Death and Anguish...

[afrancis]

As someone who has always been freaked out by death -- dead animals by the side of the road really upset me, animals in pain or anguish and their stories haunt me, and anything that is injured I have to save and take in -- I am wondering whether it is genetic, childhood exposure or something else that makes some people more or less immune to death and suffering. My DH and I were just talking about it because we are identical in this regard; just got back today from taking a female sparrow to a wildlife care place after I noticed it in the backyard on the ground. And he works at a building that is all glass and every summer there are poor injured birds outside of it who have flown into the glass, and every time he finds one he hops into his car and takes them in (nearly an hour drive, there and back, AWOL).

Probably everyone here who admits to scanning the Rescue pages just to "look" can relate to this...

Does one have to have grown up on a farm where animals are born and then slaughtered regularly to not be affected so deeply by death? Or can farm-people also be wimps?

Ailsa

[kajarrel]

I'm not sure what you mean by "being affected deeply." I worked 11 years as a nurse, in neonatal intensive care, acute pediatric rehab and adult ICU. I saw death regularly (after never having attended a funeral as a child). Now we raise lambs for slaughter. I'm definately not "unaffected." If I was, I think that would be a problem. Instead, I see death as a part of life. And understand that I can (often) make a difference in HOW something dies, even if I can't prevent it from dying (all things die, after all).

 

So, we (my husband and I) opt to know how our animals, that we eat, live and die, rather than buying them in packages. And, I know that, although I am no longer a nurse and didn't keep every patient, friend, etc. that I cared for before death from dying, I made the experience more meaningful or comfortable for those who were dying and their family members.

 

Kim

[afrancis]

I'm not sure what you mean by "being affected deeply." I worked 11 years as a nurse, in neonatal intensive care, acute pediatric rehab and adult ICU. I saw death regularly (after never having attended a funeral as a child). Now we raise lambs for slaughter. I'm definately not "unaffected." If I was, I think that would be a problem. Instead, I see death as a part of life. And understand that I can (often) make a difference in HOW something dies, even if I can't prevent it from dying (all things die, after all). So, we opt to know how our animals, that we eat, live and die, rather than buying them in packages. And, I although I am no longer a nurse, know that, although I didn't keep every patient, friend, etc. that I cared for in death from dying, I made the experience more meaningful or comfortable for those who were dying and their family members.

 

Kim

 

Now you see I applaud you Kim and others like you who are part of this process, both for humans and animals. It seems that you have been able to access that part of yourself that says, "This is the job, this is my role, this is what I need to do to make it happen humanely for those involved." I, on the other hand, couldn't even change my DH's dressing when he broke his arm nor could I eat for a week after my first dog died. Is there a missing chromosome?

Ailsa

[vickim]

I grew up on a dairy farm. There were cows, a dog or two and too many cats to count. Lots of cats died in fights, misadventures with farm machinery, and many ended up as roadkill. I knew the facts of survival on the farm--survival of the fittest, yet I mourned the cats that liked to soak up the heat of the road and sleep there and ended up dead.

 

On a yet more personal level: I was given a calf to raise as my own every few years. I fed her, raised her, fussed over her and when she came into heat, she was bred and sold. After my parents took their cut for providing food, the rest was mine. The last calf I had was barren. She just would not get pregnant. My parents gave me a choice: I could send her up to the town barns and sell her as beef (meaning a stranger would eat her) since we could not sell her as a dairy cow. Or my parents would buy her from me at the current rate that beef cattle were selling (meaning that we would eat her). I was around 12 years old; this cow was more a pet than anything else. I could not stand the thought of eating my pet. I hated the thought of anyone else eating her. I had to choose between the two, so I chose to send her to the town barns. What bothers me most: I'm not sure that I would make that same choice now. I like a good steak and I know where they come from. I think I'd rather raise my own and know at least the animal was never treated cruelly (as opposed to some of the horrosr stories out of slaughter house that you hear now).

 

That aside--most farmers would tell you not to get attached to livestock.

