Aggression-Dr. Jesus Rosales-Ruiz and Kellie Snider video

[KJ]

Hi all and Happy 2008.

Upon the endless mountain to climb, keeping our dog alive and trying to rehabilitate him (he's an Aussie with impulse control aggression) I feel I really have come to a halt in progress and thought maybe someone on the board would be able to recommend a video. The one I am considering is "Dr. Jesus Rosales-Ruiz and Kellie Snider CONSTRUCTIONAL AGGRESSION TREATMENT

Shaping your way out of aggression" and it is $125.00. So before I do this, I thought I'd check here.

 

We have made progress over the past 4 years using mostly desensitization and positive training methods. I have had immense help with Shep and support for my brain and heart over the years here on this board. HAving a dog like Shep provides a uniquely difficult road. Our history includes, 1 insane "behaviourist", 1 awesome behaviourist who saved us all in the beginning, 1 pretty good regular positive dog trainer *willing* to work with us, one insane dog trainer who was *willing* but went against all the methods we had been using, resulting in a bit of a setback. Then there's the handful of folks willing to shock him and then the ones to say to euthanize him. Then there's me, as an average Joe with a pile of books and sheets on protocols etc. The work I have done comes simply from being thrown into the fire. I had no prior knowledge of dog behaviour. Turns out I don't have much of a talent for it either, as I am kind of an unorganized person, with my own business, and the consistant structure required to really see success with Shep isn't anywhere near where it should be. Keep in mind over the years I have tried everything under the sun to find him a better situation, where he can thrive. As you all know, no one wants a dog like Shep.

 

All that said, he's improved a lot, he is wonderfully sweet. He cannot be vetted (posted a few times about this-we have had 3 vets break up with us-now we have one a new one that hasn't 'tried' yet) without an army of staff and meds and agony on the dogs behalf. With this comes a horrid fear, of what if he gets severly injured or something happens and #1 we can't see his regular vet and #2 our emergency clinic already said they cannot deal with a dog like him. As it is he is hypothyroid and we are just winging the dosage based on some old bloodwork. So potentially that is a disaster waiting to happen. He cannot be kenneled resulting in that we have not gone anywhere overnight, for 2 years since being kicked out of our kennel. Finding a place that takes dogs but is also remote is difficult. Our dog as never met a child as this is too risky, resulting in our extended family never coming over for the last 4 years and making for some really uncomfortable attitudes towards us and our choices. So our life has sort of revolved on doing what we can, when we can and keeping him alive.

 

Ok that is a really breif history. I know that there are many experts and people who have had success rehabilitating aggressive dogs. I don't know if Shep will be one of them but at least he has a good life thus far, allbeit very sheltered. His future is uncertain still. The experts, professional etc. are so knowledgable, very few will get in the trenches with you.

 

DVDs are one avenue I haven't tried. So I thought if anyone has a good one, that deals with aggression and isn't Cesar Milan, I'd love to know about it.

 

Thanks again

Kim

[mbc1963]

Wow! Tough job you took on! I'm impressed with your hard work!

 

I wish I could be more help in evaluating that video you are thinking about buying. I haven't seen it. My dog was (is) fear-reactive (looks like aggression), and I know how you feel - the first few weeks I honestly thought he might be a hopeless dog. He's come a long way, but I still have to manage the environments I take him in.

 

I'm sure you've heard of them... but the books that were most helpful to me early on were "Cautious Canine" and "Feisty Fido" and any book by Patricia McConnell, as well as Suzanne Clothier's "Bones Would Rain from the Sky." I later read "Bringing Light to Shadow" by Pamela Dennison, in which she describes her own struggled to save an aggressive BC. She's since written up protocols for dealing with aggression, as well. I particularly liked that she described her own mistakes with her dog... which might allow someone else to avoid them!

 

Good luck! Sounds like you've got a particularly tricky case on your hands.

