Positive punishment?

[claire24]

I'm looking for a basic class for Aveda in the summer, and came across this local training "school". The price is good and the location is excellent, but I'm not sure about their "dog-friendly training methods".

 

http://www.k9insight.biz/Training%20Methods.htm

 

Does this sound ok? I'm all about positive reinforcement and these people claim to be positive, but their description is of positive punishment-- something I'm a little more wary of. Aveda is very sensitive when I'm training her indoors without distractions, but I'm having trouble getting her to focus completely on me outside with just treats. If we leave the 10 foot radius of my doorstep or god forbid another dog comes along, it all goes out the window. Have any of you taken a positive punishment class? Do you think it would be effective for a dog like her?

[Brad]

Their opening statement isn't something I agree with, but to each their own

 

"We believe dogs learn best when there is a consequence for disobeying a known command"

 

BTW, I got to work every Friday exactly to get my pay

[Jedismom]

I'm looking for a basic class for Aveda in the summer, and came across this local training "school". The price is good and the location is excellent, but I'm not sure about their "dog-friendly training methods".

 

http://www.k9insight.biz/Training%20Methods.htm

 

Does this sound ok? I'm all about positive reinforcement and these people claim to be positive, but their description is of positive punishment-- something I'm a little more wary of. Aveda is very sensitive when I'm training her indoors without distractions, but I'm having trouble getting her to focus completely on me outside with just treats. If we leave the 10 foot radius of my doorstep or god forbid another dog comes along, it all goes out the window. Have any of you taken a positive punishment class? Do you think it would be effective for a dog like her?

 

I would go with your gut feeling about it and not do it. You describe Aveda as being very sensitive and that's another reason I wouldn't do it. I once made the mistake of taking my very sensitive Jedi to a training class like this. He became very stressed and started doing weird things like fixating on fans and trying to run out the door. We quit after the second class. I switched to a different trainer and now we have lots of fun while learning with the clicker and treats. My other dog Cadi would not have thought twice about it, but she's a different personality. For outside training I use very high value treats that are not used at any other time, like real chicken. Sometimes I pull out the special squeaky, colorful toys only used for this purpose. This seems to help.

[Jumpin Boots]

I agree that it is always best to go with your gut. That being said I wasn't really bothered by anything their website said. I use positive training, but will discipline, not punish they are different in my mind, when necessary. The other thing to keep in mind is that the chances of you finding a trainer who you agree with 100% of the time is pretty slim. I don't think I have ever found a dog trainer or horse trainer that I have used everything they have suggested. That is where you need to be willing to pick and choose techniques that you do or don't like and if a trainer starts heading you down a path you don't like, tell them and ask for another option.

 

My best recommendation with any trainer is to always go watch a class or two if possible. Even take your dog in the car and see if the instructor will come out and greet them. If possible I would visit both a beginner class, like what you would be starting out in and an advance class to see how the dogs seem to progress. If you see a dog similar to your's in class, talk to the student and ask how their dog is progressing. If at any time the trainer declines you watch a class or talk to a student that would be a huge red flag for me.

[Northof49]

First of all, they have lots of articles on prong collars.

 

Their article on dog/dog agression with the stuff about always feeding the "dominant" dog first etc etc is old and very outdated look at pack interaction and relationships. There are so many things wrong and stupid about this article.

 

Positive Punishment is one quadrant of training - you add a punisher to get the desired behaviour you want i.e. Positive in this case only means "adding" something to increase a desired behaviour.

 

Personally, they are certainly nothing I would ever take my dog to OR allow one of our adopted rescue dogs to go to.

 

I also see that their Total Recall training is done with shock collars, and it looks like some of the stuff they do with agressive dogs is done on the shock collar as well.

[Ms.DaisyDuke]

My best recommendation with any trainer is to always go watch a class or two if possible. Even take your dog in the car and see if the instructor will come out and greet them. If possible I would visit both a beginner class, like what you would be starting out in and an advance class to see how the dogs seem to progress. If you see a dog similar to your's in class, talk to the student and ask how their dog is progressing. If at any time the trainer declines you watch a class or talk to a student that would be a huge red flag for me.

 

This is probably the best advice anyone ever gave me on this board. Go and watch the trainers, make sure you like what you see and you feel comfortable with their way of training. Most places don't mind people (no dogs) dropping in on their regular classes...classes for reactive dogs is usually different, but basic obedience ones shouldn't be a problem. If it is, don't go!

[claire24]

Thanks for the advice, I'll probably contact them and see if I can sit in on a class, but I really want to try clicker training as that's something I've never done before. I think that will get Aveda a little more excited about training that way than something negative.

[Root Beer]

Thanks for the advice, I'll probably contact them and see if I can sit in on a class, but I really want to try clicker training as that's something I've never done before. I think that will get Aveda a little more excited about training that way than something negative.

 

I think she would, too. If you need help finding a trainer in your area, feel free to PM me and I can see if I can find you a recommendation of a good clicker trainer in your area.

[desertranger]

I've been having a problem finding a trainer as well. I would check them out as best you can. Ask for references and talk to other grads from their school. Ask for a demo lesson. Have them teach your dog something. If you like the method go for it.