 

ETA: When driving on the road, I don't feel bad about about the dead racoons, squirrels or deer that I see. I do feel bad about any cats or dogs that I see, though. I guess it depends on the animal whether or not I feel bad.

[Ms.DaisyDuke]

LOL.

I grew up on a farm of sorts. We had chickens, turkeys and rabbits. All for food purposes. From the age of about 4 to 12 we had them. I used to have so much fun playing with the chicks every spring, feeding them gathering eggs ect. all summer long and help with the slaughter every fall. If we had a dog that got into the birds, my dad would "get rid of it" and I understood that we couldn't have a dog that would eat them, it was their job to protect them. What ever meat we eat that wasn't poultry was wild (moose or deer) that my dad would hunt and still does. We used to do all the butchering ourselves and I never batted an eye at the sight of a moose hanging in the garage to drain. (I know, this is kinda graphic...sorry). But I am not heartless, by no means. I understand how the whole thing works, we raise them for food, so we must eat them. When I was 17 I ran over a rabbit and cried my eyes out! My dad laughed at me. , WSPCA commercials make me cry on a regular basis. There is a goldfinger music video that made me uncontrollaby sob within 5 seconds of it being played. These guys are hardcore vegan and the song was about animals in slaughter houses so it was very graphic and nasty. I didn't even know I was crying until my boyfriend asked me if I was ok! I can't stand the thought of animals being abused and I am sure I would try and help any injured animal, wild or domestic, if I could. I was beside my self in anger when I heard the story on the news about the 500+ mallard ducks that died in the oil sands a couple of weeks ago. So, I guess I woud be one of those wimpy farm people?! I guess I found it very easy to draw a line between what should upset me and what shouldn't. For some, finding that balance isn't so easy, but that's ok!

[Mona Howard]

I have sheep to train the dogs. The sale of lambs, both for breeding and slaughter,

pays my property taxes each year. I do not allow on farm slaughter. I get a lump

in my throat when an old favorite ewe goes down the road to make way for a better

replacement. All my sheep have names. If a dog is in my house more than two days

it is a for life pet. If a dog is not the most talented it is not sold off and replaced. I just

have to work harder to get it trained. Maybe it will never be top flight but it will be top

loved. My old Cap dog has been dead almost two years. When I see a dog that is

similar to him I still cry. It's embarrasing but I can't help it. Mona

[mbc1963]

Interesting question! I have a friend who's 33 and absolutely freaked out by anything's death. She (I think) considers me cold and heartless because I will "put down" animals who are beyond help.

 

Once, for example, there was a half-dead bat in a mousetrap at my house. (Bats in my attic. If anyone ever needs bat advice, I'm your girl!) It was January, and it was freezing outside. I didn't want to mercy-kill the bat with a hammer or knife where I'd be exposed to blood (rabies and ickiness) so I devised a strategy in which I bagged up the mousetrap/bat combo, and then drove over it a few times. This did the job and actually made me proud of my problem solving skills. The bat was going to die, one way or the other, and was suffering when I found it, so it seemed to me that dispatching it was the only kind thing to do.

 

Likewise, a bird once flew into my car in such a way that it went under the wheel, and when I looked through the rearview mirror, I could see it half-crushed, in anguish, feebly flapping one of its wings to try to get off the road. I drove back and finished it off.

 

I turn off the empathy part of my brain when I have to do something like this, because the empathy is useless, and will only make me feel horrible. My friend says that she would never go back and drive over the bird, because she'd feel too bad. In her opinion, I'm heartless; in my opinion, she's thinking of her own feelings more than the the pain of the poor animal.

 

Meanwhile, if I saw an animal I thought I could save, I would take it home and nurse it, grow very attached, and cry if it died.

 

Generic dead animals by the side of the road don't upset me too much, unless they're dogs or cats, and I imagine a 9-year-old waiting at home for them.