 

Mary

[Laurae]

I haven't seen the video, but Dr. Jesus Rosales-Ruiz and Kellie Snider are well-respected in positive training circles and they're recommended by Pat Miller (who wrote The Power of Positive Dog Training and is, imo, one of the best all-around dog trainers). I've also been on a few lists with Kellie Snider, and while I didn't agree with everything she said, she and Rosales-Ruiz definitely know what they're talking about. I think it sounds like a good investment. For impulse-control issues, I'd also recommend Control Unleashed by Leslie McDevitt. It's a book geard toward the agility crowd, but has fantastic info (plus some great exercises) in it for any dog having trouble controlling their impulses—like my Sophie girl (we're largely past her everyday reactivity issues, but I feel your pain). Good luck with Shep. He's lucky to have you.

[urge to herd]

Hey, Kim,

 

I haven't seen the DVD, but Kellie Snyder used to post a lot on the ClickerSolutions board, and I was always impressed with her, both in terms of a commitment to positive training, and her reality based approach. This particular DVD has been discussed recently and the opinion of one of the moderators was that it was a good approach, but a demanding one for the humans.

 

I hope this doesn't sound too harsh, but from your posts in the past, I know you and your hubby have 'paid' a lot to have Shep with you. "Paid" in terms of your relationships with family and professionals, and each other, not just financially. The really hard question is, is this how you want to live? Unable to have your family visit and having a dog who is so terrified and has such health problems? I do applaud your commitment towards helping Shep, you've done 100 times more than most dog owners would.

 

Bottom line, is this a good life for Shep? Having gone through so many options and still not seeing a major change in quallity of life for Shep? Do you feel able to maintain a demanding training regimen and probable high level management for the next 10 yrs or so?

 

No one else can decide but you and your husband. With my own quirky dog, I've got a very clear limit for Shoshone's behavior. I do everything in my power to help her stay on this side of that line, but if all that managment, training and medication fails someday, then my decision is already made. And her issue isn't people aggression. If you haven't already made that kind of decision, it would be worth thinking through.

 

Whatever you decide, know that those of us who've been around and 'seen' what you've done for Shep will not judge you harshly. You've gone many extra miles for him.

 

Ruth n the BC3

[KJ]

Hey, Kim,

 

I haven't seen the DVD, but Kellie Snyder used to post a lot on the ClickerSolutions board, and I was always impressed with her, both in terms of a commitment to positive training, and her reality based approach. This particular DVD has been discussed recently and the opinion of one of the moderators was that it was a good approach, but a demanding one for the humans.

 

I hope this doesn't sound too harsh, but from your posts in the past, I know you and your hubby have 'paid' a lot to have Shep with you. "Paid" in terms of your relationships with family and professionals, and each other, not just financially. The really hard question is, is this how you want to live? Unable to have your family visit and having a dog who is so terrified and has such health problems? I do applaud your commitment towards helping Shep, you've done 100 times more than most dog owners would.

 

Bottom line, is this a good life for Shep? Having gone through so many options and still not seeing a major change in quallity of life for Shep? Do you feel able to maintain a demanding training regimen and probable high level management for the next 10 yrs or so?

 

No one else can decide but you and your husband. With my own quirky dog, I've got a very clear limit for Shoshone's behavior. I do everything in my power to help her stay on this side of that line, but if all that managment, training and medication fails someday, then my decision is already made. And her issue isn't people aggression. If you haven't already made that kind of decision, it would be worth thinking through.

 

Whatever you decide, know that those of us who've been around and 'seen' what you've done for Shep will not judge you harshly. You've gone many extra miles for him.

 

Ruth n the BC3

 

Ruth you have been there for us this whole time and your input and others means more than you could know. I appreciate your candor. You asked, "is this a good life for Shep?" It's way better then he had...it is by no means perfect. His saftey is tenuous so that part is bad. His progress keeps me going. I've had comments said to me like, "if you hadn't told me about Shep i would never had known there was a problem." We have had people over and he's made me quite proud. Our friends get instructions and he plays with them all but part of the deal is, no staring into his eyes. Of course during times with company I am always right there watching every cue. He's a good boy, he really is. He's really fun and super eager. He's so silly too. He's a great dog.

