specialstar Posted November 2, 2002 Report Share Posted November 2, 2002 My pup had her first exposure to sheep! It was so exciting. At first she was pretty timid, but after a while, she figured out it was ok. By the end of the session, she was circling and really excited that she was helping "Mom" move the sheep. I am so excited to see her do what she was bred to do for the first time! Wow, what a rush! ------------------ Marcell M. Loomis Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cowsavy Posted November 2, 2002 Report Share Posted November 2, 2002 That is great that she latched on. But becareful about letting her circle. I don't let mine circle at all if i can help it. It looks like they circle but I keep changing directions so it is really not a circle. I have found if a dog learns to circle when they are sent out to gather stock they will circle them instead of bringing them to you. I made this mistake on my first two dogs and when I sent them out they would garther the cattle but would circle them till I got close enough to give the get behind comand. I read an article on this and the next dogs I didn't let circle these dogs will make a good outrun and bring stock stright back to me whether they can see me or not. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest PairDogx1.5 Posted November 3, 2002 Report Share Posted November 3, 2002 I think that's great! It's really fun watching a dog turn on. Keep us posted. I'm sure that Cowsavy is right, they seem to have alot of experience. I would only add that 3 different trainers have told me starting with a new dog, if you don't beat them to the spot you need to be to reverse them correctly, let them go around and try and catch it the next time, don't fight it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
specialstar Posted November 3, 2002 Author Report Share Posted November 3, 2002 My pup is really young- 4 months. I really didn't expect her to do much- pretty much was just taking her up to see what she would do. Any suggestions on how to stop the circling? I am REALLY limited on trainers here- pretty much her and one other lady. To add to that, I know nothing about herding- am beginning to read as much as I can, but it isn't the same. How often should I take her up- this lady said to bring her back in the next week or two, so that she can get comfortable and work through the initial hesitation. Watching my pup, she really enjoyed it, but I certainly don't want to "burn her out" or anything. Any help from you can give would be greatly appreciated! ------------------ Marcell M. Loomis Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thor Posted November 3, 2002 Report Share Posted November 3, 2002 I am new at this myself. but I've seen a lot of dogs started, and started a couple myself. The best advice I can give is WAIT. She is only 4 months old. I would wait at least until she is almost 10months old. It is very difficult to see if a dog is "ready". especially for us beginners. But if you want to take her to sheep, don't do it to often, 1-2 times a month is enough. From what I've seen the circling can be an age thing, she isn't ready. I saw a circling dog today, the handler told me that he wasn't ready yet, and that she didn't have enough "contact" with the dog. good luck. ------------------ ---- Thor Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest PrairieFire Posted November 3, 2002 Report Share Posted November 3, 2002 I agree with Thor. 4 Months is WAY too young to seriously start a pup. The dog needs a few things before it can truly "work" stock... The physical ability to cover the stock. The mental ability to learn from the lessons (especially in a natural vs. mechanical way). And an ability to sense pressure - from handler and stock. I've never seen a 4 month old who fits that bill. I did start my last ones at 6-7 months - carefully and under the direct supervision of an International Supreme winner - who I figured knew something about dog training...but I worked 'em no more than a couple times a month until spring came... As far as circling - that is one of the things you want the dog to do - you just want to be able to cut off the dog and get it to change directions based on your pressure, the pressure of a crook, etc...you DON'T want the dog to race around and around the stock, basically out of control... Figure that anytime the dog is out of control, it is doing something you don't want it to do...and it is your job, not to gain control through an "iron hand", but to mold and shape the behaviour into what you want. Sometimes this means working the dog up close, sometimes it means not putting them into situations you know are over thier heads. ------------------ Bill Gary Kensmuir, Working Stockdog Center River Falls, WI 715.426.9877 www.kensmuir.com [This message has been edited by PrairieFire (edited 11-03-2002).] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill Fosher Posted November 3, 2002 Report Share Posted November 3, 2002 There's nothing wrong with letting a wee pup play with sheep from time to time, so long as you're not allowing bad habits to develop. Circling might be a bad habit -- it's hard to say without seeing it. Moreover, it's hard to tell whether something might be the beginning of a bad habit even when you've started a few dogs because each one is so different. Mostly what you want to be doing now is letting her grow up, teaching her right from wrong, making sure that she knows you and knows your voice -- in short, getting her ready to train in a few months. That doesn't mean you shouldn't let her have some time on sheep, but if it starts to become a fight, it's time to stop with sheep and start working on obedience (not competitive obedience -- just getting her to obey you) away from sheep. ------------------ Bill Fosher Surry, NH Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
specialstar Posted November 3, 2002 Author Report Share Posted November 3, 2002 thank you for your advise. I basically took her up to see how she would react- I know that she (or I) are not ready for any real training. I was so glad that she warmed up and showed interest. Now I have the bug! Uh oh... and my girls made me PROMISE we would get a farm! Am I an trouble or what? I am doing basic obediance- she is pretty headstrong, so I know that it is VERY important. She is doing pretty well w/ it. Is it ok to take her up occasionally just to "play" and keep her interested- or should I just stop now, knowing she has basic intinct and pick it back up this spring. We are in Alaska, so like I said- we are VERY limited. Makes me wish I was down in some of your neck of the woods... Thanks again, and I look forward to any/all advise you all can give me! ------------------ Marcell M. Loomis Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest PrairieFire Posted November 3, 2002 Report Share Posted November 3, 2002 Hey Marcell - As Bill Fosher says, taking her in a few times - with EASY stock (no one to knock her ass over teakettle or stomp her into a corner) shouldn't be a bad thing - as long as the entire expereince is pleasant... But I still would caution against it - say, for example, she did get trapped between the boards with a ewe intent on killing her - she hasn't developed enough to know how to get out of it, and isn't strong enough to take the shots well either... I might take her in with a few ewes I know very well - but even then I'd be nervous... Spring will be here before you know it...and she'll be old enough then...in the meantime, spend your time reading and watching videos, developing a bond with her and letting her be a pup... ------------------ Bill Gary Kensmuir, Working Stockdog Center River Falls, WI 715.426.9877 www.kensmuir.com Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest PrairieFire Posted November 4, 2002 Report Share Posted November 4, 2002 OH, and by the way, Marcell... Remember, none of us have seen your dog, or know anything more about him than you have posted - so all our advice is generic. What is important is that you do what YOU feel is right, for both you and your dog... ------------------ Bill Gary Kensmuir, Working Stockdog Center River Falls, WI 715.426.9877 www.kensmuir.com [This message has been edited by PrairieFire (edited 11-04-2002).] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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