r b m Posted February 19, 2008 Report Share Posted February 19, 2008 Well, I went to my second trial last weekend. Despite being rained out before my second run, I had a lot of fun. I wasn't happy with our run, but we did better than last time. She crossed over on me again, chopped off the top, unsettled the sheep and then after that it seemed it was slicey-chasefest 2008 around the pen. Oh, and she listened "fairly" well. My major concern is that she refuses to set up on her away side(even in training), which is the side everyone was sending at both trials. She may line up on my right, but will face left. It's really strange. The judge asked us to walk to the post off-lead and let your dog choose. I told him my predicament, and he said try to guide her to the right and see if she takes it. I was happy I had her under control going to the post, and she of course chose come by. He told me to just let her have it. At both trials, she got about 10 yards away, stopped, then crossed over like "oh, I was wrong, I need to cover this way." My trainer was there, and I only wish I had got my second run to implement her suggestions. However, she likes to use the "get back" command, and I personally don't like it, esp at a trial. Am I wrong? I need to work on her fear(?) of the away side, which has always been slicey. Some days it's good, others not. On her come by side, she has a nice lean where I can release her, I'd like the same for the away. Any suggestions? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smokjbc Posted February 19, 2008 Report Share Posted February 19, 2008 Well, I went to my second trial last weekend. Despite being rained out before my second run, I had a lot of fun. I wasn't happy with our run, but we did better than last time. She crossed over on me again, chopped off the top, unsettled the sheep and then after that it seemed it was slicey-chasefest 2008 around the pen. Oh, and she listened "fairly" well. My major concern is that she refuses to set up on her away side(even in training), which is the side everyone was sending at both trials. She may line up on my right, but will face left. It's really strange. The judge asked us to walk to the post off-lead and let your dog choose. I told him my predicament, and he said try to guide her to the right and see if she takes it. I was happy I had her under control going to the post, and she of course chose come by. He told me to just let her have it. At both trials, she got about 10 yards away, stopped, then crossed over like "oh, I was wrong, I need to cover this way." My trainer was there, and I only wish I had got my second run to implement her suggestions. However, she likes to use the "get back" command, and I personally don't like it, esp at a trial. Am I wrong? I need to work on her fear(?) of the away side, which has always been slicey. Some days it's good, others not. On her come by side, she has a nice lean where I can release her, I'd like the same for the away. Any suggestions? Hi, I don't have any suggestions - but I did want to say this seems like an excellent scenario to present to the expert Bev Lambert in the "Ask the Expert" section. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill Fosher Posted February 20, 2008 Report Share Posted February 20, 2008 I'm not an expert, but this sounds like the classic situation where you need to shorten up your outrun -- even if it means going back to just a few feet -- until she does it right, and keep her doing it right as you lengthen it. Interesting concept: a trial getting rained out. Never heard of that before. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kelpiegirl Posted February 20, 2008 Report Share Posted February 20, 2008 I agree with Bill. She sounds like she has developed a habit now, of always wanting to approach on one side- does she like come by flanks more? Ostensibly, I would say that she should be worked on the away side, pretty much all the time, until she gets more confident with it. Sometimes too, the positioning of the sheep's heads will change the way the dog wants to approach. Have you noticed where the sheep are facing, when she always switches to come by? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
r b m Posted February 20, 2008 Author Report Share Posted February 20, 2008 Interesting concept: a trial getting rained out. Never heard of that before. Well, it was more for lightning than anything. And it was getting towards the end of the day anyway. They offered for me to come back the next morning, but I couldn't. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
r b m Posted February 20, 2008 Author Report Share Posted February 20, 2008 I agree with Bill. She sounds like she has developed a habit now, of always wanting to approach on one side- does she like come by flanks more? Ostensibly, I would say that she should be worked on the away side, pretty much all the time, until she gets more confident with it. Sometimes too, the positioning of the sheep's heads will change the way the dog wants to approach. Have you noticed where the sheep are facing, when she always switches to come by? Well, her flanks actually look fine in training, they get slicey every now and then. She has no issue with taking either side, but she used to with her away. It's funny you mentioned the sheep heads because my trainer said the same exact thing, she started to cross once they moved. I personally haven't noticed but will try to pay more attention. We have shortened her outrun, in fact we reverted all the way back to me being in the middle putting pressure when needed. We have drilled and drilled her away outrun and it looks good 90% of the time in training. However, on the away, I always have to grab her collar and set her up and usually give a "get baaaaack" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kelpiegirl Posted February 20, 2008 Report Share Posted February 20, 2008 My thoughts then, are to kick it back some more in difficulty, until her aways are done 100% right all the time- with no reminding/prompting. Also, drill drill drilling can get stale, so break up the drills into different areas, but as Kevin Howell says, "Good Better Best Never let it rest till your Good is Better & Your Better "Best" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
william virginia Posted February 21, 2008 Report Share Posted February 21, 2008 in the eighty's i would trial with my dog and i never came in the first 10. Zac was a farm dog and a very good one. So, i build a trail course in my back field and zac would go through it very day. some days he was super some day not so super. But, he and i won every day. Enjoy your self do not worry if you dog does not win, remember he is trying to please you, so love him/her for trying her/him best and there will always be another trial. bill Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
r b m Posted February 21, 2008 Author Report Share Posted February 21, 2008 in the eighty's i would trial with my dog and i never came in the first 10. Zac was a farm dog and a very good one. So, i build a trail course in my back field and zac would go through it very day. some days he was super some day not so super. But, he and i won every day. Enjoy your self do not worry if you dog does not win, remember he is trying to please you, so love him/her for trying her/him best and there will always be another trial. bill I'm totally enjoying myself. I wouldn't do it if I wasn't. Win anything? I seriously doubt I'll win anything with the dog I have now, I know this. However I do know she can do much much better. I know this was my second trial and I'm sure I'll fall flat on my face many time more. I just wanted people's thoughts on how to render this preferred side issue. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kelpiegirl Posted February 21, 2008 Report Share Posted February 21, 2008 Hi Richard I would set her up so that she would prefer to go away. Use pressure to your advantage. Make it her OTHER favorite side. Not long ago, when I was working Lucy, she did a really pretty come by, and we both said we thought her favorite side was away... I would just practice on that a lot. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
r b m Posted February 21, 2008 Author Report Share Posted February 21, 2008 By pressure do you mean the draw? Or apply a little pressure on her? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kelpiegirl Posted February 21, 2008 Report Share Posted February 21, 2008 When lucy was having her, well, I don't know what to call it when I sent her a few times. I saw that because I was so worried about her starting out wrong, or not doing the flank/outrun right, that I was leaning into her. That made things much worse. So, what I did was set her up and as I sent her, I moved off away from her, opposite the side I sent her. So, if I sent her away, I would walk off to the left. I only had to do this once, and she was back to normal. So, for your dog, if I were to do the same thing, since her away is hard, I would set her up, and as I sent her walk off to the left. See if that un-blocks her from wanting to shift left. I am no expert though! This is just what happened to work with Lucy- thank goodness I wasn't so stupid as to not figure it out! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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