Promote Your BC

[DTrain]

I did an interview for a newspaper in SW Ontario about my goose work with my dogs. The story and a picture of my crew ended up on the front page of the paper. The article also had a paragraph about herding and goose work training and the reporter was very impressed that the dogs would follow commands so well and they were under complete control. Of course I got a number of emails from people who now hate me for herding geese and I got a few from people who are grateful that I am helping to solve their goose problems. But, something else came out of this I did not anticipate but being one to think quickly to take advantage I intend to go with this. The paper got a number of calls from people who were impressed with the dogs being under such control and many were asking if I could help with their dogs. I have very little time to help but I did get a call from the local SPCA who would like me to do some seminars on dog training and manners for everyone, I can do that and at the same time promote the heck out of border collies and rescue. This turned out to be a good thing for border collies and perhaps my guys can inspire some people to get their dogs trained and under control.

[JaderBug]

That's pretty cool... what a great opportunity to educate people (especially the misinformed ones!)!! Good luck with the teaching...

 

Why are people angry about you herding geese??

[juliepoudrier]

Why are people angry about you herding geese??

Because harassing the geese doesn't fit in with their fantasy world view of wildlife/human interactions. These are the same sort of people who complain about the deer eating all their ornamental shrubbery and flowers and yet pitch a fit whenever a controlled hunt is mentioned....

 

J.

[Jack & Co.]

Can you provide the link for the newspaper article so we can read it?

[JaderBug]

Because harassing the geese doesn't fit in with their fantasy world view of wildlife/human interactions. These are the same sort of people who complain about the deer eating all their ornamental shrubbery and flowers and yet pitch a fit whenever a controlled hunt is mentioned....

 

J.

 

Ah. I wondered if it was something like this... !@#@$ hippies. I didn't know if it was that or maybe in some weird way people thought that a BC herding geese instead of sheep was degrading (???)...

[juliepoudrier]

I didn't know if it was that or maybe in some weird way people thought that a BC herding geese instead of sheep was degrading (???)...

Since the average member of the public (save the few who might remember the movie Babe) have no clue that border collies are stockdogs (they think of them as agility dogs, or disc dogs, or those fluffy black and white dogs at Madison Square Garden), it would be a stretch for them to then think of goosework as degrading. No, they are more concerned about the poor geese being treated badly than whether the dog has a self-esteem problem related to its work.

 

J.

[DTrain]

Thanks, I will try to figure out how to get the link on here. No my dogs do not find goes work degrading but then again they also have cows and sheep. Julie is correct and I have come to understand since moving from the country that most people have no idea what a border collie is really all about. People ask me all the time if my guys are show dogs, I like to say that I show them to stock and geese all the time. People are shocked to find that my dogs will work geese. Those that object I like to inform that this is the safest, most humane and natural and the most effective way of managing geese. But of course my goose work is in your face. It is hard to avoid checking out a border collie doing 100 MPH out-run through a public park and a fews seconds later 150 geese coming kicking and screaming off the ground. It is even stranger for them and I would expect a little scary to watch my dog Pete do a slow walk-up on a flock of geese with all the look that he is about to eat one. I expect the majority of these very concerned folks have no idea that everyday almost everywhere geese hang out in bunches that some of the other preferred methods of control include dumping tons of chemicals that make them sick, rounding them up in pens and relocating them or sometimes destroying them, destroy their eggs and nesting sites, or the big one, shoot them or at least wound them badly. In my research after all these years I have yet to encounter one single case of a properly trained border collie attacking a goose. The biggest threat to the dogs is stupid people who attack the dogs or allow their dogs to be off lease to attack the dogs. I am very please that this article has led to the chance to educate, perhaps I can turn some bad or uninformed dog owners into good ones with great dogs. I am almost glad I moved from the country. I am not so sure my dogs are yet.

[Debbie Meier]

Congratulations on landing such a great opportunity.

 

Deb

[Guest SweetJordan]

Since the average member of the public (save the few who might remember the movie Babe) have no clue that border collies are stockdogs (they think of them as agility dogs, or disc dogs, or those fluffy black and white dogs at Madison Square Garden), it would be a stretch for them to then think of goosework as degrading. No, they are more concerned about the poor geese being treated badly than whether the dog has a self-esteem problem related to its work.

 

J.

I did have an old man ask me if Riley knew Babe the pig.

 

 

Anyway to the OP, good for you and very cool by the way.

[Bo Peep]

This is a great opportunity for you to educate the public. I hope you take the time to remind people that border collies are NOT for everyone!!! I'd love to see the article.