 

I do tend to look realistically at death (e.g., it happens to all of us!), and maybe that is a piece of it. My sensitive friend hates to think or talk about the fact that she's going to die someday - as if not acknowledging the fact will keep her alive forever.

 

Mary

[lrayburn]

What Mary said!

 

I think a lot of it has to do with perspective. People who grew up/live on farms or in constant interaction don't care any less, but they frequently have a different, perhaps more balanced, perspective. We realize that death is an integral part of life and isn't always a bad, inhumane or tragic thing. If you eat meat, you are complicit in a lot of deaths whether you look the animals in the face or not. On a farm, you look them in the face and understand the ramifications of your actions. When you only buy packaged meat in the grocery store, it's easy to overlook what it took to get the animal there.

 

I am active in rescue and put more time, energy, emotion and effort into the dogs than a lot of people do but I also realize that euthanasia can sometimes be the kindest thing. I stopped to pick up a dog that was running on a busy highway today and took it to the shelter. The woman who was trying unsuccessfully to catch it was almost in tears and asked if the shelter I was taking it to was no kill. I told her it wasn't and why I felt that no kill shelters can be a disservice to animals. If my dogs were going to be in a sterile shelter setting for an indefinitely long period of time, I would rather see them humanely put to sleep (I have seen how dogs deteriorate in the shelter setting over time and am aware of several cases of animal neglect that have occurred in so-called no kill shelters).

 

I also have a different reaction to domestic animals than to wildlife. While I'll stop to move a turtle off the road, I wouldn't go to great lengths to save an injured songbird (unless it was terribly rare or something). I will however make sure that it is comfortable and safe while it recuperates or passes away. (My family members are big fans of the shoe-box technique. Most birds that run into a window will either recover or pass away when placed in a towel-covered shoebox for an hour or two. The ones that recover are released.)

 

In the case of a badly injured wild animal, I would put it down humanely. I struggled for years with my father's ability to put down domestic and wild animals until I realized that he cared enough to take an action that was very upsetting to him because he truly felt it was in the best interest of the animal that he was dealing with. It's not an easy thing for him but sometimes it is necessary and he doesn't shift the uncomfortable responsibility to someone else. So I have been known to fledge the odd orphaned pigeon and I've also been known to put a fatally injured baby bird in a cold place to speed his death as painlessly as possible.

 

I would put a lot more effort into someone's dog or other domesticated animal because they are domesticated. It doesn't mean their lives have more value but domestic animals live under a different set of circumstances than wildlife do and I would treat a domesticated animal the way that I would want someone to treat my pet if it strayed. It doesn't upset me any less to see a wild animal in distress rather than a domestic one but I feel that the partnership that we have with domestic animals requires a different level of responsibility while wild animals live and die by a different set of rules.

 

I think a loss of perspective can result in animals being treated unhumanely even though people start out with good intentions like keeping an animal alive even though it is terminal and struggling or as part of a no kill setting but the animals may have no hope of eventual adoption and living in a more enriched environment, etc.

 

Lisa

[afrancis]

You appear to be wise beyond your years Lisa!

Esp. in regard to no-kill shelters where animals are allowed to languish and develop serious psychological problems as a result of being confined for so long. I also stop for turtles but get annoyed at people who run around screeching when an animal needs help instead of just stepping up to the plate and DOING something.

I applaud you (and many others here) for being actively involved in rescue ... this is also really putting your money where your mouth is.

I am acutely aware that I am one of those people who may not be able to eat meat (or even fish for that matter) if I had to witness or take part in their slaughter. Maybe it was an early exposure to Charlotte's Web that warped me...

Ailsa

P.S. And Mary, I now have a permanent image of you running over a bagged bat over and over again, with this crazed look on your face

[Liz P]

I didn't grow up on a farm, or even have more pets than average while growing up, but I care very deeply and am making a career out of it. I think some people just have a very strong instinct to nuture. For me it's animals. When I was a kid I would try to save everything but was horrified by human babies That's how I ended up in vet school, paying a fortune to go into a profession that doesn't pay very much I wouldn't trade it for anything in the world though.

