Kat's Dogs Posted March 31, 2007 Report Share Posted March 31, 2007 I think they MAJOR draw to these pups (it would draw me to) is the socialization/training that the pups get. It is pretty impressive. Those pups really get to see the world at a young age and that is actually a key reason (in my opinion) why they are easier to train in Agility/whatever dog sport. No fear of noises, people, touching, nail clipping, bathing, crating, surfaces, movement (like a teeter), other dogs, horses, sheep, ducks, clickers, and the list goes on and on. I think that in that area they do very well. It is just some of the other areas I would have to wonder about.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
haleigh Posted March 31, 2007 Report Share Posted March 31, 2007 I think Joy has lockeye bronze somewhere in her pedigree, but because of the previous statements, Jackie tried staying away from lockeye dogs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoloRiver Posted April 1, 2007 Report Share Posted April 1, 2007 I think they MAJOR draw to these pups (it would draw me to) is the socialization/training that the pups get. It is pretty impressive. Those pups really get to see the world at a young age and that is actually a key reason (in my opinion) why they are easier to train in Agility/whatever dog sport. No fear of noises, people, touching, nail clipping, bathing, crating, surfaces, movement (like a teeter), other dogs, horses, sheep, ducks, clickers, and the list goes on and on. I think that in that area they do very well. It is just some of the other areas I would have to wonder about.... This is the exact opposite of my understanding of the temperaments coming from this kennel. I also find it hard to believe that with so many puppies on the ground at any given time, that any of them are really getting as much socialization as is claimed. I mean, let's get real here. Did you see how many litters are available at this moment? How is this not a big, huge, gigantic red flag? All the pretty colors? Where are the breeding dogs' accomplishments? The reasons for the breedings? What evidence do you really have that they are really doing anything special with their puppies before shipment? I see a website with a lot of pretty pictures and all the right buzzwords but there is no getting around the fact that this is a volume operation and there is nothing about this that would attract me to this kennel. Any halfway well-bred Border Collie pup is going to be easy to train in any given dog sport. You have described every single well-bred Border Collie puppy (and a goodly number of not-that-well-bred Border Collie puppies) I have known. This is the baseline of what I would expect from any puppy I bought from a good working breeder. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RaisingRiver Posted April 1, 2007 Report Share Posted April 1, 2007 Ok I'm sold on not liking them for various reasons, but mostly because they tell you how to change your pups ears to your personal preference. http://www.lockeyebc.com/info.html#ears That's just annoying. I have a preference, but I like the wait and see what you get surprise! I wanted River to have 1 tipped ear and one prick, and she grew up to have 2 prick - and frankly that fits her personality more and I wouldn't change it for the world. The fact that Diesel has 1 prick and 1 tip is purely coincidence. Although I did get him as an adult and I bet that was subconsciously part of his appeal to me Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anda Posted April 1, 2007 Report Share Posted April 1, 2007 Oh, that's horrible, Raisingriver! Why would someone do that? Beahhhhhh! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kat's Dogs Posted April 1, 2007 Report Share Posted April 1, 2007 Melanie, I don't stand up for Lockeye. I think there are big red flags too, plenty of them to go around. I say that because of what I have seen in my intense search around the website and the fact that I have met Lockeye dogs (MANY, and I mean lots, of agility BCs around here are lockeye). Those dogs are pretty much bomb-proof. Nothing startles them. That paired with the stuff on the website about the training/socialization the pups get makes me think that. A partially educated puppy buyer might see that ("ooh! They do stuff with the pups from a young age!") and so might overlook other things. That was all I was saying. ETA: Someone suggested to me, "ya know, I have an information packet on manipulating puppy's ears to do what you want - I could get you one for little Dazzle". This person knew I liked one-up-one-down dogs (which Dazzle happens to be, THAT was pure luck, although I did praise her for holding her ears that way and talk to her about it every night and tell her what she was supposed to do with those crazy ears. ). Watching their ears change is the best part of puppy-hood! Tape? Popsicle sticks? Glue? YUCK! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Root Beer Posted April 1, 2007 Report Share Posted April 1, 2007 What evidence do you really have that they are really doing anything special with their puppies before shipment? I see a website with a lot of pretty pictures and all the right buzzwords but there is no getting around the fact that this is a volume operation and there is nothing about this that would attract me to this kennel. Any halfway well-bred Border Collie pup is going to be easy to train in any given dog sport. You have described every single well-bred Border Collie puppy (and a goodly number of not-that-well-bred Border Collie puppies) I have known. This is the baseline of what I would expect from any puppy I bought from a good working breeder. As someone who decided way back when that I wanted a Border Collie because they reminded me of Sammie (our mix) and then purchased the first one that ran up to us and capered for attention without doing any research whatsoever, I honestly don't think that the average puppy buyer considers the purchase as carefully as you (or I - now) would. There are a lot of puppy buyers who would never even think to ask the questions that are obvious to you. I mean, I literally sat at my computer with baby Speedy chewing on my toes when I got online and learned that Border Collies are sheepdogs - I had no clue whatsoever what a Border Collie really was at that time! Had I stumbled upon a breeder like Lockeye back then, and been able to afford one of their puppies, I would have been totally convinced that I had purchased one of the best possible Border Collie puppies from the absolute best breeder. The buzzwords would have been very effective and I wouldn't have considered volume back then. The red flags I see now would have been lost on me then. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lenajo Posted April 1, 2007 Report Share Posted April 1, 2007 I know more unsatisfied people with LE pups that satisfied. And frankly, the satisfied ones seem to have dogs that come more from the breeders original stock as opposed to the current. At least the original stock appeared to have been at one point used for work, out of working stock. Now...who knows? It always amazing me what people will ignore in a breeder's methods and an obviously "slick" advertising campaign if *their* puppy is ok and wins or works the way they wanted it too. One blind pig finding the acorn is not a justifcation for breeding the parents again as acorn finders. And if you did have good acorn finders, the acorn hunting community would know you well. You wouldn't need a slick website unless you were say...maybe way overbreeding? or maybe you wanted to sell piglets out of parents who were maybe 3 ro so generations away from the original blind pig and had maybe only seen an acorn through a kennel gate? lenajo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest CleverDog Posted April 1, 2007 Report Share Posted April 1, 2007 I don't want to say much as I've only ever met two of their dogs...one seemed fine, good at agility, but the other had a lot of temperment problems, but also very good at agility. IMO if you were looking specifically for a sport dog, I would find a smaller breeder. ETA: Just to clarify...since people generally go to them for a sport dog, just saying that there are other breeders out there I personally prefer. If you were looking for a working/other dog, you probably wouldn't be looking there in the first place, hence the reference to just sports dogs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
borderlicious Posted April 2, 2007 Report Share Posted April 2, 2007 I met a dog from their "old" stock yesterday and was absolutely in *love* with him. He wasn't bred by them and had some other lines mixed in there, but he was one heck of a dog. On the flip side, I've met two of their more current dogs (which says something about their distribution of dogs, considering I didn't need to venture far from home to meet these pups) and I didn't like them. It probably had something to do with the fact that they were being trained for flyball and were mildly insane, but they didn't seem stable or pleasant to be around. It bums me out a little when people buy dogs bred to do agility, or will only buy a puppy from dogs that compete in agility. ANY freaking dog can do agility. There are show bred dogs out there winning MACH's and running in the nationals. There's nothing about Lockeye that I find any more redeeming than someone breeding work dogs. If a cocker spaniel can do agility, then any physically sound border collie can. As for all the socialization and such that they get, I just don't know what to think about that. Eve's breeder was insanely busy with just the one litter of 6 puppies, I can't imagine having 3-4+ litters and giving them all the time and attention they need - particularly as they get older and start seeking more one-on-one interaction with humans. There just wouldn't be enough hours in the day. ETA: Yuck, RaisingRiver. That poor puppy looked so cute with its floppy ears. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.