 

Your observations on what we have 'paid' are 100% correct. The cost has been immense really Ruth. Mostly it takes a toll with an overiding anxiety. Just today I had a spat with my husband. He says I don't put enough faith in Shep. Where I see what I do, like choose to NOT walk him in our neighborhood, as managment, not setting him up to fail, not letting him practice aggression etc., my husband sees it as he'll never get anywhere being so sheltered. The cost has been high but there have been rewards...because Shep is a beautiful soul. He has given a lot too. At the end of the day, I couldn't live with myself if I chose to kill him at this juncture. I don't know how I would withstand that one. So you asked, "Is this how you want to live?"....no it's not. But I can't live with killing him either so, we'll get through day be day. That's how I have to deal with it.

 

thanks

all

[Soda-pop]

I've not seen the dvd but I've seen Dr. Jesus ...-Ruiz at clickerexpo and he was easy to understand and quite knowledgeable. I would personally feel comfortable listening to his advice.

[Ms.DaisyDuke]

Hi Kim, I haven't read any previous posts as I am new to the boards, but I thought I would give my two cents. My dog has fear issues, partly because of someone I lived with and partly because she didn't come with any vaccinations and in a city of 1 million people, i was a bit cautious to socialize her and she is a soft, soft dog. I have read just about every book by Patricia O'Connell, and I would highly recommend them, they also have DVD's on their site as well. The booklets are really cheap as they are not really that big, but man do they ever give you an idea of what your dog is thinking. I will be putting Daisy into classes that are based on her teachings for dog reactive dogs in the spring since her problems are mostly dog based. I can usually get her i love with a human within 5 minutes of them entering the house as long as they understand the whole no looking into the eyes part...but some people just don't get it.

ANYWAY, I hope that either option you go with helps and I applaud you for all the love and confidence you have shown your dog so far and best of luck!

Julie

[Alaska]

Hi Kim,

 

Happy new year! Good to hear from you again, and good to hear so many nice things about Shep. I wasn't aware of that video before you posted, but I did a search and now I'm intrigued. I suspect you could get the essentials of the protocol without watching (and paying for) 5 DVDs, but for me there is no substitute for seeing someone knowledgeable apply a protocol correctly with a variety of dogs, so although my initial response was "Gosh, it sure seems like she could find better ways to use $125," now I'm not so sure. Is there, by any chance, a trainer or club near you that you could split the cost with? Our club has a training library, which can be an economical way to get access to resources like this. But your question wasn't about the cost but about the value of this DVD set, and from what I can see it does appear to have new information that folks in your situation are finding valuable. If you do purchase it, I'd love to hear what you think.

 

About Ruth's post: I think she makes good points, but I also think the bottom line is not about Shep but about you. There are plenty of people who deal with lifestyle restrictions, whether because of their dogs, their kids, or their own limitations. Some people don't travel because they can't afford it; you don't travel because you can't leave Shep. The question is whether you can deal with these restrictions, and it sounds like you can, so I say carry on. I'm really impressed that you've got the management thing down -- that really changes the picture, because it largely removes the concern that Shep might harm someone who isn't part of the group of people who've made the conscious decision to be around him. The vet thing is a worry, but so is driving down the road never knowing if the car coming towards you is being piloted by a drunk driver. The future always holds the potential for bad things to happen, but most of the time they don't, so my philosophy is to try to take reasonable precautions (e.g. not driving on New Year's Eve!) and beyond that just take life as it comes. I don't mean to belittle the challenge you've taken on, just to observe that, on the grand scale of things, it seems like you're handling it well enough, at least for now.

[KJ]

Hi Alaska

Thanks for your input too and your ideas.