[BustopherJones]

I remember MANY years ago visiting my grandfather's farm in Tunisia (before the revolution and the expulsion of the French from North Africa). He raised chickens and rabbits for food. When the time came to prepare one for dinner, he would have tears in his eyes, and one could see that he was upset; but he did what had to be done, and did so as quickly and mercifully as possible so that the animal did not suffer. So, no, I don't think that those who live on farms where animals must be killed for food are any less sensitive that those who do not, nor are they desensitized to the death of an animal; but they do what must be done to feed their families, while those of us who exist in urban or suburban settings have the luxury of having someone else prepare our meats.

[Sasha's Mom]

I deal with a lot of death. Much of what I see is either a senseless loss or a long overdue relief. (I'm an ER doc at a major trauma center) Most of the time, the sickest humans I care for can't tell me what's wrong, so I do what we call a "veternary workup." Sometimes it's a young person in a horrible accident, sometimes it's someone's grandma at a nursing home with an overwhelming infection. Sometimes I win, sometimes I don't. The worst ones are when they come in talking to me and then crash.

 

I do know that when it comes time for my dogs, I will do for them what I can't do for some of my patients... whose families refuse to believe that people die, and want "everything done," despite the additional suffering it inflicts.

 

Now do I have the resolve to drive back over a bird I've maimed? That's a darn good question. I've written plenty of orders to "terminally wean" patients in ICUs - to ease the pain and create a calm, pain-free situation as we disconnect breathing machines and let death take over. But I don't know that I could drive back over a bird I'd hit. Or shoot a critically injured dog. (Or actually shoot anything...a hunter I am not, although we have a 20 gauge under the bed. Husband's side.) I wince at the sight of a dog or cat on the side of the road, but it's that thought of a kid missing their pet that gets to me.

 

I did take a very sick foster I'd pulled to be put down. I don't regret pulling her, nor do I regret what solidified in my mind as her best solution only 2 days later. Didn't make it any easier, and I cried for a week. I don't cry much. But I cried over this little dog I'd only had for 2 days. But I handled it a lot better than my tenderhearted husband, who's had nightmares for months.

 

We're thinking about getting some ducks now that we have acreage. Mostly for eggs, but people have asked us about eating them. Not sure about that yet. Maybe if there were dozens, but if there were only 6, that would be weird.

 

Food for thought. Well, just eggs at this point. Oh, and now is the closest I've ever been to a farm - we just moved to "the country."

 

Danielle

[KrisK]

Since I live in an area that is part wilderness, part rural, I often see dead animals on the road....I hate it and it doesn't need to be a domestic animal for me to tear up. The worst is when I've seen a 'family' of animals...usually a raccoon with babies.

If it's at all possible, I will stop to move turtles off the road. Watching a cattle or hog truck heading down the highway has convinced me to become more vegetarian than meat eater.

I have ducks...eggs only for me but if I have a lot more ducks than I can handle, I'll will sell them and what happens after they leave...I try not to think about.

I plan to have a small spinning flock of sheep, so again, no plans to eat them. I will admit that I'm the world's worst would-be farmer

However, I would not hesitate to have an animal put down if it was suffering.....to me that's something different altogether. The real question is whether I could do it myself.

[WyoBC]

I think everyone has a different out look on death and such. I have always been around animals and death (both dogs and people) and I can tell you that it hurts just as bad everytime. If I had the choice to never lose anything or anyone I loved I would, but that's not the case. Sometimes it's best to just do what's best and have them euthanized. I look at death as part of life and I look forward to meeting up with them again some day. It helps take some of the pain away.

[Soda-pop]

This is kind of an interesting thread.

 

I'm a big baby about death. I had to be removed from my aunt's funeral; when I visited my grandmother in the hospital and she was near death I had to be removed from the room... I can't stand the thought of children dying. I hate suffering. I know I'll be wrecked when my dogs or my cat dies, I can't hardly even think about it. But I have all their deaths (if I need to make a decision) planned out.

