Nipping kids... should I muzzle on walks?

[geonni banner]

PS - Other than a muzzle sending the message that you have "vicious" dog (like a "Beware of Dog" sign, it can backfire on you if the dog hurts someone - something along the order of you already knowing you had a dangerous animal), a muzzle can also cause anxiety in the dog because the dog feels like it has lost its ability to defend itself. I'd try to avoid that if at all possible. Not that you can't do it if you have *no other choice*.

While I know this is true, I have resorted to telling parents, "She BITES." Reason being, we live in a neighborhood with permissive, entitled-type parents that will not be stopped by "Please, no touching", by "She's afraid," by "She's unused to children." These people typically have kids that approach quickly, talk loudly, grab, and will not listen. And the parents don't want to hear about adjusting the behavior of the kid. I put myself between the kid and my dog, and tell the parents, "She BITES." That's the only thing I've found that gets through.

 

I've had kids swing a stick at my dog, try to smack her, and run up firing a cap-pistol in her face. All the while the parents look on with a bland, indulgent smile. If I object, and I do; their behavior ranges from incredulous to hostile.

 

I'm not willing to keep my dog in a bubble - never taking her out with me. (Although I do avoid going out around the time kids are going to or from school.) Nor am I willing to muzzle her or let her be mauled by kids. I know it isn't the kids' fault - they are not being managed properly. But try and explain that to a Border Collie being screamed at and assailed with a plastic sword,,,

[Shetlander]

Wow! I am really lucky that the vast majority of kids I run into ask first before petting my dog and listen when I tell them no. It is nice, though, to have a dog again that enjoys children and not need to figure out the best times to walk to avoid them or be ready to run interference if we meet a kid who is badly behaved.

[hkwm]

While I know this is true, I have resorted to telling parents, "She BITES." Reason being, we live in a neighborhood with permissive, entitled-type parents that will not be stopped by "Please, no touching", by "She's afraid," by "She's unused to children." These people typically have kids that approach quickly, talk loudly, grab, and will not listen. And the parents don't want to hear about adjusting the behavior of the kid. I put myself between the kid and my dog, and tell the parents, "She BITES." That's the only thing I've found that gets through.

 

This is helpful, thank you!

 

I'm sorry to say that the parents in my neighborhood are like yours. We live in a busy area and NO ONE asks before petting Laika; it drives me completely nuts and it's teaching her to beg for attention from everyone we walk by. Most of the time when I politely tell people to stop, or that she's nervous around kids, they either ignore me or act as if I'm the one being rude (a grown man even called me a "bitch" a few weeks ago). Sadly, it's the same entitled people that see a puppy and immediately grab for it that necessitate less polite methods of getting them to stop in the first place.

[TEC]

It's clear that it is not always the kids. I socialize my dog in friendly stores/shops. One clueless adult, flew his 2-3 year old around like a model airplane. He held the child out at arm's length and swooped him/her headfirst down towards my dog, with,"Whee, look at the nice doggy," or some such phrase. Caught me by surprise. This was the culmination of several instances in that pet store that made the decision for me to not continue bringing my dog in, and shopping there. To her credit, Josie has always shown remarkable self-restraint. I have found that farm feed and equipment stores have the best behaved customers. Must be the connection to the land and animals. In most cases, it's my opinion that poorly behaved kids falls back on incorrect/insufficient education of the kids and their parents, and/or lack of supervision. -- TEC

[alligande]

I have noticed a difference over the last few years with local kids (tourists are not included in this statement) I have been impressed how many now know how to greet a dog often with more clue than their patents. Full credit has to go to the local shelter for their outreach work, every public school in the 3 towns on the island have them go in a do an educational component at 2 different grade levels. They also do some work with a couple of the private schools. It really has made a difference.

