Laurae Posted February 13, 2007 Report Share Posted February 13, 2007 So this weekend I'm traveling to a Jack Knox clinic. I live in Colorado, where there's been a foot of snow or more on the ground since mid-December. Consequently, I haven't been able to work my novice dog at all in ten weeks (the most time by far we've ever taken off). Is all that time off going to affect him? I'm afraid we may not get as much out of the clinic as we would if we'd been able to train during this time. And we'd been on a real upswing in the weeks before it started snowing--rats! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
juliepoudrier Posted February 13, 2007 Report Share Posted February 13, 2007 I think how time off affects a dog's training and work depends on the individual dog. I have one who does better with regular work and one you could put up for a while and when you pulled her out again she'd be as good as the day you put her up. That said, I know there are people who take their dogs to Jack Knox clinics once a year when he's in their area and the dogs don't start back at square one each time he comes around, and they do progress each time. One factor that might affect your dog is the young age, but both of you will still get plenty out of the clinic. And remember you're not going to the clinic to show Jack how good your dog is; you're there for him to help you with any faults/problems your dog has. So if she's a little rough, it'll just give him that much more to work on. Have fun! J. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rebecca, Irena Farm Posted February 13, 2007 Report Share Posted February 13, 2007 There's a dog that comes to Jack Knox clinics here (well, in VA), maybe every six months or so. He sees sheep exactly every six months, at the clinics with Jack. He picks right off where he left off, every time, and progresses a little by the end of the weekend. Jack feels that not only do they come out right if you put them up right, but he even believes they think about it a bit while they are away from sheep. Say hi! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Laurae Posted February 13, 2007 Author Report Share Posted February 13, 2007 Okay, that's encouraging--hopefully Taz will be of the pick-up-where-he-last-dropped-off variety... I cannot tell you how absolutely PAINFUL it is to try to concentrate on my day job right now, when really all I can think about is this weekend. I can't wait!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stockdogranch Posted February 13, 2007 Report Share Posted February 13, 2007 For a youngster, time off can sometimes make them a bit more "exuberant" when they are first back on stock. However, I have been working with students for ten years, and it's remarkable that, when students take time off, sometimes even many months, the dogs pick up exactly right where they were that last time out. I've seen it over and over agian. It's as if no time passed for the dog at all...the handlers, well, that can be another story! Anna Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kelpiegirl Posted February 14, 2007 Report Share Posted February 14, 2007 Hi Anna I have heard the same thing. Maybe it's because when they finally get on the same page as you, and leave off for a bit, they come back to that same page? I guess it's all in how you leave it We finally have some snow- in my neck of the woods, so probably no training for a while, and that freaks me out- not that she won't be able to work- that rots too- but I won't be able to work!!!!!!!! Be easy on us newbie handlers- it is rather like synchronized swimming- sure, the bottom end of that hand stand "looks" easy, but when you are the bottom, and the dog is the part sticking out of the water, tipping, and falling, it shows it ain't- until the wise one (trainer) comes into the picture and the dog looks like the eiffel tower- so straight.... We try I tell ya! Julie For a youngster, time off can sometimes make them a bit more "exuberant" when they are first back on stock. However, I have been working with students for ten years, and it's remarkable that, when students take time off, sometimes even many months, the dogs pick up exactly right where they were that last time out. I've seen it over and over agian. It's as if no time passed for the dog at all...the handlers, well, that can be another story! Anna Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stockdogranch Posted February 14, 2007 Report Share Posted February 14, 2007 Hi, Kelpiegirl! I was teasing...that's why I used the smily (even tho it had rolling eyes). That's the hard thing about the internet--you can't "hear" a tone of voice. I am a big kidder, and believe me, I totally remember! It seems when a new handler is beginning with a new dog (especially a young, keen one), that there is a period of time, sometimes lasting maybe a month, sometimes even up to 5 or 6 months, when all you're doing in there with your dog is trying to stay alive and on your feet. It's a form of very mildly controlled chaos. You're trying to keep the dog from taking cheap shots and pulling wool; you're walking backwards as fast as you can while the dog is coming a bit too hard and too fast, so the sheep are running you over, while the trainer is out there telling you to, "walk faster! Now turn and go the other way! No--the OTHER other way! Don't let that dog beat you! YOU decide which way you're