 

But, I am a huge humane euthanasia advocate. I have put many an animal to sleep who were suffering or bound to suffer. I was in tears at work the other day, running around, desperately trying to find someone, anyone to give me permission to euthanize a cat who had been allowed to linger too long--her time was eminent and I didn't want her suffer any longer. I wept tears or sorrow for her suffering, but tears of joy for her release. I tend to not cry for wildlife, except in the very tragic cases of abuse or something like that, but even then it's more of shame of my fellow humans and for the suffering than for the actual death. I like to think I'm practical about all else and I consider MANY things in this world much worse than death.

 

I think one of the responsibilities we have as domestic animal keepers is to prevent and alleviate suffering in our companions.

 

I do not know, though, if I could raise a farm animal and sell for slaughter. I've never tried. I suppose after the first hump of saying goodbye to the cute lambs or calves my practical side would take over and if I knew I had done a good job in raising them and a found a good plac for them to die, I would be fine.

 

Paige

[in2adventure]

I've worked in rescue for awhile and have been a paramedic or EMT for a REALLY long while. Between working in an ER (a community general type place) and working in the streets, I've seen a lot. Everything from scraping invincable teens off the highway to putting bandades on the invisable cuts of toddlers. The elderly don't bother me as much as they used to. I feel for the families left behind and it bothers me more to see them in the "now what" phase than it does to see the person pass. I know I did the best I could for the person when they were alive and in the end all things pass away. I just try and make it as peacefull as possible.

 

Children and pets bother me the most. The hardest I ever cried was when I lost my last dog, Tika. She was like a child to my family and I can still get sniffly about her. I haven't lost a parent, thank goodness, and I'm sure the reaction will be the same if not worse. It's something I don't want to think about. I can not put a happy, healthy animal to sleep or take it's life while hunting. This is the reason I quit the SPCA and don't hunt anymore. I will cook you the nicest venison roast you ever had (and help you it it ), but I don't want to be the one taking it's life. A very sick or injured beyond repair situation is different. I can guarentee I'll still bawl, but the desision making process is different. I guess I wouldn't make a very good farmer either. The place would run rampant with edible animals and I would still be buying steak at the store

 

Children kill me. They have not lived yet and I want to see them grow old and be 90 before I have to work on them. I've done CPR on a 7y/o and at least three 1-3 month olds. The 7 y/o died almost 7 years ago and I still think about him. I was giving him a rock climbing lesson when he collaped and died from a brain stem malfunction in front of me. One infant was SIDS and the others were child abuse/neglect. These were not taken well either. How does a mother "forget" their child is in a bathtub at 1 month and why is she leaving him alone in the first place

 

Every call is different, even if all the calls are for the same thing. Some nights (or mornings) when I get home, life goes on without a hesitation or a wonder. On other shifts, I poor a glass of wine, hug my dog and wonder why the world is so cruel.

[NorthfieldNick]

Living with a man who has spent the last 20 years cheating death changes your outlook on life. I no longer fear death, I no longer see it as an end. Death should not be endless mourning for a soul you will never see again, but a celebration of the time you enjoyed with that soul. Certain beliefs I hold about reincarnation certainly help with this; I firmly believe that we do not end when we die, only change, to reappear to those we love in a different form. This is not to say that I do not mourn when someone I love dies- I certainly do. It is a mourning not for the absolute end, but for the end of one cycle of life. That soul will come back to mine- sometimes almost right away, sometimes years later- but it will come back.

 

I do raise livestock for meat- lamb, chickens, ducks, turkeys. The lambs are butchered through our mobile slaughter unit, we do the rest ourselves. I am right there to see the exact, undeniable moment of death for every animal I raise. I still dread buthcer days, although I've seen hundreds of individual deaths. The day I no longer have trouble with killing an animal I brought into this world is the day I need to stop raising livestock. It makes it a little easier knowing that most of my animals are raised with a very definite end, but there is the occasional one that is exceptionally hard. After my favourite ewe tried to die during lambing for the second year in a row, I sent her to the freezer. There is a very practical side to raising livestock, and even though my flock is relatively small, they are not pets. That ewe's skin will grace my living room chair.

