PennyT Posted January 28, 2003 Report Share Posted January 28, 2003 I have kept Jordan and Taylor off of stock for a month or more as an attitude changer and the lay-off worked wonders in both times I did it. I mean no stock work at all, a total lay-off. Has anyone else done the same with equally good results? Penny Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoloRiver Posted January 28, 2003 Report Share Posted January 28, 2003 Just wondering -- why did you put them up and how were they changed after being out of the game for a while? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cgt Posted January 28, 2003 Report Share Posted January 28, 2003 Ah. The luxury of being a good handler with good dogs. Many of us who don't quite fall in that category feel like we need every chance we can get to improve ourselves and/or our dogs. I couldn't imagine taking a month off (or are you working other dogs in the meantime? If so, you also have the luxury of many dogs!). I'm barely keeping my head above water as it is. Probably you would say that the month off is a way of getting an improvement. But us beginners are so damn inefficient with our training, we can't afford to put a dog up that long. (Well, maybe I am just speaking for myself.) Having said that, I always plan on one or two days a week where the dogs get no work. I do find them to be keener, sharper, and somehow more biddable afterward. I don't quite get it. But I guess they can get in a rut just like we do. Probably it helps me, too. Why do you put your dogs up Penny? charlie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shawna Posted January 28, 2003 Report Share Posted January 28, 2003 I had a dog that felt everything should be done her way or not at all. Taking her off sheep didn't affect her attitude at all. Ignoring her altogether for a week at a time made her a little more compliant but as soon as I would try to do anything with her we would go back to the beginning. I quit herding with her because it was a wasted effort and tried obedience. The attitude was the same. If we weren't doing things her way she quit. It wasn't a stress shut down, it was a beligerant "not a hope will I do anything for you unless I call the shots" attitude. I had read putting them up for a short time can do wonders I'm glad it worked for you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Laura L. Posted January 28, 2003 Report Share Posted January 28, 2003 My dogs get a break over the winter too. I don't feel like going out in the cold and there's not really a lot to do any way. Sometimes it's just a couple of weeks. But I think that mentally they come back the better for it and I know that I do too. Laura L. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PennyT Posted January 28, 2003 Author Report Share Posted January 28, 2003 The first time I took Jordan and Taylor off of stock for a month was on the advice of a trainer I admire. It was not easy to do but I did have other dogs to work. The two had just started competing in open then. Taylor had won Reserve in the Nursery, and Jordan was 18th. The trainer noticed that they needed a break. The second time I put them up was for 2 months before the 2001 Handlers Finals; there was an illness in my family, and the two dogs and I moved to my mother's. Both times Jordan and Taylor returned to work and to trialing refreshed and raring to please. They had been off of all livestock work: no hard work, no light work, no simple chores, nada, nothing. Actually, they could use it again but aren't getting it. Penny Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tucknjill Posted January 28, 2003 Report Share Posted January 28, 2003 I dont work Tucker and Grace all winter other than the odd trial or two and maybe once every two weeks or so to hold sheep for someone. I havent trained on them since the finals and I wont start tuning them up again till Feb1 for Nancy's trial. A trainer I greatly admire tells me that it is hard to keep them ground down all year long..they need a break...Plus I dedicate the winter to getting a jump on my young dogs and doing the ones I have in for training. I dont know if I really notice a difference one way or another other than Grace will be plenty pushy and I will have to work on Tuckers eye for a week or two. I think they do come back fresher, but it does break my heart to see Tuck, he really pines for the work..He grins all day long if I even use him to hold sheep off feeders or put up a lamb... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoloRiver Posted January 29, 2003 Report Share Posted January 29, 2003 Susan Garrett has a newish book/booklet out called "Ruff Love" that describes what I guess is a variation on the putting-the-dog-up approach, but for sports dogs. The first stage of the "Ruff Love" approach is to crate the dog at all times times except when you are practicing whatever sport it is that you want to build the dog's drive for. If he screws up or displeases you, back in the crate he goes. There's a lot more to it, but that's step one. Garrett's approach is for dogs who would rather do stuff other than what you would want them to do. Frankly, if I had a dog I needed to treat like that for the sake of playing agility or flyball, I'd find something else to do with the dog, but I do understand why the approach works. Since I think it's pretty much impossible to work a sheepdog who doesn't find the work inherently rewarding I'm not sure all the mechanisms are the same, but it is kind of like putting a dog up for a while to get him to work by your rules. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PennyT Posted January 29, 2003 Author Report Share Posted January 29, 2003 I heard a story about someone, I have no idea who, in the U.K. who did pretty much what Melanie mentioned. By putting the dogs up, however, I did not mean ignoring them or making them spend time crated when I didn't need to. I meant simply no livestock work. Penny Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
juliepoudrier Posted January 29, 2003 Report Share Posted January 29, 2003 Penny, When you are giving your dogs a break by not letting them work, do you also keep them away from livestock altogether? What I mean is are they prevented from even seeing stock--of any sort--or are they just not allowed to work but can see the sheep, goats, chickens, whatever as they go about other activities on the farm (as long as theyaren't working from the other side of the fence anyway)? J. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoloRiver Posted January 29, 2003 Report Share Posted January 29, 2003 By putting the dogs up, however, I did not mean ignoring them or making them spend time crated when I didn't need to. I meant simply no livestock work.Oh, I know. I was just struck by the different ways people use to increase motivation and focus. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brookcove Posted January 29, 2003 Report Share Posted January 29, 2003 My trainer Steve will regularly put a dog up if he feels they have hit a wall. Sometimes even his older dogs benefit from a break. It works so well that he has sort of institutionalized a two month on, one month off rhythm when training new dogs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PennyT Posted January 30, 2003 Author Report Share Posted January 30, 2003 There isn't any way that I can keep the dogs from seeing livestock when I am home because the dogs are often out when the sheep are grazing in same pasture. When Jordan and Taylor were at my mother's house, though, they did not see stock at all. In fact their idea of a good time was a walk around the block. For exercise, they went swimming 3 times a week. Penny Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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