 

"I suspect you could get the essentials of the protocol without watching (and paying for) 5 DVDs, but for me there is no substitute for seeing someone knowledgeable apply a protocol correctly with a variety of dogs,"

 

I think this is the reason to buy it. I would imagine I have most of this information in my stacks of info but to see it in practice I know could only be beneficial. If I decide to buy it, I will certainly give a review of what it's like and how it helped (hopefully).

 

Also your point about restrictions...we live with them, as this path was our choice but it gets really hard particularly with stinging comments from relatives.

 

About 'uncertainty'...this is what life is really and one can only plan for so much. Gray areas have a way of paralyzing me sometimes...the 'what ifs' and I have to make a real effort to not let that get ahead of me. The same goes for Shep and his life. While we have come a long way, I see all the places we haven't gone. I know in my heart, had he had a better, more experienced person to rehab him, he'd be much better off. It's just a fact and is a hard one to swallow, given that I know he isn't a hopeless case. I've immersed myself in the world of aggressive dogs and he's pretty mild with the exception of a few areas. I still ask myself, why couldn't he have landed in the able hands of any of the dozens of people that rehab aggressive dogs? There seems to be so many out there that have written books, thesis, studied and made DVD'S and TV Shows!!!

 

I wish too I could see life with Shep in a more clinical manner. I'm human, he's a damaged dog, and I will do all I can, and that's that. I wish it was black and white in my head. It just gets so much more complicated than that. We're so intertwined. Maybe that's where I fail is being too, close. There is no distance with Shep and me. Am I sounding crazy here? For instance, I live right by the Chesapeake Bay and I live within the radius of a variety of scenarios if we ever needed to evacuate. To WHERE? Who would take Shep? No one. What shelter could I go to? None. All the Katrina nightmare runs thru my head. I think of these things and I think, well I'd just muzzle him of course, but for how long can you muzzle a dog? So I'd have to go down with the ship, or the Shep in this case. Truly I am not a paranoia freak, but these things enter my mind. Perhaps I need to figure a way to separate somewhat from Shep.

 

Didn't mean to make this such a thread about self refelection WHOA. But I appreciate members giving me other ways of seeing my situation. I think different perspectives are always valuable.

[KJ]

Hi Kim, I haven't read any previous posts as I am new to the boards, but I thought I would give my two cents. My dog has fear issues, partly because of someone I lived with and partly because she didn't come with any vaccinations and in a city of 1 million people, i was a bit cautious to socialize her and she is a soft, soft dog. I have read just about every book by Patricia O'Connell, and I would highly recommend them, they also have DVD's on their site as well. The booklets are really cheap as they are not really that big, but man do they ever give you an idea of what your dog is thinking. I will be putting Daisy into classes that are based on her teachings for dog reactive dogs in the spring since her problems are mostly dog based. I can usually get her i love with a human within 5 minutes of them entering the house as long as they understand the whole no looking into the eyes part...but some people just don't get it.

ANYWAY, I hope that either option you go with helps and I applaud you for all the love and confidence you have shown your dog so far and best of luck!

Julie

 

Well Shep was dx'd with mild impulse control but in short he can be people aggressive. He's just terrified and will fight back if he thinks you are up to something. So it's pretty easy to predict. He would never just go after anyone, it's if he feels challenged. In my own close observations I swear it's a fear pf pain bing inflicted on him that makes him go nuts.

[SnickerKitten]

I was in the middle of writing an absolutely brilliant post and did something accidentally to make it go bye bye. Darn.

 

Anyway...

 

 

Kim, I truly admire your perseverance with Shep and he has definately found an angel in you. I just wanted to say that more than most people, I totally understand the isolation you're living in because of him. My son was diagnosed with autism at the age of 3 and the road up to that diagnosis and following it was extremely difficult. He kept me very isolated because his behavior was unmanageable. It took me several years to find someone that was able to teach me how to manage his behavior. We were then very fortunate to find a doctor that follows the "Defeat Autism Now!" protocol. I'm very relieved to say that as long as we follow the protocol with him no one can tell that he was ever diagnosed with autism. I don't say he's cured because if his diet slips or his supplementation isn't given to him he does regress horribly. However, he is not longer on any drug type of medication- only nutritional.

