My Dog's Job (Should I let him?

[mbc1963]

Buddy has always hated bugs of all kinds, but especially flies. This year, he's taken to finding them on my window screens and following them until he can squish them (and, to my disgust, eat them).

 

Frankly, I like not having to worry about flies in my house.

 

The flip side is the potential for this to develop into an OCD thing.

 

Lately, there's been about a fly every other day. Whaddya think? Let him do it?

 

Mary

[dogsofmenace]

Boy I know all about fly chasing! My little staffy mix does it. I don't really mind it because I hate flies as well. But she is a little obsessive about it, that and finding ticks. Whenever there is a black spot on the ground she'll go right up to it, stare at it and bite it. I know she has a little bit of an obsession, but on the flip side, there are no flies in the house and she can always find ticks (and there are a lot of them this time of the year) on the ground or even on our other dogs.

[juliepoudrier]

One very big downside is that dogs who go after flies often go after other flying insects as well, including bees and wasps. I have to be quite vigilant with one of my dogs because she'll snap at anything that flies by, and I really don't need her being stung. Something to consider. Plus I just wouldn't want my dog eating flies...

 

J.

[bc4ever]

Scooter's been chasing some sort of flying insect--don't know what it is. The bad part about that is, he becomes so focused on getting at the thing that I'm afraid he's going to rip the curtains off the wall or knock something over in his hot pursuit. He jumps in the air and snaps his teeth, trying to catch it. If I happen to knock it to the ground, he rushes over to eat it. Gross, but he's probably eaten worse! He goes bonkers when he sees me get the fly swatter out and starts barking and goes into search and destroy mode. The other day I tapped the window lightly, trying to kill one of these annoying little buggers and he came ripping downstairs to see what I was doing! Good ears!! And God forbid if a bug actually lands on him--hours later, he's still fidgeting and looking for it on his bod! Goofy boy!

[vanillalove]

I personally just don't let my dog eat bugs, mainly because it creeps me out. It's definitely help protect him from wasps and bees, like Julie stated, Pete knows not to go near them, he just leaves it alone like he was taught with every other living thing in the house.

 

I've seen plenty of nasty stings from wasps, hornets or bees, both on and inside many dogs' mouths and it is not a fun thing to deal with. Most of the dogs started out just chasing flies around the house and didn't know the difference when it came to a dangerous insect outside.

 

My vote is to try and nip it in the butt!

[Ms.DaisyDuke]

Hmm. It could cause problems if he gets stung by something. Daisy chases dragonflies most of the time, which I don't like because they are pretty and eat mosquitoes, but she also doesn't kill them, she just rips the wings off. It disturbs me a little, so I don't let her do it. Lately she's taken an interest in wasps/hornets/bees which is a huge no, no. She got stung in the leg a couple of years ago and the leg literally tripled in size and I'm not joking. So, i'll be damned if she's getting stung in the mouth! I think the housefly thing, which is harmless, could turn into something bad like a trip to the vet....

 

j

[silhouettestable]

Most of mine will snap at flies, Flash in particular likes to go after them but he doesn't flip out and jump all over everything. He just follows them around and tries to get them if they're within a reasonable distance.

 

If I ever see them eyeing wasps/hornets/bees I call them away immediately. I did hear of someone's husky snapping up a hornet and having to be rushed to the vet after getting stung on the tongue. The dog had a reaction and the tongue swelled. The owner posted about it on a sled dog forum, and was suggesting that everyone ought to keep an epi pen handy in case something like that happens with their dogs. Sometimes the trip to the vet could take too long and the epi pen might save the dog.

[bexie]

Molly fly hunts--and other bugs outside, including bees--but she respects a "that'll do" (translated into Danish) and doesn't get onto furniture or knock things over. Unless you're using poison, I don't see what the big deal is about the dog eating them. It's just a little protein. I certainly prefer Molly's clean-up to my DH running around the house with a fly swatter and squishing them on things and potentially leaving dead bodies various places. He and Molly often work as a team--she gets the low ones and he gets the high ones and she cleans up the carrion. She's also great about limiting the moth population in here.

 

As long as she quickly respects a that'll do and leaves the house intact, I'm not going to worry or consider it OCD. I'll worry and put a stop to it as soon as she gets so caught up in flies that she starts breaking things, blows off commands, or can't concentrate on anything else.

 

She can play ball or hold a stay with a fly sitting on her face without going crazy.

[notailabigail]

I like that Abby kills bugs in the house (she doesn't usually eats them - just squashes and rolls in them...). If she sees one inside she'll stare at it first and then I tell her to 'get it' and if the hunt is going on for too long I tell her to stop and she will. Otherwise I think she would have the potential to become obsessive about it.

[nancy]

Fergie barely notices flying or crawling.