going--don't let the dog dictate! Get your crook out there! Don't let that dog just circle! Keep moving--don't stop!" and my personal favorite, "My dead grandmother walks faster than that!!" Well, the ONLY difference between that and an experiecned handler with a young enthusiastic pup is that the handler has better timing, and doesn't have to think so much about his/her next move. But the pup's still gonna beat you every now and then, and you're still gonna end up on your keister every now and then, and the pup's still gonna get some cheap shots in. And it's still the coolest thing on the planet! Anna Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Laurae Posted February 14, 2007 Author Report Share Posted February 14, 2007 Yeah, perhaps I should have rephrased the question: "how will time off affect me?" Taz is truly a different dog when he is being handled by someone with experience. His pacing is much steadier, he works way further out, and he is generally much calmer. I have a tendency to get overexcited and ratchet him way up. My timing is always just a hair (or more than a hair) off, and I tend to react to what is happening rather than set up situations in a proactive way. It's probably pretty painful for others to watch Maybe the time off will actually turn out to be good for me...I'll give a full report when I get back Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
juliepoudrier Posted February 14, 2007 Report Share Posted February 14, 2007 Laurae, If it makes you feel any better, I'm an open handler with pretty good timing and dog/sheep savvy who trained one of my two open dogs myself (we came up the ranks together) and yet when I had my youngster (not quite a year old then) at a Jack Knox clinic recently the difference in her work when he was working her and when I was working her was pretty much night and day (a fact he kindly pointed out to all the spectators!). So even more experienced handlers can go through what you're going through! That's why we pay to get help from him.... J. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kelpiegirl Posted February 14, 2007 Report Share Posted February 14, 2007 I know:)) I think it must look Pretty bad sometimes! I am having the most wonderful experience of my life. I love your descriptions!!!! Julie Hi, Kelpiegirl! I was teasing...that's why I used the smily (even tho it had rolling eyes). That's the hard thing about the internet--you can't "hear" a tone of voice. I am a big kidder, and believe me, I totally remember! It seems when a new handler is beginning with a new dog (especially a young, keen one), that there is a period of time, sometimes lasting maybe a month, sometimes even up to 5 or 6 months, when all you're doing in there with your dog is trying to stay alive and on your feet. It's a form of very mildly controlled chaos. You're trying to keep the dog from taking cheap shots and pulling wool; you're walking backwards as fast as you can while the dog is coming a bit too hard and too fast, so the sheep are running you over, while the trainer is out there telling you to, "walk faster! Now turn and go the other way! No--the OTHER other way! Don't let that dog beat you! YOU decide which way you're going--don't let the dog dictate! Get your crook out there! Don't let that dog just circle! Keep moving--don't stop!" and my personal favorite, "My dead grandmother walks faster than that!!" Well, the ONLY difference between that and an experiecned handler with a young enthusiastic pup is that the handler has better timing, and doesn't have to think so much about his/her next move. But the pup's still gonna beat you every now and then, and you're still gonna end up on your keister every now and then, and the pup's still gonna get some cheap shots in. And it's still the coolest thing on the planet! Anna Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Laurae Posted February 14, 2007 Author Report Share Posted February 14, 2007 Um, Julie, I think there are probably a few orders of magnitude difference there! One day I hope to be in your shoes. For now, most of the time my goal is to get out of my dog's way enough to let him do what he knows instinctively! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pipedream Farm Posted February 16, 2007 Report Share Posted February 16, 2007 I find every time I start a new young dog I have to relearn the timing. It's easy to forget how crazy they are when they start out. I eventually get it back --part of it too is that they're all slightly different. Some are nippier, some need encouragement, etc. When I was training Rae, she was driving, but had no flank commands. I was really struggling to get her to learn them. Then along came a huge snow/ice storm and working dogs was out of the question for over a month. When I got her out again, guess what? She was driving and taking flank commands like she had been doing it for years! In her case, the time off did wonders for her. Renee Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iLLt3cK Posted February 19, 2007 Report Share Posted February 19, 2007 I just took trip to Paris, France for two weeks and brought Tate out to sheep after our time away and he picked up right where we left off. He was a little more pushy during our first outing but settled down nicely right afterward. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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