 

My point is that we were isolated as well, and thought we were doomed to stay that way. There WAS a way out of it for us that ended up being acceptable to us. Somewhere I hope there is an answer for you as well with Shep. Sorry I can't be much help but you definately have my support!

 

Lori

[KJ]

I was in the middle of writing an absolutely brilliant post and did something accidentally to make it go bye bye. Darn.

 

Anyway...

Kim, I truly admire your perseverance with Shep and he has definately found an angel in you. I just wanted to say that more than most people, I totally understand the isolation you're living in because of him. My son was diagnosed with autism at the age of 3 and the road up to that diagnosis and following it was extremely difficult. He kept me very isolated because his behavior was unmanageable. It took me several years to find someone that was able to teach me how to manage his behavior. We were then very fortunate to find a doctor that follows the "Defeat Autism Now!" protocol. I'm very relieved to say that as long as we follow the protocol with him no one can tell that he was ever diagnosed with autism. I don't say he's cured because if his diet slips or his supplementation isn't given to him he does regress horribly. However, he is not longer on any drug type of medication- only nutritional.

 

My point is that we were isolated as well, and thought we were doomed to stay that way. There WAS a way out of it for us that ended up being acceptable to us. Somewhere I hope there is an answer for you as well with Shep. Sorry I can't be much help but you definately have my support!

 

Lori

 

Thanks Lori. It's really great to hear you found a program to help your son and your family. What a great success to have his condition be treated with nutrition-and I bet a huge relief too. It should be a lesson for all of us really. I appreciate you telling me your story b/c as with others it's like I need a spirit boost or whatever...to continue working with him and sometimes when your mired in it, it just gets dark in aggressive-dog-land. So seriously while many times I post on this board, sometimes to give advice (rarely as I don't feel so qualified) I get nutrition/food advice or medical stuff but often it's just to hear how others handle various situation. Its so valuable.

 

If I tell non-dog people our journey with Shep their eyes just glaze over. So here, I can't see the glazed eyes but just can read the willing words!!

 

Thanks again

[Ms.DaisyDuke]

I just read your reply to Alaska about evacuation plans etc. and going down with the ship and it broke my heart! Any you know what, if it comes down to it, you can come to Canada! Two pissy dogs in a house with a couple of crazy people who love them...couldn't get any better!

Of course I am trying to make light of the situation, but by the sounds of things you have made progress with him and that is a good thing, don't let it get you down. For all means, buy the DVD's. I agree with you about having the information, I've read so many books it's not even funny, but to see the method in action, to see how the situations should be handled, that is the valuble part I think. Let us all know how they turn out!!

[KJ]

I haven't seen the video, but Dr. Jesus Rosales-Ruiz and Kellie Snider are well-respected in positive training circles and they're recommended by Pat Miller (who wrote The Power of Positive Dog Training and is, imo, one of the best all-around dog trainers). I've also been on a few lists with Kellie Snider, and while I didn't agree with everything she said, she and Rosales-Ruiz definitely know what they're talking about. I think it sounds like a good investment. For impulse-control issues, I'd also recommend Control Unleashed by Leslie McDevitt. It's a book geard toward the agility crowd, but has fantastic info (plus some great exercises) in it for any dog having trouble controlling their impulses—like my Sophie girl (we're largely past her everyday reactivity issues, but I feel your pain). Good luck with Shep. He's lucky to have you.

 

Hi Laurae

Can you elaborate on the things that you didn't agree with regarding Kellie Snider? And thanks for the rec on the Control Unleashed-think I'll add that to my new list. I get hesitant though b/c sometimes new books just confuse my focus, but I know it's all worth a read. I purchased the Treat and Train developed by Sophia Yin and I watched that DVD and then never used it b/c it's tough with two dogs to use that device.

 

So thanks again.

