SS Cressa Posted March 14, 2012 Report Share Posted March 14, 2012 Troy is now in EXC A Standard and Jumpers with Weaves! So proud of Troy its starting to feel as if we are finally making break throughs with him. First things a pic of us and the judge with his new title! So glad we are not stuck there all day! Thanks to Jill Roberts for awarding Troy his last two jumpers legs! He got a 4th place and a 1st place. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SS Cressa Posted March 14, 2012 Author Report Share Posted March 14, 2012 We took the pic after novice class was over! That is why there is only 6 weaves in the background. Ok onto CU or crate games... 1st question: i been working on LAT game with with Troy but i feel as if i am doing something wrong. Are you suppose to reward the looking a stuff or the looking at you? I have been rewarding the looking at stuff but Troy does 1of 2 things. Either he refuses to take his eyes off me or he has a hard time breaking his concentration off the object. Maybe i am wrong but i want to make Troy more relax and confident not obsess with me or an object! 2nd question: i am tempted to try some crate games with Troy and Cressa. Have you any experience with it? How did you feel it work? Did it transfer to competition? Also if you had a crate screamer... did it help with them? At home Troy is good at a dog show he screams and howls. I hear he has a pitiful howl and its so sweet sounding. >.< he only does it when i am away. The second he see me he seems to quiet unless he is realy worked up then its a soft whine. At agility class, in a crate he whines/cries, with a crate open and him choosing to stay in its just a soft whine, if i put him on a mat/table/define but loose spot he is quiet and focus(at my last agility class Troy broke from his spot once in the hour long class). Cept for at some point at class he does need to be kennel and when he is he cant relax and settle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gcv-border Posted March 14, 2012 Report Share Posted March 14, 2012 Congrats on the move into Excellent A! The dreaded Open mightmare is over. Actually, I know some people move smoothly through Open, but I have heard A LOT of handlers whine about how long it took them to move out of Open. Jovi Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SS Cressa Posted March 14, 2012 Author Report Share Posted March 14, 2012 The only thing i hate about open is I am at the trial all day! Somehow i am lucky the one who dog is the first dog running(normally Cressa in EXC 16in) AND the last dog running(Troy in open jumper on 24in). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mtnfrank Posted March 14, 2012 Report Share Posted March 14, 2012 We took the pic after novice class was over! That is why there is only 6 weaves in the background. Ok onto CU or crate games... 1st question: i been working on LAT game with with Troy but i feel as if i am doing something wrong. Are you suppose to reward the looking a stuff or the looking at you? I have been rewarding the looking at stuff but Troy does 1of 2 things. Either he refuses to take his eyes off me or he has a hard time breaking his concentration off the object. Maybe i am wrong but i want to make Troy more relax and confident not obsess with me or an object! I'm certainly no CU expert but just finished watching the DVD yesterday so its rather fresh in my mind (bought the book, was sent the DVD by mistake) As far as I understand, it is not wrong to click when looking back at you but it is better to click when your dog is looking at "that", then he has to look back at you to get his reward. Goal is a quick look at "that" then back at mommy for the reward. Where/how are you playing the game? Are you asking for too much? Try making it easy for him to get the game (eg at home on his mat) then progressively increase the criteria, not on his mat, increasingly disruptive things, then outside on his mat, then increase criteria, and finally at agility on his mat, then increase criteria. Makes sense? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Root Beer Posted March 14, 2012 Report Share Posted March 14, 2012 The game is Look at That, so you do click when the dog is looking at something. That said, it is a behavior chain and that chain (for the dog) is "see it", know it's not something I am going to engage with right now, orient back to handler. The dog learns this by turning back to you immediately for the treat upon hearing the click. So, while you are clicking when the dog looks at something, the immediate result of the CU Game is going to be having the dog oriented toward you. You can use LAT to build a relaxed response around triggers. For instance, Dean learned to be calm and relaxed around dogs doing Agility (instead of getting stimulated, barking, lunging, etc). But when we were actually using the game for him to learn that, he was directly oriented to me. Later, as he desensitized to the trigger, he could hang out around dogs doing Agility and was not directly oriented to me. Does that make sense? LAT is an active exercise. If you are looking to have the dog "chill out", mat work might be more appropriate to the situation, with LAT mixed in only when a particular trigger is in play. ETA: If his concentration is on you, unbroken, you can take that as a signal that he doesn't need to play the game anymore at that moment. If he can't take his eyes off the trigger, raise the quality of the reinforcer or lower criteria by increasing distance, etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gooddogs74 Posted March 15, 2012 Report Share Posted March 15, 2012 Regarding LAT, it is extremely important to make sure you have built a strong foundation on NEUTRAL objects prior to introducing the cue to potential triggers. Click for looking at