KrisK Posted February 11, 2007 Report Share Posted February 11, 2007 Okay, I think I might be looking at Shetland sheep. I found a contact in E. Ontario who raises shetlands, dorpers and I think Katadhins. I wasn't sure about their 'flocking' instinct but she has said they use their Border collies with all the sheep. She also said, they are 'feisty' so I would need to get some experience handling them. From what she said, most people really enjoy working with the Shetlands once they have had the chance. And they may be more appropriate for my smaller pasture area since they are smaller. So, does anyone else have Shetlands? What's your experience with them? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Black Watch Debatable Posted February 11, 2007 Report Share Posted February 11, 2007 I have zero experience with them myself, but have heard a couple people say they are horrid. Gah, I'm sorry to start this off with a negative comment I'm sure much depends on how you care for the sheep and how you work them. (I love love love my Cheviots, and God knows they're not the most popular.) Why not Katadhins? Or Dorper x Katadhins? I've heard good things about these sheep, and lots of border collie people seem to have them. They're good-lookin', too [photo of Dorpers at the Big Bend SDT by Mark B]: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rebecca, Irena Farm Posted February 11, 2007 Report Share Posted February 11, 2007 My vote is for the Katadhin or Dorp/Kat. Easy care, and easy management - I've heard Shetlands are one of those breeds that either won't stay in fences or won't stay OUT of them. You really can't beat those hair sheep for a first time hobby flock - something to learn on, then you can look around you and see whether you might like to try something more challenging. Trust me, there's always cheap Shetlands for sale - I strongly suspect there's a reason. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KrisK Posted February 11, 2007 Author Report Share Posted February 11, 2007 Here's a bit of what the person I contacted wrote - "We use our border collies on our Shetlands, Dorpers and Katahdin crosses and we find the Shetlands have more endurance than the meat sheep. The hair sheep tend to get a little heavy with the dogs once they are broken in but the Shetlands tend to maintain their "spunk". The Shetlands are a small, easy to manage sheep as well and don't eat as much. They are however very fiesty and require either a strong or experienced dog to work them at first or an experienced sheep herder. A lot of people didn't like working dogs on Shetlands at first because they are not easily intimidated by dogs. we have had quite a few dog clinics at our house with all our sheep and by far people prefer the Shetlands. Aside from the dog side of the Shetlands, they are also a really nice breed of sheep who become very friendly with people and have great personalities.They would be more suited for only 5 acres as well since they are a much smaller breed of sheep than the Katahdin for instance/" I'm going to see if I can arrange a visit to this farm when I'm down in that area in June. I think seeing them up close and personal will be very useful. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G. Festerling Posted February 11, 2007 Report Share Posted February 11, 2007 This is funny as I have been wondering the same thing about shetlands. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
juliepoudrier Posted February 12, 2007 Report Share Posted February 12, 2007 I'll give you another opinion on Shetlands. I think I remember you saying you wanted to be able to do something with wool, which of course isn't really possible with hair sheep (katahdins and dorpers). Shetlands are well loved by handspinners for their very nice fleeces. They come in a variety of colors, so no need to even dye wool if you like natural tones. Of course you either have to learn to shear yourself or be able to find a shearer. That said, I consider Shetlands to be a more "primitive" breed of sheep. My definition of primitive is any of the breeds that retain a lot of the characteristics of the original type (i.e., sheep from the hill, although I know Shetlands aren't hill sheep, but you get my drift). This generally means that the sheep will be very hardy and able to live on marginal forage (of course there will be exceptions to this). It also generally means that they don't flock as well as some other breeds. I doubt that they ever get real heavy like dorpers can (from a dog working standpoint), but they are very smart and are more inclined than the average sheep to get out of fences or into places you don't want them to go (as someone else pointed out). We have a mixed flock of tunis, karakul, corriedale cross, BFL cross, tunis cross, Scottish blackface, and a shetland. By far the worst about getting out of and into things are the Scottish blackface and the