 

This last group of lambs and cull ewes I buthcered caused me more grief than any other animals I've butchered. They were mostly from a flock I absorbed from a farm that sold, and the sheep drove me nuts everyday I had them. I was angry with all of them, I couldn't wait to send them to the freezer. Only after they were dead did I realise I'd never made peace with the sheep. It may sound touchy-feely, but if I am going to raise an animal for slaughter I believe I must have great respect for it and honour its soul. They may have short lives, but I want that life to be the best possible. For these last lambs I did, I spent a lot of time projecting a very negative energy upon them. Perhaps that is why, on the same feed, very similar breeding, my home-bred lambs were twice their size.

 

There can not be birth without death, for every death there is a new life. Every beginning has an end, and every end has a beginning. Do not fear death; enjoy life.

[Dalesred]

Ailsa

 

What an interesting question. Is it death itself - or needless suffering that affects us so deeply?

 

As I have got older - and probably dottier - I find I am more sensitive to suffering than I was as a child. Not long ago on the way to work I walked past a fledgling pigeon fallen from its nest in the middle of the city- no grass or trees anywhere near where I could place it in the hope its mother would return. It was in danger of being trodden on by passers by and I had to go back to it. Took it into the office, ( much to the horror of my colleagues) phoned the RSPCA and left it in a dark, quiet place. Sadly the poor thing died before they arrived - but at least it had died in some comfort. Still not sure if I did the right thing by it. An enduring image I have a of the commuter rush hour in London was witnessing an injured pigeon being kicked out of the way by a suit. I hated all mankind at that instant. Cruelty sickens me to the core.

 

DH is the same and will even rescue insects. I too surf rescue websites and visit rescue centres if I'm passing - and I do wonder what exactly impels me to do this as it always upsets me. I know I'm not alone with that though.

 

I'm not sure if it's genetic or environmental or what. I think farmers come to see the whole lifecycle - birth and death being part of the same continuum. On the other hand I also know - and witnessed - how utterly devastated many farmers were during the Foot and Mouth epidemic a few years back when their stock was taken away and slaughtered.

 

Life is precious.Hug your dogs today!

[BustopherJones]

Is it death itself - or needless suffering that affects us so deeply?

A brilliant and enlightened question!!! One need only consider the name of the OP ("Ailsa" is a Gaelic name meaning "God's Promise") to recognize that many of us believe that there is something else beyond the threshhold. Thus, it is the anguish and suffering which affects us, especially if it is unnecessary, not simply the act of passing from one plane of existence to another.

 

Of course, I'm jealous; I wish I had been the one to have the remarkable wisdom to ask that question...

[afrancis]

Suffering leading to death and death itself, whether it was swift and painless or otherwise, both do a number on me.

Elizabeth's story of the suit kicking the pigeon during London rush-hour reminds me of my story.

One night last summer I was awoken by the sounds of drunken men outside the window smashing beer bottles on the road and laughing. I woke up, looked out the window, and realized they were trying to kill a mouse on the road by dropping the bottles on it. Before I knew what I was doing, I yelled out the window, "Hey stop that!" only to be replied by words too disgusting and graphically violent to describe here and directed to me in a way that I actually feared for my safety. They left, I went out to check on the animal, of which I could see no evidence, and couldn't sleep. This whole incident left me freaked out for the next week as I wondered every night if they would return, vandalize my car, house, or steal and kill our dog. I have a very active imagination

My DH said, Never show your hand. My problem is I challenge those that intimidate or show no respect for others or living things. And in this day and age, I'm lucky not to be black and blue all over.

Elizabeth, I would have also taken the fledgling home. I am hoping the sparrow I took to bird-hospital survives.

