been started but YOU need to keep on learning so you can help. If Karen is helping, keed in touch and ask the questions of your learned friends if you're running into difficulty. Keep the knowledge base growing. We never stop learning in this way of life and, if we do, we go backwards. I learn something every time I watch a trial or run in one. If I don't, I know I'm missing an opportunity to learn. Bob Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amelia Posted September 11, 2009 Report Share Posted September 11, 2009 Hi Melaine. Here's what I do: I never blame the dog, and when there's a problem, I always ask my self; "what am I doing to cause this?" After you ask yourself that question, if you choose to, pick up the phone, call Karen and ask her. The Real Time Canine is written for folks just like you and you can give it a 3-month read together with all the archives for $10. It's my weekly blog (via email every Sunday) about raising and training a border collie from 3 months, when I got him, to the present. He's exactly 1 year old, and I just entered him into his first nursery the end of December. Cheers and best wishes for you and Jett Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill Orr Posted September 12, 2009 Report Share Posted September 12, 2009 Great replies. Don't worry.. the dog will know if you do. Be forgiving..on yourself and the dog. They are much better at this than we are. Have fun solving herding problems..not just training, the dogs again know the difference. Be on the out look for needless baggage.. but don't let the dog cheat either, depends on the dog. Keep reaching. Hope we can keep up with you.. Bill and the boys Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
btrent Posted September 12, 2009 Report Share Posted September 12, 2009 From a completely novice perspective, I was waiting to see what others would say. But if it were me I would schedule as many regular lessons with your trainer as you possibly can manage or afford, after the spay thing is a non-issue. There is a great feeling of satisfaction of getting something out of a lesson, going back and working on it yourself for a while and then returning to the trainer with new questions and an advancement of skills. Of course just when you think you know what you need to work on in a lesson, you start to work your dog in front of your trainer, and (a) that thing is a non-issue and ( something else crops up that you hadn't considered! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMSBORDERCOLLIES Posted September 12, 2009 Report Share Posted September 12, 2009 From a completely novice perspective, I was waiting to see what others would say. But if it were me I would schedule as many regular lessons with your trainer as you possibly can manage or afford, after the spay thing is a non-issue. There is a great feeling of satisfaction of getting something out of a lesson, going back and working on it yourself for a while and then returning to the trainer with new questions and an advancement of skills. Of course just when you think you know what you need to work on in a lesson, you start to work your dog in front of your trainer, and (a) that thing is a non-issue and ( something else crops up that you hadn't considered! There is nothing like going to a big, challenging trial and watching the Open Hands run their dogs and get into your own brain and try to figure out what it is they are doing to be able to accomplish what they do on the trial field. Works the same at home too. Watch your dog and try to "read" him and understand what it is he is telling you as he does his thing. The communication between dog and handler is not one way. It is a very important two way conversation and you can't really help him until you learn to speak his language. He talks to you in many ways and most are very subtle but they are there and you need to understand them. I used to, and still do, watch and watch all day long at the Open trials waiting to see how each of the top handlers get around the course and, at times, make it look so easy and after quite a few years I was able to pick out those little intricasies that each of the teams had going and started trying to use some of them myself. I don't want to be a clone of any handler but I would like to be able to use those points that I feel suit my dog and myself to become a better handler and trainer. I feel that I got more out of doing this than I could have going to some clinics and I am not knocking clinics when I say this. At the time that I started in this way of life, I was working long hours and didn't have the time for clinics but I feel that I learned more by having to figure out what the top handlers were doing than if I had been told at a clinic. Bob Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
red russel Posted September 12, 2009 Report Share Posted September 12, 2009 speaking of which... I'm out at Meeker and wish you and Nancy were here! Hope things are well. Dave Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMSBORDERCOLLIES Posted September 12, 2009 Report Share Posted September 12, 2009 speaking of which... I'm out at Meeker and wish you and Nancy were here! Hope things are well. Dave Hi Dave. Wish we were there. Nancy wasn't well enough to travel for two days and we didn't want to jeopardise our trip to the Nationals so we cancelled out this year. First time we missed Meeker since we started going quite a while ago. Looks like the sheep are tough again and Tommy and Bill and a few others are still in their normal places. We are following the scores on the web site and they have been very good at posting them. Ellen Nieslanick is such a great organizer and keeps everything so efficient. Say hi to her for us and, hopefully, will see you at the Nationals in a couple of weeks or less. Bob Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeltaBluez Tess Posted September 12, 2009 Report Share Posted September 12, 2009 Bob, We look forward to seeing you at the Finals. Hope Nancy feels better soon. We sure have missed seeing you folks down here. Tess will be watching from the sidelines while Nan, Roo, Lucy and Sleat run. As well as her pups/grandpups owned by other people, Kate, Koko, Pete and Kirby. Three generations of Tess (Tess, Roo, Koko, Pete, Lucy and Kirby) have all qualified this year for the Finals. Not bad for a $100 dog!! And a Canadian dog, to boot! Diane Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C Crocker Posted September 12, 2009 Report Share Posted September 12, 2009 Bob, We look forward to seeing you at the Finals. Hope Nancy feels better soon. We sure have missed seeing you folks down here. Tess will be watching from the sidelines while Nan, Roo, Lucy and Sleat run. As well as her pups/grandpups owned by other people, Kate, Koko, Pete and Kirby. Three generations of Tess (Tess, Roo, Koko, Pete, Lucy and Kirby) have all qualified this year for the Finals. Not bad for a $100 dog!! And a Canadian dog, to boot! Diane Diane, I would say it was $100 well spent!! Carolyn Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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