shetland. But Joy likes the shetland so much that she wants more. They do become people friendly pretty easily and they are small enough to be easily handled. The shetland is not particularly aggressive toward the dogs, and certainly less so than the Scottish blackface and some of the crossbreds. Personally I think it's always a good idea to choose sheep that appeal to you. They do require right much maintenance and if you like them just for themselves, then the work they require is less onerous, if you know what I mean. I personally don't like hair sheep and wouldn't choose to have any (I have one dorper given to me as a bottle lamb--he's my token hair sheep but I have no desire for any other). I love Scottish blackface, but of all our sheep they are the biggest pains in the a** when it comes to handling and keeping them in enclosures. But I am willing to put up with that because I *really like* the breed. If I had, say, hair sheep that were as obnoxious as the Scotties they would have long since been sent down the road.... So if you really like Shetlands, especially after meeting them, I say go for it. If you decide they're not for you later, you can always sell them. And if they don't work out for your dogs, you can always add some hair sheep as training sheep. The one thing to consider is that being small Shetlands won't have a lot of meat on them should you wish to market them that way, but I think I remember you saying you wouldn't butcher anything anyway, so meat quality/quantity shouldn't be an issue for you. Just my two cents. J. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KrisK Posted February 12, 2007 Author Report Share Posted February 12, 2007 Wise words from all of you. This is what I've come to expect from folks on this board. I'm anxious to see the Shetlands because I think Julie said it best of all. Personally I think it's always a good idea to choose sheep that appeal to you. They do require right much maintenance and if you like them just for themselves, then the work they require is less onerous, if you know what I mean. I think that statement is true for a lot of things we do...like moving to the country, commuting to work, building things from scratch. I'll definitely keep the 'fence' issue in mind. Since the fencing will be all new, I'll be able to plan to make it as secure as possible. Thanks again Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill Fosher Posted February 13, 2007 Report Share Posted February 13, 2007 I hate Shetlands. Icky, horrid little things. No meat, weird wool, and hard to shear. Run away. Don't walk. Run. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest carol campion Posted February 13, 2007 Report Share Posted February 13, 2007 Shetlands are very light sheep that do not flock. They scatter. If you are planning on getting them primarily for an inxperienced dog and for dog training, think twice. They are ferocious mothers so when bred are very, very protective. Be careful with an inexperienced dog with them. If you want them primarily as an agricultural venture, they may suit you. They are small, rugged easy to feed and have interesting, colored wool. Carol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KrisK Posted February 13, 2007 Author Report Share Posted February 13, 2007 I've made arrangements to 'meet the sheep' in June. As for meat, I don't eat much meat, so there's no issue there And the owner has kindly offered to give me a primer on the fleece too. I'm really excited about meeting the 'icky horrid little things' Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
juliepoudrier Posted February 13, 2007 Report Share Posted February 13, 2007 Well, one person's "icky, horrid, little thing" is another's prize possession, so it's fortunate there are plenty of breeds out there to suit all sorts of tastes! (For example I have a friend who was given a few karkauls and hates them--thinks they're stupid, his ram won't breed them, etc., while I find mine quite delightful....). Have fun with your visit Kris. J. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kajarrel Posted February 13, 2007 Report Share Posted February 13, 2007 In looking at pictures of the breed, one thing that would concern me are the horns (I can't speak to their other qualities, good or bad). I have several rams/wethers with horns and will steer clear of them in the future. They get caught in (and can ruin) fences and, at least in the case of one of my rams, are a site where flies strike. With a small flock, these issues are less of a concern, but if you're thinking of expanding someday are probably issues you'll want to consider. Kim Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lora Posted February 16, 2007 Report Share Posted February 16, 2007 Well, here is my first ever post! Whoa yea! I have 10 acres and about three different breeds of sheep. Shetlands make up about 1/5 of my flock. I love my shetlands, their