 

Kim

[Lenajo]

Can't the vet give you a tranquilizer for him before he comes in to the vet? I know several people who give their pets a predose of medication before taking them in - usually some pills in food. He has to be vetted, at the very least his legally required Rabies vaccine. You can't keep giving him medications without knowing what they are doing to him either.

 

I'm also reading in this that Shep will hurt you as well as others if challanged? Is this right? What does "up to something" mean in his terms?

[KJ]

Can't the vet give you a tranquilizer for him before he comes in to the vet? I know several people who give their pets a predose of medication before taking them in - usually some pills in food. He has to be vetted, at the very least his legally required Rabies vaccine. You can't keep giving him medications without knowing what they are doing to him either.

 

I'm also reading in this that Shep will hurt you as well as others if challanged? Is this right? What does "up to something" mean in his terms?

 

 

He is given alprozalam before the vets, muzzled, and given domitor and torbutol to knock him out so he can get his shots, they draw blood and test his thyroid (which was too high last time) and do a total CBC. He has all his shots. The visits are done outside. Inbetween the alprozolam and the dom/torb shot, he's still highly reactive so...breathe...the leash is fed through the fence where he gets kind of pinned so they can get h im not thrashing about for a minute to give him the shots to sedate. He is given the max amount a 46lb dog. He rose out of what looked like total sedation prior. The tranquilizers make him wobbly which to me, seems to put him on the defensive more, but it makes him slower.

 

By "up to something" his reactivity used to include, touching his collar, touching his feathers with your feet, nail cutting or anything that tells him your are approaching with intent to do something---we are OVER those. If its's not me or my husband he will try to bite whoever it is, if you try to do something to him. Like if the vet approached with a stethascope to listen to his heart he'll loose his mind and really aggress. As it stands one hurdle we are working on is applying Frontline. He just knows and it requires a lot of distraction to get it on him. Don't know what happened exactly in his past but it must have been horrid. His sensitivity and fear of someone doing something is as all vets say, unrivaled. Now this reaction can't be traced back to his shelter days, but this reaction also could've been caused by use of ACE, an anti-paralytic, given to him by another vet 4 years ago.

[Laurae]

Hi Laurae

Can you elaborate on the things that you didn't agree with regarding Kellie Snider? And thanks for the rec on the Control Unleashed-think I'll add that to my new list. I get hesitant though b/c sometimes new books just confuse my focus, but I know it's all worth a read. I purchased the Treat and Train developed by Sophia Yin and I watched that DVD and then never used it b/c it's tough with two dogs to use that device.

 

So thanks again.

 

Kim

 

Sorry Kim, I really don't remember anything specific. It was years ago that I was on those lists (mainly clicker solutions and a TAG teaching list, I think).

[dinah_kay]

Mostly it takes a toll with an overiding anxiety. Just today I had a spat with my husband. He says I don't put enough faith in Shep. Where I see what I do, like choose to NOT walk him in our neighborhood, as managment, not setting him up to fail, not letting him practice aggression etc., my husband sees it as he'll never get anywhere being so sheltered.

 

 

I really understand this comment!!! One of my dogs has/had some reactivity issues and impulse control issues. The personal daily anxiety is tough!!! My husband tended to have the same opinion that yours does. I had to remind him after he snapped at me one day (the dog had some "on the verge of being reactive behavior" that day and I will admit I over reacted myself because of it, lol,) that I have been the one to witness his reactive behavior at its worse, not him. So of course he didn't have the aniexty that I might have in certain situations that previously had produced a melt down for our dog. So Ijust wanted to say that I feel your pain!!! It does get better!!!!

 

I know I am a late comer to your story, but I just want to tell you what has worked for my dog (although he sounds a bit more mild - most of his issues where other dog related, but on some occasions it was directed to high stress situations with the vet or strangers.) I believe that homeopathic treatment really helped. My vet I go to is great! The "clinic" is more like a spa, lol. There is as little stress there as possible for my dog. She treated him for vaccinosis, it helped that his sympotms started 10 days after his first rabies booster. I really had never used a natural vet before, but after using a behaviorist and having my dog on prozac I took a "it can't hurt" mindset. It really did wonders for him. We also put him on a natural thyroid supplement that was supposed to help jump start his adrenal glands. He had a low thyroid test prior to starting the supplement, and after 2-3 months on the supplement he had regular levels. Like I said, it can't hurt and a lot of homeopaths will work with you via phone which might help your dog with his vet issues.

