Coming out of shell.... or not

[Cassidy]

Ok, so Ladybug I bought 7 yrs ago. I rescued Stormie (literally from a hurricane left to fend for herself, 5 yrs ago, and Delta came about 5 months ago. Delta exhibited such odd behaviors such as wouldnt walk from room to room, would not interact with me or any of the dogs, could not make any sudden movements around her or raise your voice, she was so timid it was pathetic. Well when i took her to the vet to have her checked out, the vet told me that it seems that she was severely abused. She estimated her to only be a year, however when she did start moving she moved so slowly that i thought perhaps she may have arthritis, as she moved exactly that way, as if she is constantly in pain. Well, now, after 5 months, she is starting to come out of her shell, however, she is still afraid of sudden movements and loud voices. I have not attempted to train her in anyway, bc right now, i just need her to trust me. Well, now she is finally starting to act like she is trying to come out of her shell. She walks round the house, and comes to me to put her head in my lap, I pet her and she then tries to cliimb in my lap. Then i start to play with her, talk to her and just tell her (in my baby talk voice) how much i love her and how cute she is, then she starts to actually try to play. By mouthing a lot and thereby accelerating into nipping, friendly of course. I know she is only trying to play, and because of the past abuse I am afraid to subject her to anymore fear. But, since she is now starting to nip, although minimally of course, and only during play, I know i need to teach her not to do that, but I am afraid to raise my voice. I do not know how I can get across to her that something she is doing is wrong, without her thinking that I am displeased, because i think she associates her behavior with her abuse. I say behavior rather than bad behavior, because it is evident that she was abused, it seems for anything. Because she is afraid to do anything. Just now trying to come out of her shell and I do not want to inhibit that. How can I start teaching her to behave without her withdrawing back into her shell?

[Sue R]

Have you read D'Elle's account of her Kelso, a rescue dog who was severely timid? There might be a lot of encouragement that you can get from that wonderful topic.

 

I think that a lot of what you are doing sounds very reasonable and producing results, but I think you do need to set limits, also. Rather than "raising your voice" use something like a squeal (a sharp "ouch" or something similar) or an "aht" (you know that sharp sound you can make that I can't spell).

 

Some dogs respond very well to the person "yelping" like a dog would when play has gotten too rough or gone too far. They will back off and oftentimes come back more gently. That would be the first thing I would try.

 

If it did not produce results, then I would go to the "aht" because at some point in time, she will have to be able to handle some small form of correction. Try it as quietly and softly as you find it will be effective. And, as soon as she responds in the way you want, even if it's just a little step in the right direction, encourage her to continue that improved behavior.

 

We have had a dog that we felt was abused from her behavior but we knew was not, but she was extremely responsive to sudden movements and noises from people. It does not help that some of these dogs, being as sensitive as they can be naturally to sounds and movement, may appear to have been abused when they may not have been, as in our dog's case. Truly abused dogs may not react to sounds and motion any more other than to try and become "inconspicuous" by inactivity, which could be an explanation for your young dog's slow motion and other issues.

 

There are many more people here with experience with dogs like this, who will give you much better advice and ideas than I have.

 

Very best wishes!

[Sue R]

One thing that I did not remember to say is to keep emotion out of your correction (which is not easy for some of us, like me). Correct, get a response, and move on. (If only I was good at this...)

[waffles]

You certainly do not need to raise your voice. Dogs have great hearing. If I understand correctly, she is nipping when you get excited and play with her. The second she does it, stop. Just stop moving. Don't reward her for nipping by continuing to play. If this is not enough to get the point across (like anything with dogs, one try won't be enough so don't give up) then use a soft but sharp/short noise to correct her. Also, how are you playing with her? Just with your hands and voice? Have you tried introducing toys? Playing may not be what she needs now-I know humans want that kind of interaction with their dogs but she may prefer to go for walks and swim, etc. What other activities does she like to do with you?

 

There may very well be a chance that she was not abused. Border Collie's can be very sensitive and she may have just never been exposed properly to the world. I know my dog was loved very much by his previous owners but they definitely neglected his needs. They never exposed him to much of the world and most people would have thought he was abused by his actions. Within a few months of me having him no one would know how scared he was of the world.

 

It sounds like you are a wonderful caring dog owner so keep up the good work!

[ShoresDog]

Good suggestions from Sue and Waffles. I also recommend the thread that D'elle has been keeping up on her rescue foster Kelso.

 

Kelso's story

 

I just went over there to get the link and found myself drawn in to some rereading. Kelso was so thoroughly shut down and timid initially. It's amazing to see the change in him over the past year. Slow but steady!

[bcnewe2]

Sounds like you are on the right track. I like the advise of stopping play interaction when she is doing something you don't like.

I also wanted to add that you need to lose the assumption that she was abused. Even if she was, she is not anymore and if you live in a world of thinking about her abuse before, you or she won't get to the future where she is not.

 

Dogs live in the now. We tend to live in our histories. She will do much better if you treat her like the dog you want her to be. Just go slowly and watch her bloom.

 

Kelso's story will really show you how far these wonderful dogs can come.

[Maralynn]

If she is mouthing a lot I would be redirecting her to toys that she can mouth/chew. Tug toys perhaps? Find a toy that she likes then make that the object of play/games. If she comes over to play then just reach for her toy. Then just abruptly quit playing if the teeth land on you.

[urge to herd]

Great advice. You can try something a bit more complicated. Choose a word or sound that means 'stop that'. The clear but soft 'ah ah!' or 'eh' is good. 'No' isn't the best idea, it's used too frequently in everyday speech.