[afrancis]

I did an interview for a newspaper in SW Ontario about my goose work with my dogs. The story and a picture of my crew ended up on the front page of the paper.

 

What's the name of the paper DTrain? Maybe the article is already online. Good promo. And yes, I agree. BCs are definitely not for everyone. Just us lucky ones

Ailsa

[Tranquilis]

I'm pretty sure I found it, but I won't post it without DTrain's permission. It's a good, if short, article.

[MrSnappy]

Ah. I wondered if it was something like this... !@#@$ hippies.

 

Uhmmm ... there are a lot of people who live in large metropolises and have no idea that Canada Geese are pests. They are taught by Parks Boards in our provincial and national parks that geese are pretty, and we should watch them swim in the little lakes in our parks, and raise their goslings (the ones that make it through the ADDLING process performed by Parks Board persons, on goose eggs, in the dead of night and rarely speak of it) and admire them. And it's Very Bad to let your dogs Chase Wildlife in the park.

 

Canada Geese are also a protected species. So by and large, most Canadians are not aware that there are a KAJILLION Canada Geese that fly back and forth across the continent being V-shaped flocks of shitting PITAs! But I would not go so far as to dismiss or disparage them as "hippies" - because frankly, if you live in the city and do NOT play golf, the Geese have no bearing on your life. They have no bearing in my city life, for example (except for the ones that attack Wootie when we go running). All these people know is that some guy with some dogs is letting them chase the geese - the very thing that we dog owners are told is Bad.

 

RDM

[Bill Fosher]

I know a lot of hippies, and not one of us wants to have non-native waterfowl invading the habitats of our native species and driving them out. Plus, we're all getting so old that if we slip on goose grease we could break a hip.

 

Let your freak flag fly!

[kelpiegirl]

Geese do cause problems for farmers. I have a friend with several hundred acres of crops that they have had to have dogs come in to disperse the dogs- instead of using chemicals. It isn't the presence of a few geese, it's the non-migratories that cause all the problem, and, oh, RDM, how on earth does a goose chase Wootie? Perhaps you and Dtrain need to get together and teach Woo his game face for these suckers.

[DTrain]

Mr. Snappy, the next time I am in Vancouver with the guys I will give you a call. Perhaps we can get Wootie out with the guys to turn that situation around. Or, perhaps you have very tough geese. Vancouver is such a great place that perhaps they feel they need to defend their turf. I feel I must bring to your attention that indeed I have encountered situations where hippies have greatly objected to me and my guys working geese. I consulted with the city of Nelson and it was something of an issue. You are correct however that the vast majority of people in large cities have no idea that geese are a problem. They also have no idea that the geese they are seeing in their parks and communities are not the same geese that form the beautiful V's and migrate south to poop on our US friends properties. These geese are in fact a sub-species of the greater Canada goose. They do not migrate and they are now a permanent fixture and very seldom range more than a few miles from the location at which they were hatched. I just did a seminar on this in Ontario. This is the particular goose that is causing all of the problems for our urban areas. They are protected under the migratory bird act but some consideration is being given to a different set of rules for geese which do not migrate. These geese are taking over and in some locations in SW Ontario they have nested twice this season. Their goal of course is to populate the world. Go get um Wootie.

[kelpiegirl]

Drain

I am curious, how do you work the geese? Do you have a specific sending plan? What do you do when you see a group of geese that need to be dispersed?

[DTrain]

Hi Kelpie, thanks for asking. It is not unlike working sheep. I use the same commands and the same sort of approach. It is a bit of a long story but basically what I do is try to present the dogs as predators in the same way the geese would be approached by a wild canine. I try to have the dogs approach upwind when I can under cover and get as close as possible. When the geese for their own safety have started to become aware of the dogs I will send the dogs on an out-run to put the geese into flight. I want the geese to believe that the dogs are hunting. My dog Pete does most of this on his own and all I really need to do is keep him out of trouble. He may hold the world record for the longest walk-ups. My dog Mac is a speedster and I often send him in situations where the geese already have an escape route and I just want to create panic. My youngest dog Dave is still learning and I hold him back and allow him to work in situations where I know the geese will not turn on him or create a problem for him. At the moment I am working on his confidence and it is a little early to allow him in to mix it up. When I am working very close to the sheep I only send Pete because of his ability to work very slowly. When I get the time I can do a series of posts on exactly what the dogs do. You will see that their work is very similar to working sheep in open pasture. The geese in our area are beginning to fly again after molting so the dogs will be out every day starting about mid August.

