what not to do as first time shepherds

[The Good Shepherd]

I am already wearing my Flame suit

 

Hubby and I really really messed up

 

We left our yearling ram in with our ewes

 

Guess what

 

We are in the middle of lambing - and its in the teens some night

 

Sooooo last night all of my ewes (10) got wrestled into the haybarn

 

Please keep us, the Ewes and yet unborn babies in your thoughts

 

Any help or hints will be gladly taken

[Cynthia P]

I am already wearing my Flame suit

 

Hubby and I really really messed up

 

We left our yearling ram in with our ewes

 

Guess what

 

We are in the middle of lambing - and its in the teens some night

 

Sooooo last night all of my ewes (10) got wrestled into the haybarn

 

Please keep us, the Ewes and yet unborn babies in your thoughts

 

Any help or hints will be gladly taken

 

 

Ram lambs as young as 4 months old can impregnate ewes...Been there done that!

 

As long as your ewes are in the barn out of the wind they will be fine. Make a check around 9 pm and than don't check again before 5:30 or 6:00 am; your activity, checking on them, could bring them into labour when they aren't meant to. Let the ewes do their jobs;

 

We've lambed in -20C and inside the barn they are just fine; We've had to lamb outside in -20C and they need to be darn good mothers to have them survive in that weather...but if there isn't any wind it is doable!

 

Good luck and let mother nature take it's course...and next year, no yearling ram lamb with the ewes until you are ready!

 

cynthia

[The Good Shepherd]

Ram lambs as young as 4 months old can impregnate ewes...Been there done that!

 

As long as your ewes are in the barn out of the wind they will be fine. Make a check around 9 pm and than don't check again before 5:30 or 6:00 am; your activity, checking on them, could bring them into labour when they aren't meant to. Let the ewes do their jobs;

 

We've lambed in -20C and inside the barn they are just fine; We've had to lamb outside in -20C and they need to be darn good mothers to have them survive in that weather...but if there isn't any wind it is doable!

 

Good luck and let mother nature take it's course...and next year, no yearling ram lamb with the ewes until you are ready!

 

cynthia

 

Thanks Cynthia,

 

We already lost 2 lambs - this really sucks

[Debbie Meier]

Oh heck, we are praying for teens when lambing comes around, right now we are hitting -25 below, each morning I go out hoping that there are no surprises, our first lambs are officially due Feb 18th but normally we are lambing now.

 

Lots of clean dry straw in as draft free area as possible. Our barn is steel sided, we line the walls in a corner with strawbales stacked four high and then place fence panels against the straw, this helps reduce the draft and keeps the cold of the steel away from the lambs, this year we have it lined with grass hay. When we get the sub zero temps I make sure that I have plenty of clean dry towels to help get them dry as fast as possible and put alot of focus on getting ears dried off, we had a few running around with 1/2 of their ears missing last year even after thinking that I had them good and dry. I know a lot of folks use heat lamps, but we found that they don't do much, atleast not when it gets really cold, right now even our heated water dishes are not staying clear of ice. Dry, out of the drafts and nursing good has been most important.

 

If I get one that is severly chilled (they get unresponsive) bring them into the house, run a warm water bath in the kitchen sink. Put the lamb in a plastic bag that has no leaks with their head out and place their body in the bath being careful not to get them wet. It is also handy to milk some colostrum from your first ewe and freeze it into ice cube trays. I then will thaw the cubes in warm water bath and feed a chilled one after it recovers from the chill before taking it back out to the ewe.

 

Just some things that I have had to do to keep the little buggers kicking when they are born when it is really cold.

 

BTW...you know it is cold when the placenta hanging from the ewe swings into the gate and instantly freezes to it (Brrrrr)

 

Good luck.

 

Deb

[Debbie Meier]

Thanks Cynthia,

 

We already lost 2 lambs - this really sucks

 

Bummer. Sorry to hear that.

