video of BC working

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Found this video on You Tube - probably everyone has seen it but me. But from the perspective of someone who has never actually seen in person a dog working sheep, this video somehow made a few things clear to a rank know-nothing like myself. Fortunately I was alone in the room when I first watched it, because I burst out with, "That's a shed! Hey, so that's how it works!"

The dog seemed very large as BCs go to me. His/her name was "Devoted One." Seemed a bit verbose to me, but again, what do I know?

 

I'd love to hear what anyone has to say about this dog, it's work, etc.

 

Video here:

[Sue R]

I'll venture a guess or few - I think the dog may be largely from show lines for several reasons; I noticed that the person breeds; many other videos from this person are showing agility competitions; the dog seemed rather mechanical; too much reliance on the "down" (although I wish my dog would take my "downs" as seriously); the dog seemed a bit weak and working in close and using physical presence rather than a reasonable distance, less movement, and eye; the dog was a bit grippy at times in close contact when facing the sheep which was apparently a substitute for power; the handler made the hole for the sheds without much help from the dog, which seemed a bit confused on one or two of the sheds with regards to which group to hold.

 

I don't believe that really good handlers with really good dogs spend time splicing video footage and setting it too music. That's too much along the lines of agility or freestyle videos, and I don't think real stockwork is the primary goal for this handler, this kennel, or probably this dog. Looks like a hobby to me. And maybe I am totally off-base, which is not unlikely as I am not very perceptive generally.

 

That said, the handler and the dog together did a much better job than I would ever do - at least in this edited context. I don't mean to offend.

 

If you want to see real quality work by top handlers and dogs, try "30 Years of One Man and His Dog". Just make sure you get the format you can play on US players (unless you have an all-region DVD player or play it on your computer), not the UK/European format. Or try Rural Route Videos' productions of World Trials and other top-rate trials. On YouTube, you can sometimes find really impressive runs posted from the International Supreme, UK Nationals, and some US/UK/European trials.

[geonni banner]

I'll venture a guess or few - I think the dog may be largely from show lines for several reasons; I noticed that the person breeds; many other videos from this person are showing agility competitions; the dog seemed rather mechanical; too much reliance on the "down" (although I wish my dog would take my "downs" as seriously); the dog seemed a bit weak and working in close and using physical presence rather than a reasonable distance, less movement, and eye; the dog was a bit grippy at times in close contact when facing the sheep which was apparently a substitute for power; the handler made the hole for the sheds without much help from the dog, which seemed a bit confused on one or two of the sheds with regards to which group to hold.

 

I don't believe that really good handlers with really good dogs spend time splicing video footage and setting it too music. That's too much along the lines of agility or freestyle videos, and I don't think real stockwork is the primary goal for this handler, this kennel, or probably this dog. Looks like a hobby to me. And maybe I am totally off-base, which is not unlikely as I am not very perceptive generally.

 

That said, the handler and the dog together did a much better job than I would ever do - at least in this edited context. I don't mean to offend.

 

If you want to see real quality work by top handlers and dogs, try "30 Years of One Man and His Dog". Just make sure you get the format you can play on US players (unless you have an all-region DVD player or play it on your computer), not the UK/European format. Or try Rural Route Videos' productions of World Trials and other top-rate trials. On YouTube, you can sometimes find really impressive runs posted from the International Supreme, UK Nationals, and some US/UK/European trials.

 

Tried finding the DVD in a region 1 or all-region format - no dice. But I'm planning to replace my player soon and will be getting an region-free player...

 

Thanks for your comments - show lines would, I suppose account for the size and shagginess of the dog. And I suppose the handler "drawing the dog a picture" on the shed was why I was able to "connect the dots!" Usually I'm at sea when watching a trialing video - I mostly can't see/watch the dog and the handler at the same time, so I don't have a sense of how much of what the dog is doing is his idea or the handler's. I've got to educate myself about what the commands and whistles mean. Then I'll be more able to grasp what I'm looking at.

[Sue R]

It just seemed, and I could easily be wrong, that it was more a matter of commands and obedience than the dog feeling and working its stock. I felt the downs (the way they were happening) to be just one indication of that.

 

As for appearance, well, the dog's physical appearance is very typical of show lines but, since working dogs are not selected on appearance, it could be totally from working lines and have nothing to do with anything. But, it's just a guess when combined with seeing the other videos listed and the whole general appearance of the video.

 

Again, I might be way off the mark, and I hope folks who really know what they are talking about will contribute.

[kelpiegirl]

My take is that I don't really have one, except a couple observances. One, the dog seemed a bit chunky Heeeere we go, back to that form again

 

Two, the video seemed to highlight speed more toward the end, and also a bit of amping the dog up. Half the reason the sheep were ornery at the end, was because the dog was in their faces so much. It's just asking for a fight. I didn't know if he lay down on his own, or what. It wasn't bad work, I don't think, shed was good. But, here is my all time favorite video of a BC on sheep, and I can't seem to put it out of my mind when I hear the song.