wool is awesome and the selling of said wool helps to pay the bills. None of my girls have horns.....nor the wether. My shetlands are people friendly, but they never ever get over their pop corn behavior....if something startles them...they freak! I really enjoy training dogs on them.....they never get dogged or fetchy. They always are looking for an escape. IF too much pressure is applied, they do not flock and if too little pressure is applied, they drift. If the dog underflanks or overflanks it is very obvious as sheep are trying to move in the direction of no dog control. They really make a dog think! That said, they are not for the faint of heart or starting dogs! I have a couple friends who have had shetlands...one sold hers and moved on to a more user friendly breed for training dogs. The other friend supplemented, as I have done, with other breeds. They are hard on fences....always testing and seeing if the grass is really greener..... hope that helps. If you are looking to train dogs.....think about maybe having a few "other" sheep to help get you to the point where the shetlands can work for you! If you are getting them for their wool....be sure to check if they are double coated (includes gaurd hairs) or sigle coated. Single is the more sought after here on the West Coast......makes for easier and nicer roving. Good luck! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KrisK Posted February 21, 2007 Author Report Share Posted February 21, 2007 I think I'll be meeting some Shetland sheep earlier than June! It's amazing what 'word of mouth' can do. I was talking to my aunt, who spoke to my cousin and apparently, she has friends who live about 1 hour from my place who have Shetlands and Jacobeans(sp?) as well as a llama and a emu or two! So I'm going to call tonight and hopefully make arrangements to see these sheep early in March! How cool is that! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
juliepoudrier Posted February 23, 2007 Report Share Posted February 23, 2007 I think I'll be meeting some Shetland sheep earlier than June! It's amazing what 'word of mouth' can do. I was talking to my aunt, who spoke to my cousin and apparently, she has friends who live about 1 hour from my place who have Shetlands and Jacobeans(sp?) as well as a llama and a emu or two! So I'm going to call tonight and hopefully make arrangements to see these sheep early in March! How cool is that! Great! And when Kim (I think) mentioned horns, watch out--Jacobs have some amazing horns, often more than two. Check out the Oklahoma State sheep breeds website to see pics of the Jacobs. FWIW, the American Jacob is listed on the American Livestock Breeds Conservancy conservation priority list. Have fun and let us know what you think! J. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mona Howard Posted February 23, 2007 Report Share Posted February 23, 2007 I agree with most of the pro's and the con's about Shetlands. There is a lady in Tucson Arizona that has had Shetlands for many, many years. I can send you a private email with her phone number if you like. I worked my novice dog on her sheep and they weren't bad to work. They weren't as flighty as Barbs. Price will depend on wool quality. A ewe with nice fleece would be pricey. This lady had three rams and they were pretty nasty. Just the perfect height to take out your kneecap. The little ewes were endearing. My main reservation would be at lambing. They are so tiny how could you get a hand in to help with a malpresented lamb? It would be a vet visit for sure. Also you couldn't use anything but a Shetland ram or the lambs might be too big for the ewe. I've always wanted some just because they are cute. I resisted the urge because there really are more suitable breeds for the dual purpose of training dogs and having lambs that are easy to sell. My one cents worth........... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
juliepoudrier Posted February 23, 2007 Report Share Posted February 23, 2007 Hey Mona, When my neighbor purchased part of a flock last year, the Shetland ewe she got was bred to either a corriedale or tunis ram (one lamb was white, the other had some red tips here and there, so maybe both rams bred her, and neither ram was small). At any rate, I had the same concerns about overly large lambs, but she had no problems. My memory is fuzzy, but ISTM that someone more experienced than me told me at the time that the size of the ram per se isn't the problem, but I can't remember the explanation. You do see an awful lot of shetland crosses out there when visiting farm websites, though, so I suspect it's not as big a problem as we might think. But then again, I'm no expert. J. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mona Howard Posted February 24, 2007 Report Share Posted February 24, 2007 Well okay then. I've heard the same thing about breeding a pony mare to a large horse stallion, that they can only grow so big a foal. Still I've seen plenty of mares having a hard time foaling when the stud was quite a bit bigger. It all depends on the pelvic opening versus the baby size. I have a little ewe that never needs assistance and a huge ewe that needed a little help. The lambs are about the same size so go figure... Know of anyone expecting pups? Would like a smoothcoat female...........M. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