[The Good Shepherd]

Oh heck, we are praying for teens when lambing comes around, right now we are hitting -25 below, each morning I go out hoping that there are no surprises, our first lambs are officially due Feb 18th but normally we are lambing now.

 

Lots of clean dry straw in as draft free area as possible. Our barn is steel sided, we line the walls in a corner with strawbales stacked four high and then place fence panels against the straw, this helps reduce the draft and keeps the cold of the steel away from the lambs, this year we have it lined with grass hay. When we get the sub zero temps I make sure that I have plenty of clean dry towels to help get them dry as fast as possible and put alot of focus on getting ears dried off, we had a few running around with 1/2 of their ears missing last year even after thinking that I had them good and dry. I know a lot of folks use heat lamps, but we found that they don't do much, atleast not when it gets really cold, right now even our heated water dishes are not staying clear of ice. Dry, out of the drafts and nursing good has been most important.

 

If I get one that is severly chilled (they get unresponsive) bring them into the house, run a warm water bath in the kitchen sink. Put the lamb in a plastic bag that has no leaks with their head out and place their body in the bath being careful not to get them wet. It is also handy to milk some colostrum from your first ewe and freeze it into ice cube trays. I then will thaw the cubes in warm water bath and feed a chilled one after it recovers from the chill before taking it back out to the ewe.

 

Just some things that I have had to do to keep the little buggers kicking when they are born when it is really cold.

 

BTW...you know it is cold when the placenta hanging from the ewe swings into the gate and instantly freezes to it (Brrrrr)

 

Good luck.

 

Deb

 

 

Geeeesh Deb where the heck are you at?

 

So, if we have the ewes in the haybarn they should be okay? And we should be checking on them say at 10:00 pm and then not until say 6:00 am? Do you keep them in a group or is it better to put each ewe in a stall? We were planning on having them lamb in March or so when it in the 30's at night and the 60's during the day!

How long do you keep the babies and ewe's inside - when can the safely by outside for a couple of hours?

Sorry to be so stupid, but we really did not expect the little guy - who was born last Feb as far as I know to be a "Stud Muffin"

[juliepoudrier]

My biggest concern would be if you have ewes twinning and the firstborn lamb gets chilled while the ewe is cleaning off the newborn twin. I've had that happen. They will do better if they are in a draft-free barn, but don't bed too deeply or the lambs will have trouble walking in the deep straw, which will make getting around to nurse difficult. It's important that the bedding stay dry. Heat lamps are a fire hazard and to be avoided. You can take the sleeves of old wool sweaters, cut slits for leg holes and put sweaters on the lambs to help keep them warm (for males, make sure you open the bottom far enough forward that they don't soak the sweater when they pee and then stay damp and cold. Tiny dog sweaters also work. If it's really cold (and it doesn't get that cold here in NC) I will put a sweater on until I'm sure the lamb is dry and has nursed at least. As Debbie noted, lambs that get chilled will not nurse, and it becomes a vicious cycle. So the two most important things are getting the lambs dry and getting them nursing. On the latter, it's better to let the lamb and ewe sort it out, especially if your ewes are first timers. Too much fiddling and trying to help on your part can backfire. You can put your finger in a lamb's mouth to see if it's warm. A cold mouth is a bad sign and means you'll need to get the lamb warmed up ASAP. There are all sorts of methods, the one Debbie described being one of them. If a lamb is really chilled, there's no sense in trying to get food into it until you've warmed it up. Hypothermia will pretty much stop gut action, so anything you shove in there is just going to sit there undigested. But that said, if you get a lamb that is hypothermic and you get it warmed up, you can tube feed to help get it going again. Oh, and just because you don't see a lamb nurse doesn't mean it's not nursing. If its mouth is warm, you can assume it's eating.

 

Just some other thoughts. Most experienced ewes will do fine, as Cynthia noted. If you're new to lambing, you might want to err on the side of caution and if you see a lamb in trouble, go ahead and help it. The down side to that is that you could end up with a bunch of bottle lambs. But that may be a better choice than losing them. (For the one time I had a twin get cold while the other lamb was being born, I brought the chilled lamb into the house and kept it in a dog crate overnight. I milked some of the colostrum from the ewe and added that to milk replacer. The ewe accepted the lamb back the next day. It probably smelled right to her because I had fed it some of her colostrum).