 

Start using that noise whenever she does something you don't want her to do. Say it once, distract her or whatever needs to happen, then move on. This part teaches her that a correction is safe and is actually good information for her to have.

 

The next part is to acclimate her to sudden movements, loud noises, unexpected things appearing. If you use treats, fine, if you don't use treats but use some other method of reinforcement that works for your girl, then use that.

 

You're going to make the loud noise/sudden movement, etc, unexpectedly. Then you quickly give her a reinforcement that makes her happy. You're not so much training a behavior as changing her response to noise/movement, etc from 'dangerdangerdanger' to 'no big deal and there might even be a treat involved.' This kind of re-setting of her automatic responses to new things takes time and consistency. If she's basically a mentally healthy dog, she'll get it. If you're not seeing any changes for the better after a few months, think about consulting a veterinary behaviorist.

 

Agent Gibbs was very skittish. Sudden appearances of things he hadn't seen before alarmed him quite a bit. We went into the routine I described above, and he got much calmer over time. A few months ago we passed a balloon that had gotten caught on a fence post. When we first got him, that would have worried him no end. This time, he shied back when he first saw it, then went up to the balloon, poked it with his nose and looked at me for a cookie. Then poked it again because I wasn't producing the cookie quickly enough!

 

Start the noise training at a fairly low intensity, then increase slowly. Let her watch you do the same types of things with your other dogs.

 

Delta may have been abused, she may have been isolated and not exposed to such things, she may have a very, very sensitive and alert temperment, or a combination of any of those things. You get to work with what's right in front of you.

 

Good luck! Let us know how you and Delta work out.

 

Ruth and Agent Gibbs

[Cassidy]

Thank you for all the great advice. I will be doing those things with Delta. I have went back and read the whole account of Kelso, and I could not believe what I was reading. Everything about Kelso is almost identical to the way Delta is. I really found it helpful, thank you D'Elle for posting that. Although, Delta is just now starting to try to play with me, she also tries to play with Ladybug and Stormie but neither of them wants to play with her. They act like they do not want to have anything to do with her at all. Although they do not fight with her or give her any negative attention, they dont give her attention at all. As for toys,she does not seem interested. She watches Ladybug catch the ball (almost constantly) but never acts interested, however, the only thing she does seem to do with a toy is to chew it to pieces. She will fing anything she can get a hold of and chew it and destroy it. She has chewed shoes, slippers, and even chewed wholes in socks, and also loves to chew cords as well. I have to keep all cords out of the way or she will chew them. She has also chewed rugs.

[Sue R]

Make sure that she has appropriate things to chew on - I don't recall but she may well be of teething age, and some dogs just love to chew. We use raw beef bones because that's what we have - pork or lamb bones may be available to you, and raw chicken (with bones) is another alternative (some people freeze or partly-freeze the chicken for more "chew value").

 

I find neck bones like you can find in the store (they are split) to be particularly useful - they provide lots of chew, do not contain the rich marrow that leg bones have, are less hard than the weight-bearing (leg) bones, and provide good teeth-cleaning while the dog chews. You would not believe the size of neck bone that Dan can demolish in 10-15 minutes. When he's done, his chewing is satisfied, at least for the short term.

 

Unlike artificial chew toys, raw bones are all-natural, have some nutritional value, and tend to be naturally attractive to dogs - although some dogs need to learn that these are good things.

 

The advice about stopping motion, ending the game, not encouraging the play that leads to the nipping, and so on, is spot on. You don't want to be encouraging or rewarding that behavior but you do need to channel the energy and desire to interact with you into positive play. Try training and other games that challenge the mind - that sort of thing will tire most youngsters (and oldsters) out faster than anything physical!

[beachdogz]

Time and patience. My newest rescue (shelter) dog had his one-year anniversary with us yesterday! He did not know how to play with dogs or toys or people. Doors were very scary to him (he couldn't anticipate them opening and closing). He was here 6 or 7 months before I felt comfortable taking him to an obedience class. He is currently attending agility and obedience....and it has helped him blossom!! Recently he has started playing ball...a HUGE step for him. I find him regressing periodically, as most learning does (i.e. sometimes he gets "skittish" with sudden movements, but we work through it and then it's fine.) I doubt that he was abused (hit) although I do believe he was caged most of his life. Every day gets a little bit better. We are still waiting for him to "get it" and play with the other dogs...but that is taking longer. This dog has taught me to be patient...it will come.

 

My second rescue came from a home (she was a courtesy listing) and believe it or not, I thought she was longer to adjust than my shelter/stray dogs. It almost seems like the shelter/stray dogs are grateful for their new home, while my second one was almost resentful -- having been taken from a real home to a totally new one. However, she has also adjusted in time and also is in agility class.

 

Re the correction, using a verbal eh-eh will be helpful...and depending on the problem, I also will resort to simply distracting and redirecting the problem to another more appropriate activity.

 

It really sounds like your Delta is adjusting fine...just remember that it take time (sometimes lots of time) for them to really adjust.

[bcnewe2]

I have a destroyer. She can destroy anything in short order. She knows what she can "chew" and not chew so that's a plus but sheNEEDS to destroy i mean chew allot.

I have found the best bang for my buck is antlers. They aren't cheap but they last longer that anything else I've tried. I don't like her eating things as much as just chewing but she will consume the things she destroys. Rope toys are gone in less than a day. A Hoof less than an hour. We don't do rawhides. The antlers don't dissapear near as quickly. a big one lasts over a week and that's with the other dogs taking a turn on it too. I haven't found a toy she can't destroy.

If you get some, order them on the net cause buying them in the pet store will break your wallet quickly.

 

Good luck.