NorthfieldNick, what an amazing realization that you hadn't made peace with those ewes and lambs before sending them off. I think this speaks volumes for your soul.

And Bustopher, I hadn't heard that version of my name ("God's Promise") only "fairy", which actually suits me a bit better -- but thanks for the new baptism

Those of you who work as EMTs or paramedics, I am amazed at your skill and focus. What a rewarding and tough job that must be.

Kris, you and I are of similar ilk. When I see ducks or chickens, I think pet as well -- I can only imagine how many I'd end up having if I had a farm and they were left to their own devices ...

And even when it was "time" for my first beloved dog Riley to go, I was not at all sure I could go on myself.

Ailsa

[juliepoudrier]

There's lots of good stuff here.

 

I hate the thought of suffering, and while death also bothers me, it's really the thought of what happened before death that is most disturbing to me. Once death occurs, there can be no more suffering, and while I am bothered by needless death, I generally see death as either a release from suffering (the terminally ill or injured) or a natural end to life (for those who die a natural death). That doesn't mean I don't mourn the dead (I still cry over my first cat I got as an adult, Mocha, and he's been dead for 15 years, as well as other pets I've lost before or since), but rather that I recognize that all things must die and death itself isn't necessarily a bad thing.

 

I can remember walking down the street in DC one time and passing an old building with broken windows and there was a pigeon inside who had obviously gotten in through a break in the glass near the top of the window and couldn't find its way back out. It was fluttering and fluttering trying to find its way out. Now I don't love or hate pigeons, but that image of the poor bird trying to find a way out and the knowledge that it likely didn't and suffered a drawn-out death still sticks with me (and I quit working in DC more than 10 years ago). I hate seeing things injured, and I also move turtles out of the road (having once been stopped by a state trooper for my efforts--the poor man was incredulous that I had done a U-turn on highway 1 just to save a box turtle). I do find myself dwelling on those sorts of deaths--the ones that clearly involve suffering.

 

I was raised on a farm and I raise sheep and chickens now. I agonize over sending animals to slaughter--even the ones that have really annoyed me to the point where I just want them to go away. But I also eat meat and I know that the animals I send to the butcher have been raised humanely and have lived lives that are as close to natural as possible. Like Kris, I hate, hate, hate to see livestock trucks stuffed with pigs, cattle, chickens, or turkeys. I can't help but imagine the confusion and stress those poor animals must be experiencing. I've seen (and smelled) chickens in chicken houses, and frankly it disgusts me. I haven't had the pleasure of visiting a "factory" hog farm, but I can just imagine, and trust me my imagination is enough. I, too, eat very little commercially processed meat because of my concern for the way those animals are raised and slaughtered. I name my sheep and have had people ask me how I could possibly raise something, give it a name, and then eat it. But the fact is that I know that each of my animals has had the best possible life right up to the time of slaughter, and for me, I can live with that way easier than I can live with the generic packaged meat that comes from the grocery store. I've never gone so far as to actually slaughter something here on the farm, although if it comes right down to it, that would probably be the most humane method of all, for the animal would never have the stress of leaving its home, and ultimately I might choose to go that route for that very reason.

 

As for dead or injured animals on the road, I am less affected in some ways by wildlife than domestic animals (for the same reasons that others have stated), but I still can't help but imagine the suffering that occurred before the death. And that gets to me no matter what sort of animal it is. If I see a live animal, especially a dog or cat, near the side of the road I worry for days about what might have happened to that animal. It's an interesting question about whether I could put to death an animal I encountered who was suffering, but I imagine I could if I had the right tools with me. (That is, while intellectually I understand that running over something to put it out of it's misery when it's already mortally injured is probably the humane thing to do, I don't know if I could actually bring myself to do it. But if I had a gun handy, I could probably manage to shoot it and kill it that way. I don't know why I draw such a distinction because in the end death is death, but I suppose I'm just squeamish about the method.)

 

J.

