The work is the standard

[Erin Hischke]

Originally posted by juliepoudrier:

I must say it's refreshing to see a standard in which the work takes the lead and also in which the conformation requirements are vague (inclusive) enough as to include a variety of dogs and not just the typical cookie cutter type seen in most KC standards (I especially like the comment in the "ears" section: "Variation in ear set is common and of trivial significance." I guess you don't see all the gluing, tieing up, etc., that the KC border collie folk use to get the "perfect ear"!). Good for the ES folks!

 

J.

Glad to hear that you agree! This new standard is one of the things that prompted the split with the UKC--of course they are more interested in what the dog *looks* like.

 

Erin

[Eileen Stein]

>

 

You may already know this, but we were victims of the UKC as well. Prior to Wayne Cavanaugh, the UKC honored the request of the USBCC and other border collie organizations not to include border collies in their conformation program. They specifically told us they would not make any change in that regard without notifying us and getting our input. Consequently, a lot of border collie owners felt comfortable showing their dogs in UKC obedience classes. After Cavanaugh came in, they began offering conformation classes for border collies, without even notifying us of the change. They are not the threat to us that the AKC is, because they have so little influence, and they are not the threat to us that they are to you, because they were never a principal registry for border collies, but I regard them now as no better than the AKC in their policies. Too bad -- they once had a meaningful orientation toward the working dog, but no longer.

[Erin Hischke]

They are not the threat to us that the AKC is, because they have so little influence, and they are not the threat to us that they are to you, because they were never a principal registry for border collies, but I regard them now as no better than the AKC in their policies. Too bad -- they once had a meaningful orientation toward the working dog, but no longer. [/QB]

 

Their are three principal ES registries currently. UKC, International English Shepherd Registry, and Animal Research Foundation.

 

The IESR was started to be a registry for ES but in that last years they have gone from charging $300 (no kidding!) for a three generation pedigree to now when it is not even an option to get a certified pedigree. They are also taking 6 months to get simple litter registrations back.

 

ARF is an old ES registry but they are known mostly to register the black and tan lines, although others are also registerable. The original founder of ARF strongly preferred the black and tans.

 

So, we are left with UKC....

 

This is why the ES Club is trying to get it's own registry off the ground. Hopefully it will be functional by this fall, but the real task will be getting the breeders to use it. We also have the task of trying to get some of the old unregistered lines registered. Of course this causes a lot of problems with what is and what is *not* an ES. It's a very sticky time in ES history.

 

Erin

[SoloRiver]

Frankly, you're probably better off. I don't see the AKC trying to assimilate a breed that has no studbook.

[Erin Hischke]

Originally posted by SoloRiver:

Frankly, you're probably better off. I don't see the AKC trying to assimilate a breed that has no studbook.

Yes, I'm so glad the AKC never picked up the breed.

 

It's quite interesting to me how by selecting for farmwork (function) rather than looks (form), the look of the dog hasn't changed in 200 years! Most ES even still have a slight kink at the end of the tail--just like in so many photos from the distant past.

 

http://www.englishshepherds.net/past.htm

 

Erin

[MoonMaiden]

hi

 

I cannot even pretend to understand the politics and rules and regulations you are talking about but I thought I would put my un-doggyeducated two penceworth in anyway

 

When I read about the English sheepdogs, all I saw was a description of a border collie. That is how I have been brought up to understand a border collies role, that is how I have seen BC's worked here in the UK on our local farms. Same goes for my husband. Perhaps it is simply how the Brits percieve the breed I don't know.

 

It has been very interesting and bit frightening to learn how the 'border collie' has been trained, bred and re designed from the original working dogs of peaks and borders.

 

Very intesresting read - thank you.

 

Moon Maiden