[kelpiegirl]

I think the geese are pretty wise when it comes to us trying to sneak up on them. I can't always come in down wind from them, because of the golfers all over. Sometimes, I literally have to send the dogs between golfers and the putting greens. The biggest thing for me then, is their complete focus- which they both have. The other day I was specifically very very proud of my dog. The geese we have- and this is in large part to me not getting out there as much as I should visa vis the boss and saving $$, are completely fat and lazy- to the point that it takes some time for them to get off the ground. We got to within 10 feet of the fatsos, before they saw us. They ended up circling back to a pond. This is where I was proud. I sent my swimming dog (I know you don't agree with swimming dogs, but it is THE ONLY way that these geese will leave- I used to have no swimming dogs, and the improvement in our record is now 100% better). Anyway, Lucy ran around the pond- as usual. She knows this, I suppose from sheep work- though I never taught her this. In the water she wades. These geese put up such a fuss, but would not leave. We do NOT leave until ALL the geese are gone, which can take some serious time. I had one dog on the shore, wading in at the right pressure points, and Lucy was bottlenecking them to one side. This usually causes them to leave- not these. Instead, they would lift off, and land behind her- clear at the other side of the pond. This continued for some time- all the while she would cover one that decided to break, and then, at long last, one left. Usually the rest leave soon thereafter, but not these. After lots more dedicated work on her part, all but two left. She had been in the water some time, by then, and hopped out to take a potty break. I couldn't blame her- it had been near an hour. Then, without me asking, she went right back in for the last two- and got them out in another several mins. This is a BIG pond. So, after they had gotten out, she swam to me, shook off, and trotted to the golf cart, head held high, for a job well done.

[ErinKate]

This is all very interesting. I never knew they were a problem. I know personally I would not want the dirty devils making a winter home at my pond, but really didn't know they were an issue. Do they do any kind of controlled hunt? Here in FL we have controlled gator hunts to help the population, what do they do for the geese? Someone said they are endangered or protected?

 

I would think hippies would appreciate the dogs being used rather than anything more harmful to the environment.

Like Bill said, don't hate the hippies.

[kelpiegirl]

I only work golf courses- and they make BIG messes, which yields less $$ to the course- for some reason, golfers don't like to have to step in, or have their balls land in the piles- and they aren't selective as to where they go. They also have been responsible for entire beaches being closed down due to exceedinly high Salmonella measurements. The funny thing about where I work, is that there are several golf courses all within short drive to eachother. I wonder when I dispatch them, which course they go to No, no hunts for them, because as someone mentioned earlier, they have to determine who are the residents and who are the migrants. Since they are protected by the migratory bird act, they are safe. If it can be established, via gps tagging the birds, that these animals do not in fact migrate for a period of two years, then there *may* be a controlled hunt by fish and game. These birds know when they have it good. The raise families and plan to stay- unless someone with a good dog or two, make the place a bit less comfortable for them. Here's an example of these bird's strength of will: one of the courses hired several trucks to move the geese from where I am, down to Long Island. It all went very well, no losses, they let the birds go at their designated release point. The birds made it back to the place of origin before the trucks.

[ErinKate]

Other than nasty poo, do they do anything else to the environment? Do they demolish benificial aquatic life? Eat much needed bugs? Dig? I know they can wreck a clean pond pretty quick.

As much as I understand the problem, honestly I can see how people would not like to see them chased off. They are a beautiful bird. Gotta love nature.

 

Ok, burn me at the stake if you need to, but I have a question. When you use a dog to move stock, it is usually to a specific area. When you are scarring geese away, how much precision do you need? Are you not just scarring them into flight? You talked about the young dog not being allowed to work yet, what could he do wrong? I am really just asking out of my own ignorance.

[border_collie_crazy]

we have such a goose problem here that I am not used to people not knowing they are pests, its pretty obvious problem in our city lol. what we do is goose round ups, once a year hundreds of people gather to catch geese and put them in crates, they are then flown to other bird santuaries. its a dispersal basicly. our bigger golf coarses have Labs that live on coarse to scare away the geese.

[Bill Fosher]

They are not too much of a problem around me, but where they have started to habituate they become the dominant waterfowl and drive out ducks and other birds that nest and feed in our marshes. Personally, I could care less about poop on a golf course -- I think it's good for those guys to get dirty now and again.

[Tranquilis]

Other than nasty poo, do they do anything else to the environment? Do they demolish benificial aquatic life? Eat much needed bugs? Dig? I know they can wreck a clean pond pretty quick.

How about tear grass up by the roots, and eat the roots, requiring expensive re-sodding, or less expensive, but much lenghtier re-seeding?