Dayzee Posted November 28, 2003 Report Share Posted November 28, 2003 Although this has only happened three times over the past 1 1/2 yrs, I know we're courting disaster. Once I was walking Dayzee in town on a lead....she spotted a bird and gave chase....the lead broke and she's running amongst the traffic. The other 2 times happened here at home (acreage). Yesterday we had just come out of the house when she spotted a fox and off she goes. Usually when she's just wandering she comes back really good when I call or whistle, but when she's after something she totally ignores me. I'm calling her name, whistling and yelling a drop command to no avail. She doesn't go far and does come back very shortly, at which point she knows she's in big trouble, but still does it the next time there's something fun to chase. This is not a good thing especially if she decides to chase a coyote who has his buddies waiting out in the field. That's what scares me. She has her 1st leg of her CD, and is pretty good with the CDX routine already, so I don't have a problem with the obedience. Question: Is there a trick to stopping this? Will she hopefully just get better as the obedience level advances? Is this just a bad quirk that I have to somehow work around? Or is there hope she will just outgrow it? Having her penned or on a lead at all times is really not an option. She would hate it...I would hate it. Surely we can get past this??? Thanks for any ideas, Corinne Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lucy Goosey Posted November 28, 2003 Report Share Posted November 28, 2003 I think this is an obedience issue. A solid recall means that she will come off of any distraction. The only way to get there is through training; waiting for her to outgrow it will not work because every time she does this, it only reinforces the behavior, which makes it more likely to occur again in the future. What I would suggest is that you eliminate her ability to bolt, while simultaneously working on the recall under distraction. I'd start with easy stuff and work up to harder stuff, always making sure that you have the ability to enforce your recall should she not respond correctly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tassie Posted November 28, 2003 Report Share Posted November 28, 2003 Sadly, I think you?re right, SAR K9 Lucy. I?ve come to the same conclusion about my little swallow-chasing demon bitch, Kirra. She?s normally very good about checking with me, and coming when I call ? very speedy recall in obedience ? but she?s finding it very, very hard to resist the lure of swallows. I?m trying to train her off them by having her on a lead, and calling her name and clicking as she turns her head to me ? she then usually comes all the way in for the treat. Then I send her off again with the ?go free? command, and when she just starting to focus on a swallow, repeat the dose. It does seem to be working, but it?s not always easy to find swallow ? I don?t have any at home. To Corinne ? can you find somewhere to set her up ? on a long lead if possible ? so that you can practise this ?ignoring distractions? behavior? In the meantime, if you think she could really be in danger at home while you're not there, can't you set up a pen for her? She might not love it at first, but she'd get used to it, and she'd be safe, while you're spending the time to work on her training. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kmsoileau Posted November 30, 2003 Report Share Posted November 30, 2003 Glad to see this post. About a week ago, Jazz was in the middle of a large baseball/soccer field retrieving his favorite ball-on-a-rope. About 50 meters away, a Shiba Inu, a small one at that, on leash with master, decided to growl at Jazz. Jazz froze, dropped the ball, I gave the sit command and he obeyed--until the Shiba growled again. Jazz bolted for the Shiba and the young lady walking this Shiba wisely(?) picked it up. Meanwhile I'm yelling for Jazz to come and running over to this screaming lady where Jazz is now wagging his tail and "smiling". I calmed the Shiba-owner down, assuring her that "he's gentle" (all the while wanting to say, "if you don't stop screaming, I might just let him go"--just kidding ). I grabbed Jazz firmly by his collar and let him know that "come" meant just that. But then I remembered about 9 months ago when Jazz was just 3 months old, this same Shiba and master were out walking and the Shiba was acting like he wanted to eat my little black and white bundle of joy. At that time, Jazz went for cover behind my leg. I wonder if Jazz (now 50 lbs.) remembered. It seems to be only Shibas that set him off. He's only shown agression twice--both were Shiba related. We did some back-to-the-basics training and he seems to be fine. I'll be more on the look out for Shibas in the area when he's free, from now on, though. Jazz's pal, Kevin Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spike's Bitch Posted December 1, 2003 Report Share Posted December 1, 2003 Spike has similar issues with German Shepherds - he got attacked by one in the summer and now if I see one anywhere we have to leave at once. I've made friends with a lady with a GSD (and a BC) and we're going to try walking them on leads in each other's sight until they calm down about it. Her GSD (not the one that attacked the Captain) has fear aggression issues with other dogs, so it'll be a group therapy thing. Wish us luck... Liz & Captain 'Mad Dog' Spike xxx Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tassie Posted December 1, 2003 Report Share Posted December 1, 2003 That?s a great thing to do to help the dogs with their problems, Liz. I used to find