donna frankland (uk) Posted February 25, 2007 Report Share Posted February 25, 2007 my friend breeds shetlands and hers flock, mine were shetland x gotland and they flocked. they were sooooo easy to tame too! i kept mine in with an electric fence which was fine UNLESS a lamb got out, nothing will stop a shetland ewe from following her lamb except a really really good fence. i never had to assist any of my ewes at lambing and the the year i helped my friend with her flock of 80 or so she helped one (i think) and i helped one. when i had to have a ewe put to sleep due to an injury another of my ewes adopted her 3 week old lamb before i even had time to worry about it! the wool is out of this world, the meat the best i have tasted though the joints are small. and the sheepskins tan beautifully! when i get sheep again i will be going for shetlands or balwens Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
donna frankland (uk) Posted February 25, 2007 Report Share Posted February 25, 2007 just finished reading the replies.... i have smaller hands than a man, but i am not dainty at all and i was fine when it came to assisting that 1 lambing. also here in the uk it is very common to use a commercial ram on shetland ewes to get a bigger finished lamb. they are stalwart mothers, though i personally wouldnt think it would be a good idea to use a commercial ram on a maiden ewe, and i also didnt let my girls breed in their 1st year Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eileen Stein Posted February 25, 2007 Report Share Posted February 25, 2007 > Wow! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
donna frankland (uk) Posted February 25, 2007 Report Share Posted February 25, 2007 << when i had to have a ewe put to sleep due to an injury another of my ewes adopted her 3 week old lamb before i even had time to worry about it! >> Wow! wow indeed! especially as mog (the ewe in question) had only lambed once before and already had twins of her own. she always had rams though, if i had kept my sheep i would definitely have kept any ewe lambs from her! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rebecca, Irena Farm Posted February 26, 2007 Report Share Posted February 26, 2007 It's the size of the head and shoulders of the ram in relation to the rest of him, that makes the biggest difference. That's why Hampshires aren't as popular as terminal sires as Suffolks (moderate head) and Texels (itty bitty head). I pulled a lamb for the first time in years this time - not surprising since about half my ewes are first timers this year. It was a single from a teeny tiny ewe - when I got the lamb coming out, it was like the clown trick where the knotted hankies keep coming and coming out of the sleeve. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KrisK Posted February 26, 2007 Author Report Share Posted February 26, 2007 Thanks to all of you who have given their experiences with Shetlands. Since I have the 'luxury' of time (although I want sheep NOW), and the fact that there is a flock much closer to where I live, I hope to be able to make a reasonable decision once I've actually seen them 'up close and personal'. I'm really pleased to know that Shetlands appear to be thriving up here which means they should do well (pasture, weather, etc) at my place. I have at least another 5-6 years to work, so I'm building into this venture slowly In the meantime, please keep the advice coming Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
painted_ponies Posted May 8, 2007 Report Share Posted May 8, 2007 I'll give you another opinion on Shetlands. I think I remember you saying you wanted to be able to do something with wool, which of course isn't really possible with hair sheep (katahdins and dorpers). Shetlands are well loved by handspinners for their very nice fleeces. They come in a variety of colors, so no need to even dye wool if you like natural tones. Of course you either have to learn to shear yourself or be able to find a shearer. Julie, an internet friend of mine who lives in the Shetlands says they shed their wool in spring, like a horse, and don't need shearing. Of course, she doesn't have summers like ours - they have heat strokes up there if it gets above 80F. Do you have to shear Shetlands in the southeastern US? KrisK - have you met your Shetlands yet? What did you think? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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