 

Our previous dog, Vamp, was a mighty fly huntress. She'd snap them out of the air indoors and out. Which was quite handy considering some of the places we lived in our rather poor period. She did catch a bee once. I saw it happen and was ready for the long drive to the vet. But, as soon as she caught it, she got a really odd look - and spit it out. The darned bee flew away!

 

Cats with spiders are really funny. They keep pawing and mouthing - then snapping their heads back fast and shaking - to get rid of the taste. But then back to pawing and mouthing.

[Laurae]

Sophie is a fly catcher. I can call her off if necessary, but I too kind of appreciate the help. She is not allergic to bee stings, as far as I can tell, so I am not as worried about her getting stung. Of course, I also don't like to tempt trouble, so I call her off the bees.

 

One day when we were hiking (in the days before Taz and Craig), she came upon and investigated a wasp's nest. She disturbed them enough that they swarmed out in attack mode. Within seconds, she was literally covered in stinging wasps. Her fur is thick and those bees were everywhere in her coat. She was pawing and snapping in every direction in her panic to get them off her. I ran over to help, of course, and we finally got them off her. We ran down the rest of the trail, and I drove immediately to the nearest vet clinic. They checked her out and she was completely fine. They told me most dogs are not terribly affected by bee stings, even multiple stings, as she got that day. What a relief.

 

Oh, did I mention that I am terribly allergic to bee stings? I spent the rest of the day in the emergency room

[juliepoudrier]

I suppose what one person will tolerate another finds annoying. That's how I feel about fly snapping--it annoys me so I don't allow it. I can see the dog snapping at flies if it's outside and the fly is buzzing around its head and bothering it, but personally I won't ignore or encourage any behavior that could turn into something worse. I have one obsessive-compulsive dog already, so I absolutely discourage anything that could lead to obsessive behavior.

 

Bexie,

It seems to me that by the time the dog is blowing off commands, breaking things, etc., the behavior is already a problem. That's why I choose not to allow it from the start. To me it's easier to discourage a particular behavior at its earliest stages rather than wait till it's become a problem.

 

J.

[grinning.girl]

I Gave Shelby a command to do it. So she will ignore the flys until I tell her to get them, then Master Hunter Shelby comes out!!! she kills the fly and leaves it for mommy to get rid of.

 

so I would say put a command to the behavior.

 

sometimes she'll try to after one outside, but a firm "leave it" will fix that quick like.

 

[bexie]

Bexie,

It seems to me that by the time the dog is blowing off commands, breaking things, etc., the behavior is already a problem. That's why I choose not to allow it from the start. To me it's easier to discourage a particular behavior at its earliest stages rather than wait till it's become a problem.

 

It's a good point you have, but I also have some trust to my dog. We play a lot of self-control games and she knows the rules. If I can trust her to leave a meatball alone on the floor and even retrieve it for me, I can probably trust her to keep responding to commands to leave the flies alone.

 

I also know my dog pretty well at this point. She _hates_ knocking things over or breaking things. She won't touch her ball if it has knocked something over unless we tell her she's allowed--usually it is our fault it has caused trouble.

 

If you think about it--you can call your dogs off sheep, don't you think you can call them off a fly?

 

I watch for the tiny signs of an OCD starting--inability to focus on other things, snapping at flies that aren't there, ignoring commands, etc. Plus flies are seasonal. They are basically gone all winter, so that helps keep the behavior from becoming an OCD. Now the TV... that we had to work on. But she's fine now.

 

But like you say, there are personal aspects. It doesn't bug us, so that's how we deal with it. It bothers you, so you just forbid it. I'm sure it also depends on the dog's personality. I might make a very different rule if I had a dog that had less respect for the house and less self-control.

[juliepoudrier]

Bexie,

My comment was because you said:

I'll worry and put a stop to it as soon as she gets so caught up in flies that she starts breaking things, blows off commands, or can't concentrate on anything else.

 

Now you're saying that your dog would never do any of the things mentioned in the first quote, so I'm not sure what point you were trying to make.

 

The sheep vs. fly analogy is a false one. By the reasoning you're presenting here, my dogs would be allowed to harrass the sheep (snap at flies) as long as I was able to call them off, when in fact the dogs are never allowed to do anything with the sheep unless I am there specifically asking them to do so. That's a huge and significant difference.

 

Also, by stating

I might make a very different rule if I had a dog that had less respect for the house and less self-control.

 

You seem to be implying that folks whose dogs aren't allowed to do stuff like snap at flies are somehow lacking in respect or self-control, and I'm sure you can see that isn't at all necessarily true.