it really helpful with my previous Border Collie Sam, who was a lovely dog, but had issues in relation to other dogs. I think he was born missing some wiring that enabled him to read other dogs, because he used to assume that there would be a problem, and start getting ready for trouble way before it happened! He had a very big personal space. But he would walk quite comfortably with other dogs on lead, and after a few walks like that would ?learn? that those particular dogs were OK. One time he was off lead with 12 other dogs, variety of breeds, quite happily, until dog#14 appeared on the horizon, and Sam immediately went into his stiff ?I don?t know that dog? attitude ? go figure. In other words, the on lead walks helped heaps, but didn?t completely cure the problems. Oddly enough, Sam usually didn?t have problems doing off lead stays with strange dogs in the obedience ring ? seemed ot think that was an under control situation! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dayzee Posted December 2, 2003 Author Report Share Posted December 2, 2003 Thanks for the reponses. I was secretly hoping for a "miracle cure", but knew at heart it meant an obed issue. Oh well. The thing I don't quite understand is how to get her attention when she is running away at full tilt. During training and when she is facing me...as long as she is looking at me (I use hand signals)...she is great on recall from any distance. It's getting her to stop the chase no matter what. But, I suppose that will come with further practice (I hope). Thanks again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Betsy Posted December 2, 2003 Report Share Posted December 2, 2003 You might try reading "The Other End of the Leash" by Patricia McConnell. It helped me. One thing she points out is that if the dog is excited about something, the energy and excitement in your voice when yelling at him/her to "come" could spur him/her on further. But if you yell firmly at him with a "cease" command ("no", "leave it", etc) he/she would respond better. For instance, we have a creek by our house and sometimes Riley would take off for it. I would yell his name and call him to come, but he never once looked back to even consider it. After reading this book, the next time he did it, I yelled a single syllable "NO" very loud and very stern. He stopped and looked at me, then decided to go anyway. It didn't stop him this first time, but it was the first step towards stricter obedience. He doesn't take off for the creek anymore. I agree with the others that it's an obedience issue, and reading this book is not a cure-all in the least, but it could help to understand how dogs respond to us feeble-minded humans, and therefore help when dealing with this, and other, training/obedience issues. Betsy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WTMcVey Posted December 3, 2003 Report Share Posted December 3, 2003 I know I'm going to get alot of disagreements with this suggestion, but I'll make it anyway. I am a firm believer in CORRECT use of shock collars. They don't always work, but if you find your dog is responsive to them, they can be a very valuable tool. Just as someone suggested before, give the loud, firm, "NO" and if that doesn't stop your dog, give a quick zap. Always give the voice command before eliciting any shock whatsoever. And, you don't have to fry them! I realize alot of people hate the idea of a shock collar, but the quicker you can stop bad habits, the better; and the consequences of using a shock collar are far better than possible alternatives where your dog becomes injured or even worse. Your dog should eventually become responsive to the "NO!" without the zap. Hope I have helped without making you think I'm a heartless beast! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nancy in AZ Posted December 3, 2003 Report Share Posted December 3, 2003 Originally posted by Dayzee:[QB] Thanks for the reponses. The thing I don't quite understand is how to get her attention when she is running away at full tilt. I carry a plastic whistle. I find it pretty effective, but we're still working on consistency. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Journey Posted December 9, 2003 Report Share Posted December 9, 2003 am a firm believer in CORRECT use of shock collars. They don't always work, but if you find your dog is responsive to them, they can be a very valuable tool. Just as someone suggested before, give the loud, firm, "NO" and if that doesn't stop your dog, give a quick zap. Always give the voice command before eliciting any shock whatsoever. And, you don't have to fry them! I realize alot of people hate the idea of a shock collar, but the quicker you can stop bad habits, the better; and the consequences of using a shock collar are far better than possible alternatives where your dog becomes injured or even worse. No disagreement here. Not "coming" can be a life and death issue for some dogs. Proper use of the collar is paramount though. I also recommend "walking the dog down". I will call one time, after that I will walk to the dog, in a non threatening manner, until I have a hold of them (even if it means a LONG walk) still not repeating anything. When I have the pup, I will lift it up by the scruff, two if not four of their feet off the ground. I will then calmly walk back to where the initial "come" was from, set the pup down and praise the devil out of them (no cookies! this is an obedience issue). Now, this is assuming (bad word!) that you know you have taught come, here, with me, or whatever to the pup. Karen Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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