the object, which should trigger an immediate reorientation to you. If done correctly, the look will diminish to perhaps a quick flick of the eyes. If the dog is staring at a trigger and cannot reorient, the dog is considered over threshold and you need to increase your distance or in some other way decrease the distraction of the trigger (visual barrier, etc). Look at that is a brilliant game. We go through Crate Games in my Focus and Impulse Control class. They are a lot of fun! The games themselves are more oriented towards drive, impulse control, focus, but in the DVD, SG does address noisy dogs in the crate. She employs visual barriers (covers), gradually uncovering as the dog learns to relax in the crate. She goes through it in more detail in the dvd. I also think there is some value to the CU mat work, which builds relaxation, and then the placement of the mat in the crate will transfer some of that relaxation to the crate itself. AND congrats on your legs!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SS Cressa Posted March 15, 2012 Author Report Share Posted March 15, 2012 Not trying to be difficult but a couple more questions : For LAT: Is there a command you use when doing LAT? Or is it suppose to be automatic? What do you do if you dog doesnt want to look away from you in neutral settings?(yes i have had session where Troy doesnt take his eyes off me, without even attempting LAT. Heck sometimes i am lucky if he blinks!) What happens if the LAT game isnt calming them down but getting them more worked up?(when i do try LAT it doesnt seem to reassures him if anything it seems as if i put him on a different high levels?!) Dont get me wrong whatever we are doing does seem to help him, i just thought the results should be different then what i am getting. As to the SG suggestions for screamer... i was wondering if anyone has dealt with one useing her methods and if they were successful. >.<I dont know what he will do, but he does have a background of not stopping. I did talk to one person who was in a SG class but it seem as of the dogs became quiet in about 1 class setting and they just let the dog scream itself out. My concern is Troy might have unlimited reserves. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Root Beer Posted March 15, 2012 Report Share Posted March 15, 2012 Not trying to be difficult but a couple more questions : For LAT: Is there a command you use when doing LAT? Or is it suppose to be automatic? LAT is interesting when it comes to cueing. It's completely different from any other kind of behavior because it is an invitation to play the game, not a "you must do it or else" kind of thing. You actually want to get to the point where the dog is like, "I've looked already!! I'm not looking anymore". But, yes, I put LAT on cue. I use "Where's the puppy?" as my cue. It doesn't matter what I want my dog to look at (a dog, a car, a person, etc.), it's all "the puppy" when I'm cueing LAT. I've known people who have used "check it out", "what's that?", or even "look at that". I put it on cue so I can start the game when I see a need for it. When I was using it to desensitize Tessa to cars, we stood in the training school driveway, out of the way of the cars, and as one started to pull into the driveway, but still far enough away that she wouldn't see it before I started to play, I would cue LAT and we would play as the car gradually approached. On the other hand, LAT is also a game that the dog can start and when that happens, obviously, it is uncued. I used to play uncued with Maddie a lot when she was in her senior years and she got just a little persnickity about some dogs in her presence. Her eyes would go to the dog, and we would play LAT for a few reps, until she didn't care about the dog anymore. What do you do if you dog doesnt want to look away from you in neutral settings?(yes i have had session where Troy doesnt take his eyes off me, without even attempting LAT. It will probably be helpful to stop thinking in terms of the dog looking "away from you" and start to think in terms of the dog looking "at" something. Even in a neutral setting, give your dog something to look at. It can be another person that he knows well, creating a low level distraction. Or you can play at a window in your house with something interesting outside. "Neutral" just means the dog is not anywhere near the ballpark of threshold. You could always take a drive and park someplace there are interesting sights to see from the car and play (obviously, don't play this while driving). If all else fails, you can have an object behind your back, like a book or even a toy that the dog is interested in, but won't go insane about. Say your LAT cue, pull it out, click when the dog looks at it, and treat. But, always give your dog something to look at when working on this, even in a neutral setting. What happens if the LAT game isnt calming them down but getting them more worked up?(when i do try LAT it doesnt seem to reassures him if anything it seems as if i put him on a different high levels?!) That's where I would pair LAT with some mat work, and I would use LAT sparingly in those settings. Do you have the new CU Puppy Book? If not, I highly recommend it. There is a "Take a Breath" exercise in there that could help with this, along with some better explanations of mat work, which I think would help Troy a lot, based on what you describe. Dont get me wrong whatever we are doing does seem to help him, i just thought the results should be different then what i am getting. The results that you see will change over time, as you use the game in different situations and it becomes a more ordinary thing that you blend into different situations. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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