[DeltaBluez Tess]

I sell locker lambs and I have regular customers each year so I have a them set aside for them. They have a life of good food, good pasture and a good life. The butcher does a fast job and it si quick. They do not suffer.

 

A few yrs ago I didn't have enough wethers so I grabbed the *special* ewe lamb and tossed her in with the wethers.

 

She (apparently) knew that was a bad spot for her as she then made a point of being a pest. When I was in the locker lamb pasture she would run up and nuzzle me, then lick my hand, then steal my tools and baa and follow me around. Mind you, she one was one of the wildest lambs prior to weaning and always escaping and real PITA. Jeff hated her as he was always putting her away...she would crawl in the irrigation pipe to get out, slid under the fence, squeeze between the gate..you name it. We called herthe *special lamb*

 

So after about a week of her pestering, like a "tick on a coonhound routine" , I pulled her out and put her in the replacement flock and got a substitute.

 

I know she knew what the deal was when she was put in the locker lamb pasture.

 

To this day, she is very affectionate , loving and still a pain in the butt and (has never escaped again) but I love her. She talks to me and follow me about and her lambs are wild as March hares .....and they will stay.

[Bo Peep]

This is an interesting thread as my thoughts about death have changed over the years. I grew up in Los Angles county and married a man I met in the army that grew up on 200 acres in Oregon on a cattle ranch, that later turned into a dairy farm. What a change it made in me. I saw a dog hit by a car- we stopped and the other lane didn't see him, that "thud" remains in my mind. When ex-hubby finally got me on my first acreage, we got animals- WOW, pets!!!! My first, a pygmy goat for each of my boys. A 4-H project, From then on, I was know as the "pet-zoo" Mom. My calves I bought all had names, had collars on and I finally learned NOT to get attached to the steers, except T-bone, he got sick and I spent all night asleep with him in the barn. We were friends then. He came from acres away when I called him, donut holes in hand and apple juice. Couldn't eat him, but ex said I could NOT have an over 1,000 pd Angus steer as a pet. I guess it made sense. After that I knew to only get close to the females, they were staying.

 

When it came time for an ill pet to be "shot". That wasn't my job!! One time I finally gave the OK on a goat, he was having trouble with a stone, most weathers do that are grain fed after many years of life. It has to do about "penis" things. Not willing to go into that- LOL. We went to eat and he was going to shoot him after we got home. He PASSED the stone- very unlikely for a pygmy goat- he made it another year and my ex said "I'm really glad I didn't shoot him". Yea, me too!!!

 

I think you desensitize in a bit. I had goats for 10 years and when I saw my darling Zelda whom I had a lot of problems with (she was retarded, due to lack of oxygen at birth) dead in the pen, my heart dropped and I said "That's it" I've come full circle and I'm done. All the goats were sold, the kids were out of 4-H already and I was onto sheep.

 

As far as chickens, bunnies, I'm not too picky- domesticated animals are the ones that really hit me. When I knew it was "slaughter day" for the steers, I'd stay away, sure I'd eat the meat, and it was really good- took me awhile to eat it. The harmful torture of animals is the part I can't stand. Innocent animals that are not humanly PTS or killed as meat are wrong.

 

I did my stretch at the humane society putting dogs and cats to sleep. It wasn't fun. The shelters were full. I'd love to take them all home. I couldn't. I didn't let a few border collies slip by. They all knew me there back then. What's one more for a few days? Then put them on the top of the list to adopt. Thanks to my vet Mary Fuller.

 

I NEVER thought I would have my hand up a crotch of a goat or a sheep in labor having problems, never thought I would get that friendly with a cow giving birth in those long gloves, but the good out ways the bad. I have seen happy births and a lot of good. I have hit a lot of chickens and even a pheasant that totally ruined my radiator. All in all, the good out ways the bad.

 

In my lifetime, I have seen dead people. That's the saddest. You can see, not only with people, but with animals that the soul is gone. At least with loved ones. We didn't eat most of the animals, just the cows. AND BTW, they were spectacular.