 

We are having a colder than normal winter (for NC), and of course I bred ewes to lamb at the end of this month. I may be sorry.... (though I'll admit that the frozen mud beats the unfrozen mud!)

 

J.

[The Good Shepherd]

Hubby just called (He took the day off) - we have another baby

 

It was a single and is twice the size of the twins from my hair ewe (we lost one), it is nursing really good and the mom is taking care of it, so its either a Karakul or a Churro. Thank goodness!!!!

 

Should we take the lamb inside tonight (in a dog crate in the bathroom?)

 

Geeeeesh I am really excited and thankful because it almost killed Hubby to loose the 2 lambs.

[juliepoudrier]

No on taking the lamb inside at night. If it's up, dry, and nursing well it will be just fine with its mom. I wouldn't take any lamb from a ewe unless the lamb is chilled/hypothermic and needs to be warmed up (or the ewe has for some reason rejected the lamb). By nightfall, the new lamb should have nursed enough and be plenty dry to withstand the cold alongside its mama.

 

J.

[Debbie Meier]

We're in north central Iowa, the last weather report for tommorrow and Thursday was a high of -2, this sucks and is getting old. The forecast is calling for 20-30 on Sunday, we just need to hold on...

 

Any way, don't bring the lambs into the house unless they are distressed. If they are up, nursing well and dry they will be fine. I don't let my lambs go out with a group until they are a few days old to make sure they are mothered up good. But our barn set up and alleys are confusing and get congested, especially at doorways. I try to pick a nice quiet sunny day when I turn them out and usually in a pen alone or with other ewes that just lambed. As lambing progresses I end up with two groups, one group of ewes that are not close to lambing yet and one group of ewes with lambs and ewes that are close to lambing.

 

Another thing that we do, we strip just a little milk out of both teats of the ewe right after lambing to make sure she has good flow. We have a couple of ewes that get plugged up, one had lost every lamb prior to her coming here. The first time she lambed here I discovered she was plugged, lamb went to nursing and we have not lost one since. But, I always make sure she is clear.

 

As Julie mentioned keep track of the first born when you have twins, typically if it is up and around before the ewe has the second it will probably be ok but I would make sure it is fairly dry, but if she drops them one after another she may forget the first.

 

Deb

[Debbie Meier]

You and hubby are going to have to get use to losing lambs. We hate to have it happen, but it does. We have a higher rate of loss with first time mommas, then I have had more then a few that I had to assist, either by adding a some gentle traction or gently pushing the lamb back in and bringing a leg forward that was bound at the shoulder. Every now and then we have a ewe that rejects a lamb. I have someone with 10 kids and home schools that I call when that happens, they have a lot of fun raising them, more then me... Each of those situations prevented a loss and sometimes two.

 

Deb

[Lenajo]

sh** happens and all that - it's farming. sometimes you leave the ram lamb in, and sometimes he jumps the fence! Right now a friend is lambing in temps that are about 30 degrees less than normal. Nobody expected that - so you deal. We start in 2 weeks here - at this point we may have snow, or ice, or both. Not expected to say the least!

 

The killing combination is cold and wet both. Adding the factor of the ground cover. If the lambs are out of the wind on dry ground, a good ewe can bring normal lambs through some bitter cold. If you get rain, or the ground is frozen/wet, then you will likely have to step in unless you want high loss numbers. As JP pointed out, the greatest danger is to the second twin. You've got about a 20 minutes window (at best, I would say 10 minutes or less once the exposed temp is below freezing) for that lamb to get up, get dry, and nurse. Every second wet and hungry that lamb spends will cost it in vital strength to survive.