[GentleLake]

I have noticed a difference over the last few years with local kids (tourists are not included in this statement) I have been impressed how many now know how to greet a dog often with more clue than their patents. Full credit has to go to the local shelter for their outreach work, every public school in the 3 towns on the island have them go in a do an educational component at 2 different grade levels. They also do some work with a couple of the private schools. It really has made a difference.

 

The local therapy dog group I work with also does "Dog Safety" programs in schools. Unfortunaltely, there aren't enough of us who are free during school hours to go around to all the elementary schools.

 

It's definitely an asset to the community when people can do programs like this in schools.

[maggiesmommy]

The local therapy dog group I work with also does "Dog Safety" programs in schools. Unfortunaltely, there aren't enough of us who are free during school hours to go around to all the elementary schools.

 

It's definitely an asset to the community when people can do programs like this in schools.

 

This seems like a great idea. Schools teach safety programs of all kinds-- I know in our public schools, they have a full curriculum that covers everything from what to do in a fire to how to get help if you're being abused. I think it's a great program.

 

It seems like basic animal handling safety should be part of that core curriculum for grade schoolers. Not only do a lot of kids not know not to ask before petting a dog, but many don't know that it's dangerous to handle wild animals. They might say away from poisonous snakes, but that's about it. An 8-year-old in my area died a few years ago after he'd found a sick bat in the woods, hid it from his parents to keep it as a pet, and died of rabies a few days later without anyone knowing how he contracted it until they found the bat's corpse in his bedroom. I think most of us ended up handling baby birds, wild lizards, stray/feral cats, etc. as children and had no idea that it could be a danger to both us and them. I'd totally support an animal safety course in public schools.

 

Kind of a derailment, but somebody does definitely need to start spreading the word about appropriate handling/care of animals, and I don't think we can trust all parents to do it.

[Gloria Atwater]

Lots of good thoughts and advice here, so I'll just echo what everyone else has said. Be proactive, be alert, and above all, be FIRM. Muster your inner Mama Bear to protect your dog.

Don't be apologetic or hesitant in any way, because if she nips hard enough to break a child's fragile skin, you could be looking at a lawsuit or, worse, euthanizing your dog as "vicious."

Fortunately I don't encounter many children, as I live rural and just don't know any children. But occasionally I'm at events where lots of people congregate, such as Labor Day weekend, when I'll be at a trial at a Scottish Games. There will be scores if not hundreds of people everywhere and all dogs must be on leash, so the border collies are not only a major tourist draw, they are also a captive attraction. Neither of my dogs are familiar with kids and my girl is frankly nervous about them. So, I'll have to be on my toes to monitor every interaction my dogs have with the public - and the public is around us at all times. The only real escape the dogs have is in our vehicles.

So, when I have my dogs out, I'll be telling people, "No, Gael is too shy of strangers," and if necessary physically inserting myself between her and any pushy children. And with my boy, Nick, I can let reasonable, quiet, polite kids pet him but again, I will have to shield him from any loud, unruly, obnoxious sorts.

And I'm fully prepared to go all Mama Bear if that's required.

So, stand up and stay strong! You're protecting both the children and your dog. Best of luck!

~ Gloria

[geonni banner]

I wrote this for my blog and my Neighborhood BBS.

 

I'm thinking of printing a few out and handing them to parents who want their kids to pet my dog. My thinking is, taking the paper from my hand will redirect them from the dog, and maybe they'll learn something if they read it.

 

Feel free to cut and paste it into a word document and use it if you want.

 

http://pedanticmystic.blogspot.com/2013/08/that-dog-wont-bite.html

[GentleLake]

I would add that kids should be taught to offer treats in the palms of their hand, rather than in their fingertips. A dog that's overly enthusiastic about getting a treat may nip fingers, especially if the child inadvertently "teases" the dog with the food by pulling back because she or he is a little afraid. The worst that'll happen to an extended palm is that it'll get a little slobbery.

[Pam Wolf]

If the kids are nipping, I'd definitely muzzle them but also wear a padded suite in case someone else's kids were nipping but not muzzled.