 

Also as someone else suggested Control Unleashed by Leslie McDevitt is a great book. It really helped me work on impulse issues. Everyone kept tellimg me to teach a strong look command, but that just wasn't enough in high stress enviroments. I have started to c/t when he actually looks at other dogs and it has made a hige difference!!!

 

Again, I don't know your back story, but I just thought I would pass on what was helpful with my dog, and a understanding for how you feel. Best of luck!!

 

-Dinah

[KJ]

I really understand this comment!!! One of my dogs has/had some reactivity issues and impulse control issues. The personal daily anxiety is tough!!! My husband tended to have the same opinion that yours does. I had to remind him after he snapped at me one day (the dog had some "on the verge of being reactive behavior" that day and I will admit I over reacted myself because of it, lol,) that I have been the one to witness his reactive behavior at its worse, not him. So of course he didn't have the aniexty that I might have in certain situations that previously had produced a melt down for our dog. So Ijust wanted to say that I feel your pain!!! It does get better!!!!

 

I know I am a late comer to your story, but I just want to tell you what has worked for my dog (although he sounds a bit more mild - most of his issues where other dog related, but on some occasions it was directed to high stress situations with the vet or strangers.) I believe that homeopathic treatment really helped. My vet I go to is great! The "clinic" is more like a spa, lol. There is as little stress there as possible for my dog. She treated him for vaccinosis, it helped that his sympotms started 10 days after his first rabies booster. I really had never used a natural vet before, but after using a behaviorist and having my dog on prozac I took a "it can't hurt" mindset. It really did wonders for him. We also put him on a natural thyroid supplement that was supposed to help jump start his adrenal glands. He had a low thyroid test prior to starting the supplement, and after 2-3 months on the supplement he had regular levels. Like I said, it can't hurt and a lot of homeopaths will work with you via phone which might help your dog with his vet issues.

 

Also as someone else suggested Control Unleashed by Leslie McDevitt is a great book. It really helped me work on impulse issues. Everyone kept tellimg me to teach a strong look command, but that just wasn't enough in high stress enviroments. I have started to c/t when he actually looks at other dogs and it has made a hige difference!!!

 

Again, I don't know your back story, but I just thought I would pass on what was helpful with my dog, and a understanding for how you feel. Best of luck!!

 

-Dinah

 

Wow Dinah that is great news. I love to hear success stories. First, the "spa" setting makes so much sense. I've heard of those kind of places but as of yet, not 'round these parts. I switched my cat to homeopathic vet in his later years b/c his vet was just really into surgery and I finally had to say no more...we treated the symptoms and it all worked out really well. Why it never occured to me to talk to one (the one I had wasn't interested in Shep-she admitted to being afraid) but there are many others I could do a phone consult with. It's on the list! Shep is on Prozac too. Don't know if after 4 yrs it still has an effect...but we stay on it. So did your homeo-vet make a special tincture for your dog? Shep is hypo-thyroid too and when we put him on meds I was hopnig for a miracle but no such luck. So was your dog on homeo thyroid preparation AND regular thyroid?

 

thanks for adding your experience.

 

Still haven't broken down and purchased that video. Currently my shopping cart at Tawzer dog training DVD is loaded. Also one on getting a solid re-call. man...

[sunshian]

I don't know if I missed this in any of the replies....what about libraries? or finding used copies of the dvd's?

[KJ]

I don't know if I missed this in any of the replies....what about libraries? or finding used copies of the dvd's?

 

I haven't tried the libraries yet-great suggestions. I doubt my county or surrounding ones will but it's worth a check. I did look on Ebay and no luck for that one.