 

I check my ewes at midnight, and then again at 5am if the weather is bad or they are very heavy to the point I anticipate problems (I have some ewes that quad). If it's icy rain, then I try to pull the most eminent into the largest area of the barn. Even then you can miss judge and bring the wrong ewes in, so Mom and I do 2 hour rotating checks if the weather is that bad.

 

I have used jackets, but I prefer plastic walmart bags with neck and front leg holes popped through and tied in a knot to fit. I like those discs you can microwave to hold heat for hours - I wrap those in the towel, put a weak lamb's torso on the it, wrap them both in a towel and let them warm up while I do other things. As soon as they have a warm mouth I tube them with 2-4 oz of colostrum with a shot of molasses in it.

 

My only problem with barn lambing is that overcrowding can cause mismothering and abandonment. Obviously the risk of being exposed to this horribly low temps is of greater concern so again, you deal. I'd try to divide the barn as best I could, and jug the newborns with the right dam asap. Beware granny syndrome - you need to pen off determined grannies quickly and keep them away until they lamb themselves.

 

And no, if I had a barn and a nursing lamb I would not bring it into the house at night away from it's mother.

[Cynthia P]

Great advice from everyone. Don't bring a lamb that is up and drinking into the house overnight. They survive very low temps after they are dry and have had colostrum. We usually let them lamb in the main area (and you only have 10 ewes), move them to a jug as soon as they have lambed and spend between 1-4 days depending on the number of lambs born and how weak they seem.

 

When you are using towels to dry them off it is ok to use the same towel on twins but don't use that towel on other lambs from other ewes. If you have to warm a lamb keep it in the towel that the birthing fluids are on (once dry...and up) when you bring it back to the mom. Bring it back as soon as possible to get drinks from mom. My guide was when they are standing, walking forward, sucking vigoursly on the finger/nipple and the temp is up.

 

Excellent advice to get some colostrum from either the single's or one that loses it's lamb (it has to be good for something)

 

It's your first time, your bound to be nervous. The sheep generally know how to do this! Good luck

[The Good Shepherd]

Thank you thank you everyone

and yes Cynthia, I am just a wreck I dont know how you guys do it

[Bill Fosher]

Hi Claudia,

 

I'd agree with most of the advice so far. The only thing that I would do differently is that I would do checks through the night. I'd try to do it without turning on any lights at all if you can, and do it quietly. Let the ewes know you're there so you don't startle them, but try not to make them get up if they're sleeping or cudding. The reason I think night checks are important is that because you weren't expecting lambing, your ewes probably have not had adequate nutrition, so you will probably have low birth weight lambs, which can chill very quickly. You may need to dry some of them off, and I think you will also need to be checking neonatal lambs pretty frequently to make sure that they're full and warm.

 

Dry bedding is incredibly important in cold-weather lambing. Lots of straw or waste hay for the ewes and lambs to bed down in will be like adding 30 degrees to the air temperature.

 

Teens at night shouldn't be a big challenge to a strong lamb with a milky mother, but it is cold enough to tip the scales if things are less than ducky. I think I'd err on the side of vigilance.

[kajarrel]

Cold lambs will hunch their backs, will "baa" with a low pitch and have a cold mouth (severely cold lambs will be unable to stand and become increasingly unresponsive).

 

One caveat - a severely cold lamb should not be given fomula/colostrum. Only do this after it is warm, otherwise it will aspirate. A severely cold lamb should be given intraperitoneal glucose to provide energy while warming (I warm in a sink as described earlier). If you're going to be lambing during winter and extreme conditions, you should ask your vet/another shepherd how/when to tube feed or give IP injections.

 

Congratulations on your new baby!

 

Kim

 

ETA: Like Bill, we check every 2-4 hours through the night.

[NorthfieldNick]

I'm in the "no overnight checks" camp, but I heavily select for mothering ability. Also, according to my records, my ewes lamb at dawn mostly, a few at dusk. I've not once found a new lamb in the middle of the night. However, I agree with Bill: Since these lambs were unexpected, check often.