 

At any rate, I think in discussions like this one, we need to consider the average owner and the average dog. In cases like that, I stand by my contention that any behavior that has the potential to develop into something obsessive or that is just plain annoying to the human is best nipped in the bud at the start rather than allowed to perhaps develop into something else that must be trained away from later. I believe that most, if not all trainers, would agree that this is a sensible approach, since it's easier to prevent bad habits from forming than it is to change a habit already formed.

 

For folks who don't mind their dogs snapping at flies, I say go for it. I personally just don't think it's a good thing to let a dog do.

 

Oh, and I guess I should clarify that I don't actually care if my dogs kill and eat various insects if they feel so inclined--I'm just not going to let them do it in a way that is even remotely crazed or obsessive.

 

J.

[painted_ponies]

I admit, I let Faith decapitate carpenter bees. I haven't found any other way to deter the darned things from eating my house and barn so I let her go for it. She doesn't go after honeybees, I guess because they are minding their own business down on the ground collecting pollen, not buzzing around defending the nearest piece of wood they intend to devour. Or wasps, either, come to think of it. They sort of hover and don't really buzz and so don't seem to attract Faith's attention.

 

I like watching Faith get her bee. She watches it for a bit until she discerns its movement patterns, then leaps up in the air and very daintily bites its head off.

 

Oh, yes, Faith likes flies, too. Amazingly though, despite the horses, we don't have very many of those around the house and yard. I wonder if the wasps eat them? I know you can order those special wasp larva to sprinkle on manure, but I don't have those - just three or four kinds of ordinary wasps.

[Ruger's Dad]

I don't have this problem at all. Ruger only chases frisbees and balls. Flies and bugs are not on his list of play things.

[bexie]

Bexie,

My comment was because you said:

Now you're saying that your dog would never do any of the things mentioned in the first quote, so I'm not sure what point you were trying to make.

 

I don't think she would. If she did, then she'd definitely be OCD and I'd be dealing with it.

 

 

Also, by stating

You seem to be implying that folks whose dogs aren't allowed to do stuff like snap at flies are somehow lacking in respect or self-control, and I'm sure you can see that isn't at all necessarily true.

 

That certainly isn't what I meant and I'm sorry if I offended anyone or their dogs. I meant that Molly has an innate concern for bumping into things that not all dogs have. It's part of her personality. If her personality were different, I would be more likely to have different rules.

 

At any rate, I think in discussions like this one, we need to consider the average owner and the average dog. In cases like that, I stand by my contention that any behavior that has the potential to develop into something obsessive or that is just plain annoying to the human is best nipped in the bud at the start rather than allowed to perhaps develop into something else that must be trained away from later. I believe that most, if not all trainers, would agree that this is a sensible approach, since it's easier to prevent bad habits from forming than it is to change a habit already formed.

 

I definitely understand and respect your opinion. You are certainly more experienced than I am. The average new owner would probably be far better off listening to you than listening to me. (I say that seriously and with full respect)

 

Oh, and I guess I should clarify that I don't actually care if my dogs kill and eat various insects if they feel so inclined--I'm just not going to let them do it in a way that is even remotely crazed or obsessive.

 

I guess I don't see the way in which Molly hunts flies as crazed or obsessive. Because she does show such total respect for the house and commands in the process. She can concentrate to train even if flies are around her. She'll ignore flies on her face if I've put her in a downstay or we're playing ball.

 

I also know BCs can get obsessive about balls and I've seen one that was obsessive about balls. So I am also alert to how she acts around the ball. If she started showing signs of losing her wits when the ball was around, I'd definitely get very worried. But I think it is a bit paranoid to keep her from playing with balls just because some BCs get OCD with them. It's the same with flies. So much of it depends on reading your dog.

 

Sincerely,

Rebecca

[mbc1963]

Yeah... I've been thinking about it, and the way I see it, Buddy looks at flies the same way as he looks at the occasional cat who comes into our back yard - a good bit of sport, but nothing regular enough to get weird about.

 

It does fascinate me, though, how acute his hearing is! The other day, when I was in one room, Buddy came trotting in from another room, because apparently he could hear the buzzing of the fly!

 

Mary

[juliepoudrier]

But I think it is a bit paranoid to keep her from playing with balls just because some BCs get OCD with them. It's the same with flies. So much of it depends on reading your dog.

The difference, which I don't seem to be explaining very clearly, is that you (the general you) can control access to balls, so even the ball-obsessed dog can be easily stopped from obsessing by keeping balls out of sight. That's not the case with insects, dust motes, shadows, etc. (well, unless you live in a perfect "clean room" environment), which is why I responded the way I did about fly snapping. Yes, all trianing issues are helped by knowing your dog well and being able to trust it, but I've been on this forum long enough to know that there are a lot of folks who just aren't as in tune to their dogs or potential negative behaviors, so I err on the side of caution with my advice. That's all.

 

J.