BUBBA Posted March 7, 2003 Report Share Posted March 7, 2003 My vet has informed me that my 5 yr old Border Collie has calcium oxalate crystals in his urine which can form into kidney stones. She suggests canned prescription food but I think is way too expensive. He has been on Bil-Jac dog food because it helped bulk him up a bit. He was 36# and has now been at a steady 42# (he is a bad eater). I recently change to a lower protien food (Solid Gold)thinking this might help. I told her the canned food will most likely give him diarhea, his stomach is a bit sensitive. I was wondering if anybody has had to deal with this and if there is anything I can try before putting him on the prescription food for the rest of his life? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kajarrel Posted March 7, 2003 Report Share Posted March 7, 2003 You might find this website helpful: http://www.veterinarypartner.com/Content.p...A&S=0&C=0&A=662 Good luck, Kim Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nancy Posted March 7, 2003 Report Share Posted March 7, 2003 Don't know about dogs, but I had two cats with "gravel" in their urine. Almost lost the first one because we didn't realize that cat pee wasn't supposed to be sort of brown. that was blood! Anyhow, for years we had to put very expensive tiny red pills down those cats' throats every morning and evening. Then we learned that they were ascorbic acid - vitamin C. I even checked with the vet. Yes, we could crush a 50 miligram tablet of C and put it on the catfood. Can't remember if it was 50 shared, but I think so. We also watched the ash content in their food. Ask if that might help your dog - if it's the same problem. I also suspect the protein in the food was high for your dog. I know that's what they watch in some men with similar problems. BTW, when we moved to Charlotte NC, the cats' problems cleared up to where we just watched them in the litter and gave them C only on the ratre accassions when they strained to pee. The vet there said he'd seen that in lots of the cats who were part of the big IBM move from NY to NC. He thought it had to do with the minerals in the tap water. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kajarrel Posted March 7, 2003 Report Share Posted March 7, 2003 Remember there are several types of stones in dogs. Be very careful - it is my understanding that the use of Vit C and other "things" that acidify the urine are CONTRA-indicated with calcium oxalate stones . . . I'd double check anything you read online with your vet, just to be safe. Kim Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BUBBA Posted March 10, 2003 Author Report Share Posted March 10, 2003 Thanks for your comments. I think I might have to try the prescription food for a while and see how it goes. The only thing is, I think he will end up with diarhea eating the food because canned food does that to him. Thanks again, Kim Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Olivia Posted March 10, 2003 Report Share Posted March 10, 2003 What kind of prescription food did your vet recommend? At the clinic where I work we sell Science Diet prescription diets and almost all of them come in both canned and dry. It is the ingredients (usually), not whether it is canned or dry that makes the difference. You might be able to keep him on a dry food. Also be sure to change foods gradually, mixing in a little of the new every day and increasing the amount until he is on the new food. That decreases the risk of an upset tummy. Olivia Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smokjbc Posted March 10, 2003 Report Share Posted March 10, 2003 Hi, You should be able to find a dry prescription food, call your vet. In my experience, the vet usually starts the dogs off with canned because they will be more likely to eat it and the benefits of the diet will start sooner than with dogs being picky over a new dry food. Yes, its more expensive that your regular food but imagine paying for a cystomony (removing the stones if they get too big) $500-$800. Crystals are a serious thing, don't be tempted to "try" another diet without the permission of your vet. Also, calcium oxalate crystals are different, ph wise, than than struvite crystals, which is what most cats get. So don't try any supplements without being sure they won't make it worse. And good idea to filter your dogs water, get a PUR pitcher or something like that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nancy Posted March 10, 2003 Report Share Posted March 10, 2003 Agreed - the solution has to match the problem. Not all "gravel" or "stones" are alike. My point was just that, if there was a financial problem, there might be a generic solution. Geez, we were definitely on the lower side of lower-middle-class when we had the cat-astrophe. But we can up with the bucks for the pills. I jsut wish the vet had told us that generic vitamin C was the same as the expensive pills. He finally said that he thought shoving a pill down the troat woudl be easier than grinding a C and putting it on the food. Go figure. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
juliepoudrier Posted March 10, 2003 Report Share Posted March 10, 2003 Just so you know, Science Diet isn't the only choice out there. Purina also makes prescription diets (and there may be others), and my critters (cats, admittedly) have always preferred the Purina versions over the Science Diet versions. So if your dog doesn't like Science Diet, ask your vet to order a different brand. Also, my cats never, and I mean never liked the canned versions of those diets. I think it's more economical to feed the dry anyway. I've lived in this part of NC for a little over a year now, and suddenly I have several cats (some as old as 9 years) experiencing problems with struvite crystals. I never had any such problem before, so I was wondering if it weren't indeed the water here.... (The are all on the Purina UR). Anyway, irregardless of the type of crystal, try upping your dog's water consumption. I do that for the cats by adding water to their food (for the struvite crystals protein is OK, so I can feed the canned meat, mix it with the UR, add water, and voila, the cats are consuming extra liquids). I use bottled water for that purpose. In any case, talk to your vet. When I contacted the holistic vet I had used about adding Vitamin C to the cats' diet, she said it wouldn't hurt, but that there were probably better ways to acidify the urine (caveat: this applies to struvite crystals, not calcium oxalate. It might help you to get on the Internet and do a search on calcium oxalate and dogs. I found all sorts of useful information that way, which then enabled me to have an intelligent conversation with my vet. Just pay attention to the source on the Internet, as obviously some sites are way more credible than others. Good luck. J. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BUBBA Posted March 11, 2003 Author Report Share Posted March 11, 2003 Once again, thanks for everybodys comments. My vet suggested Hills W/D canned food and adding some extra vitamin to it (can't remember exactly). I am going to try filtering his water. A good point was made, thanks, about the cost of surgery if he were to end up getting kidney stones. And would hate for him to have to go through it. I guess I was just hoping someone would have a cheaper way. He goes out 3 times a day, should I be trying to take him out more to pee? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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