 

I generally have my ewes drop their lambs outside, them I bring them into individual pens (called jugs) for 24 hours or so. It's generally warm enough ere during lambing to do that, though. It's really more for my convenience- it's WAY easier to catch lambs for tagging & castrating in a pen than out in the field. Last year, it snowed (wet, gross snow) during lambing, and I brought a group of imminent ewes in. I left them in a group, then separated them out as they lambed. I've never worried about a lamb that was up and nursing in any but the worst weather. Last year, my older lambs would sleep on top of their mothers- the ewes are big, woolly, warm rugs! If you have experienced ewes, that is a BIG help. Sometimes first-timers are just plain dumb about mothering.

 

Good luck! The first time is always an adventure....

[Debbie Meier]

Last year, my older lambs would sleep on top of their mothers- the ewes are big, woolly, warm rugs!

 

I should have taken the camera down to the barn last winter. Often times I would find the ewes bedded down, atleast one lamb bedded down ontop of the ewe with a black tom cat curled in beside the lamb.

 

The black cat is off on one of his haunts right now, wonder if he will be back in time for lambing.

 

Deb

[Bill Fosher]

I posted an updated version of a newsletter article I wrote about winter lambing and hypothermia on my blog this morning.

 

http://edgefieldsheep.blogspot.com/2010/01...rmic-lambs.html

[Cynthia P]

I posted an updated version of a newsletter article I wrote about winter lambing and hypothermia on my blog this morning.

 

http://edgefieldsheep.blogspot.com/2010/01...rmic-lambs.html

 

 

Thanks Bill, excellent synopsis! It is easy to remember what went wrong the year before

[Maralynn]

When we have lambs born in severe weather I take a square of polar fleece and cut slits in each corner and put it on the lamb for a jacket. I usually leave them on for a week or so until they have they're own layer of insulating fat to help keep them warm.

[juliepoudrier]

Bill,

That was a great write up on your blog! I printed it out and gave it to a first-time farmer friend to save for reference, since they had some issues with chilled babies this year. Thanks for taking the time to write it and post a link.

 

J.

[Bill Fosher]

Hi Julie and Cynthia,

 

I hope it's useful. I was going to post it here, but at 1300 words in length it seemed a little cumbersome for this format.

[The Good Shepherd]

Thank Bill, I also printed it out it sure is good info!!

 

To keep you all updated no other lambs yet. All the pregnate ewe's are in the barn overnight and outside during the day (Hubby goes home for his lunch break to let them out. Its been 50 the last 2 days).

We are playing today by ear because its suposed to be only in the 30's with the wind at 20 miles an hour and a change of light snow. My worst fear is that they start lambing during the day today while we are at work!!!!

 

Thanks to everyone here I feel a little better about the 2 lambs we already have, they seem to be doing good!! The bigger one is a Churro and just adorable !!!!! The little black tyke who lost his brother is starting to explore his pen a bit!

 

 

Thank you all for your help so far!!!

[Gloria Atwater]

HI all ~

 

I've some friends here winter lambing, also, though thank goodness northern Nevada is not suffering the cold, just now.

 

One trick a friend does is divide her horse stalls into three or four jugs, each. Then she'll put a ewe in each one, so that when they lamb, the babies know who mama is, and there'll be added warmth of the others in proximity. Bear in mind, these stalls have solid walls on three sides, so it might not be the same in more open pens.

 

She also has used heat lamps for years with success, but one must be VERY careful in their use. Hung securely, wiring good, etc. So, if you're not comfortable with heat lamps then never mind.

 

DEFINITELY dry, clean bedding is the most important thing. Shavings, waste hay, straw, whatever, but use a manure fork to keep up with the soggy stuff. If they're indoors from the wind and snow, you should do well.

 

However, as somebody said, you're going to lose a couple every year. As a friend of mine likes to say, "When you have livestock, you're going to have dead stock."

 

The mama ewes will take good care of the babies, though, once they're dried off and have sucked. Don't intrude yourself too much, and don't take babies in the house unless you see them in distress.

 

Best of luck!

Cheers ~

 

Gloria