 

I was horrified thought to see that this INSANE (confirmed by a real vet/behaviourist and other REAL professionals upon telling them her methods and also reading her assessment) "behaviourist" has made a flippin' video. Really outrageous. See anyone can do anything and represent themselves as anything, then, people just buy it.

[Alaska]

Still haven't broken down and purchased that video. Currently my shopping cart at Tawzer dog training DVD is loaded. Also one on getting a solid re-call. man...

I doubt you'll find the Kellie Snider DVD in any libraries, but the Really Reliable Recall DVD can be rented from Smartflix, which is like Netflix except they specialize in how-to DVDs. Go to the Smartflix site and search for "dog" to see what they have. A lot of dog training DVDs have been added since the last time I looked. You could always try asking them if they'd consider getting the Kellie Snider DVD for their collection - there's a page for doing that here. I know I'd rent if it they did.

[Tassie]

If I tell non-dog people our journey with Shep their eyes just glaze over. So here, I can't see the glazed eyes but just can read the willing words!!

 

No glazed eyes here, Kim - just total admiration for what you've done and been willing to do for Shep. Sounds like you've made huge progress - both with managing him, and with your own 'education' about aggressive dogs.

 

As far as the critical relatives go - pity them - they're not dog-people, or they'd understand the sacrifices you're willing to make for this dog.

 

I'm sorry I don't have anything practical to offer - I'm halfway through Control Unleashed - and liking it, but I'm not sure it will be particularly helpful in your situation. Still, it's a good book, and useful in general.

 

From what others have said, the DVD thing, even though expensive, sounds promising - recommended by some good people, and I too find it easier to learn from and follow a DVD presentation.

 

Keep up the good work, and be sure to tell that Shep what a very lucky dog he is to have found you guys.

[KJ]

No glazed eyes here, Kim - just total admiration for what you've done and been willing to do for Shep. Sounds like you've made huge progress - both with managing him, and with your own 'education' about aggressive dogs.

 

As far as the critical relatives go - pity them - they're not dog-people, or they'd understand the sacrifices you're willing to make for this dog.

 

I'm sorry I don't have anything practical to offer - I'm halfway through Control Unleashed - and liking it, but I'm not sure it will be particularly helpful in your situation. Still, it's a good book, and useful in general.

 

From what others have said, the DVD thing, even though expensive, sounds promising - recommended by some good people, and I too find it easier to learn from and follow a DVD presentation.

 

Keep up the good work, and be sure to tell that Shep what a very lucky dog he is to have found you guys.

 

 

That's really nice Barb. I gotta say tho, with regards to going the distance with Shep-there wasn't a choice in our minds so I feel like any accolades are kind of not deserved. Seriously...we tried everything to find him a home. Before we know the extent of his problems and after. I didn't want another dog whatsoever but since no one would consider him, he became ours and then the big ball began to roll. I would never do it again, but I am so glad that we did. We love that little guy. Yep I agree on the DVD. Frankly I have never used a DVD for anything other than sitting on the couch to watch a flick so, this will be a new adventure.

 

Those critical relatives: brutal-its one thing to have an opinion but then to keep on commenting or hinting time after time...one time was at a friends 40th birthday and needlesstoday, it got ugly and I cried and had to make a big dramatic exit. Usually I can blow it off, but that time I lost it. I think as far as they are concerned they are the ones making the sacrifices. uhg.

[KJ]

I doubt you'll find the Kellie Snider DVD in any libraries, but the Really Reliable Recall DVD can be rented from Smartflix, which is like Netflix except they specialize in how-to DVDs. Go to the Smartflix site and search for "dog" to see what they have. A lot of dog training DVDs have been added since the last time I looked. You could always try asking them if they'd consider getting the Kellie Snider DVD for their collection - there's a page for doing that here. I know I'd rent if it they did.

 

That is such a great idea for the Smartflix. I didn't even know that site existed. Thanks so much! Will certainly get the recall one.