 

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My take is that I don't really have one, except a couple observances. One, the dog seemed a bit chunky Heeeere we go, back to that form again

 

Two, the video seemed to highlight speed more toward the end, and also a bit of amping the dog up. Half the reason the sheep were ornery at the end, was because the dog was in their faces so much. It's just asking for a fight. I didn't know if he lay down on his own, or what. It wasn't bad work, I don't think, shed was good. But, here is my all time favorite video of a BC on sheep, and I can't seem to put it out of my mind when I hear the song.

 

 

Hmmm, that was my first thought when the dog in the vid I posted was (doing his outrun?) first heading for the sheep - he looks like a Rough Collie moving at a gallop - grown dog, but he has a "puppy-roll.". There's a crane-shot of a Rough Collie running in the 2006 (7?) version of "Lassie" which the dog was running up a hillside. I was actually amazed that the Lassie moved as well as he did - but BC'c are a whole different planet - so fluid - no wasted motion.

 

I see on repeat viewings that he seemed to not have good control of his throttle - when to go fast, when to go slow - also it seemed like he was very responsive to a lie down command, rather than lowering his body on his own to take pressure off the sheep. Please excuse my mangled terminology.

 

In the second video the dog seemed to have more sense of what to do without guidance - at least, (since the handler is invisible and inaudible in the video) such was my impression from the dog's fluidity and concentrated look. She seemed to be saying, "Look here you sheep, I know what's wanted here so no shilly-shallying and no one gets bothered."

 

I loved the sheep in the second video. Are they Scottish Blackface? Beautiful creatures!

[Sue R]

Hmmm, that was my first thought when the dog in the vid I posted was (doing his outrun?) first heading for the sheep - he looks like a Rough Collie moving at a gallop - grown dog, but he has a "puppy-roll.". There's a crane-shot of a Rough Collie running in the 2006 (7?) version of "Lassie" which the dog was running up a hillside. I was actually amazed that the Lassie moved as well as he did - but BC'c are a whole different planet - so fluid - no wasted motion.

Maybe you are not aware but when they filmed that "Lassie" movie, the work was done by Border Collies (off camera) and their handler. Lassie didn't seem to do much of anything with regards to the sheep except to run into the flock and split it up in the aerial view. And I have always been a "Lassie" fan, since the TV show in my (ahem) younger days (I purposely didn't say "youth" but that's what it was) and bawling every time I saw the old movie in reruns on TV (the time my Mom, my sister-in-law, and myself watched it, we all headed to different rooms at the end to bawl our eyes out - sentimental softies - even my Dad would have a sniffle or two, but it must have just been allergies or something in his eye).

 

I see on repeat viewings that he seemed to not have good control of his throttle - when to go fast, when to go slow - also it seemed like he was very responsive to a lie down command, rather than lowering his body on his own to take pressure off the sheep. Please excuse my mangled terminology.

 

That's why I'm feeling he's a bit mechanical, or working mostly off commands and not from instinct - he doesn't seem to be reading his stock terribly much and mainly responding to what he is told to do, although he still does display some working style.

 

As you've seen, there is quite a difference between that dog's style and approach (and handling) and that of Dot, who seems to be really reading her stock and responding on her own (although, without sound, it's hard to say what's instinct and what's commands), and being much more fluid (as you noted). She's focussed, intense, balancing, and just working more than being directed to work.

 

Again, JMO.

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"Maybe you are not aware but when they filmed that "Lassie" movie, the work was done by Border Collies (off camera) and their handler. Lassie didn't seem to do much of anything with regards to the sheep except to run into the flock and split it up in the aerial view. And I have always been a "Lassie" fan, since the TV show in my (ahem) younger days (I purposely didn't say "youth" but that's what it was) and bawling every time I saw the old movie in reruns on TV (the time my Mom, my sister-in-law, and myself watched it, we all headed to different rooms at the end to bawl our eyes out - sentimental softies - even my Dad would have a sniffle or two, but it must have just been allergies or something in his eye)."

Sue R

I thought they did a great job on the last Lassie movie. I never for a moment imagined that that dog was working those sheep, but I thought that the two principal dogs they used for the film were very nice Collies - not nearly so extreme as show dogs. I make no bones about it - I bawl my eyes out when poor Lassie is shuffling through the snow to collapse at the schoolyard gate.

All I have to hear to kick my waterworks on at ANY TIME is the violins at the end of the original "Lassie Come Home," and Joe saying, "Oh Lassie, You're my Lassie come-home!" Bawwwwwwwwwww!