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Is it possible that this person "Stardew" did in fact need such a correction?

I always thought that If a dog has the "weak gene" it will frequently have a hard time moving cantankerous sheep.

Dear Amanda: I have a trialing question. Often times at a trial the handler who has just completed their run will be in charge of exhausting the next person's sheep. When is the best time to do that? Some say it is best to wait until the course has been completed or time has been called. Others advocate doing it pretty much whenever, e.g., during the shed. Where do you stand on this? chariie

Hi Pearse. First, I agree with you wholeheartedly; "instinct test" makes me cringe. Having said that, I have from time to time had the good fortune to stand with some gifted handlers/trainers when I first put some of my young dogs on sheep. All I ever see is 5-10 minutes of chaos. These fine trainers, seeing the same thing, would make some tentative suggestions as to the amount of eye present and amount of presence. Over the next year or two I would come to see that they were always spot on with their initial estimate. It never fails to amaze me how some of us can be so talented that

I think this eternal discussion results, in part anyway, from a myth that gets propagated sometimes at dog trials. Announcer: "The trial course is meant to simulate real work... Blah, blah, blah." Most people don't insist on holding on to the the pen gate throughout a "real world" penning situation. Most of the trial rules are not so much meant to simulate real work as to provide a 10-15 minute test which reveals the proficiency of the dog (and handler) to do real work. Tests are rarely "real world". They're tests. Sometimes a test provides a good assessment of this or that

Here's one I've heard, which summarizes a familiar dog trialing weekend experience: "From top dog to dog shit in 24 hours." I dare you to put it in the paper. charlie

> But after the Finals, a Big Hat told me, quite seriously: “It’s too bad Riggs won. He’s not good enough.” Hilarious. People can be so stupid. Or maybe jealous. For virtually all of his career, Riggs has been known as one of the very best dogs out here in the west. He regularly wins or places near the top at every trial he goes to, where the competition is fierce, the terrain is murder and the sheep can be worse. Nobody out here is surprised he won the whole enchilada. charlie

Penny: I am pretty sure everyone is happiest when you confine your investigations to the 19th century. charlie

Really nice find, Penny. Fascinating. charlie

How is the Nursery working? Is it the combined score or what? charlie

Hmmm... I am not sure about that - I can't remember. charlie

As you get older you will find your memory is not so good. I am eagerly awaiting this phase of your life.

Going around the post with the sheep is fine. Some judges, however, might deduct a bit if they think you are helping your dog too much on the turn. It's always something. charlie

Interesting - I always move to the drive panel side. (I think Patrick Shannahan showed me this a long time ago.) The plan is to be in position to block the sheep from going the wrong way around. I haven't gone the wrong way yet! (But, I have done lots of other cool stuff, which won't be detailed here.) charlie

"Lacamas Valley STD" Yikes. I'm glad I missed that trial. Whatever happened to good, clean fun? charlie

And it's not just the course. Often times (at least out in the west) the sheep in USBCHA trials can be very wild and ornery. In my opinion this is where the ultimate challenge originates in these trials. charlie

Norm Close is in Coeur d' Alene. www.handhillsbordercollies.com charlie

Three good options for you are Patrick Shannahan: http://patrickshannahan.com/ Dianne Deal: http://www.diannedeal.com/ and Don Helsley: http://www.helsleyranch.com/ They're all in the Caldwell area. charlie

As you say, many judges would take off considerably more than 3-4 points for this maneuver. Maybe 1 point per sheep plus some more for being off line. One theory for a bigger deduction here might be that one has failed to execute the panels correctly and has even gone backwards a little bit. In this theory, the heinosity (yes, I made that up!) of the crime is sort of analogous to failing to bring the sheep around the post but bringing them in front instead. It might be only a few feet off line... charlie

Hi Donald. About 10 years ago, before I got sucked into this livestock-dog nightmare, I watched a sheepdog trial (an ancestor of what is now "Big Willow"). It was beautiful. I thought, "How hard can this be? I'll do it." Damn. charlie

Don't forget the endorsements, Donald. Lucrative! Personally, I have managed to create an extremely strong financial relationship with my vet AND my local RV parts supplier. The way things are going, I may just be ready to retire. My boss thinks I already have! charlie

Excellent.

I think we could probably clean up that McCaig dude via some clicker training. Anybody live near him? charlie

I rarely have had to deal with the bottle-fed lambs, so, you know, disclaim... but I wouldn't use bottle lambs. They are barely even sheep. They don't act right at all, and the dog will be getting a very weird first impression which *might* flavor a lot of the subsequent training. The dog needs to see/feel what effect he/she has on the sheep from the very start, and I don't think you will get that very well with the bottle creatures. charlie

Regarding sheep behavior, particularly with regards to handling by humans and dogs... I always wonder which is more significant: environment or heredity. While I can often detect certain behavioral things which go with this or that breed of sheep, I always end up concluding that it's how the sheep have been handled in the past which controls how they behave. - charlie