Border Collies and Deductive Reasoning

[Tuck's BCBuddy]

I know yall have seen your dogs in action, deductively reaching a solution to a problem, right?

 

I'd be interested in hearing any stories to this topic.

 

Here's one from Tucker...

 

This lad and his ball are ALMOST inseparable. So one day I put his ball on top of the stairway door. The ball has a ridge and sat nice and snug.

 

Step 1, for a few minutes, the Took is going from living room floor to partially up the stairs and back (you could almost see his mind at work, measuring the distance of each location, and realizing, "ain't no way I'm reaching this thing").

 

Step 2, the Tookster tries jumping at the door, hmmm "maybe we can knock it off of there". "Nope, ain't gonna happen."

 

Step 3., the Took notices a potential interference with the top door jamb. "Hmmm, maybe I could push the door with me nose, and that board will knock it down."

 

Ahh, the sweet smell of success, or is that freshly scooped kibble.

 

Took a little while, but he figured it out. And the neat part, a few days later, I put it up there again, and I'd swear I saw him flip me the middle paw as he walked over, nudged the door into full swing with his nose, knocking it off at the door jamb.

 

Not calculus, but I still thought it was pretty cool. So anyone else got any?

[Dixie_Girl]

I got two:

 

1. I have a doggie door that goes to the back yard. One part of the backyard fence runs down from the front corner of the house. (it is just field fencing) I was playing with Jackson in the front yard one day and decided to see what he would do if I threw his ball in the back yard. So I do, and at first he tried to reach it through the fence. Nope, won't work. Then he ran to me, I just said get the ball. He ran back, started to put his head through, then remembered. Then he ran to the back of the house, I know he was checking to see if gate was open, then back to the front. Then he looked at the open front door. Looked at the ball. Zoom! Through the front door, out the doggie door, to the back yard, got the ball and back to the front yard in 7.2 seconds!

 

2.DH likes to watch TV in bed. Jackson thinks it is to play with him. One day DH threw toy and it landed behind the open door. Normally a dog would/could just paw the door away from wall to get the toy. But our gun cabinet is like right up to the door. Maybe 1/2 inch away. So, eventually with trial an error, he learned to bang against door with his paw until it finally bounced away from the wall enough for him to grab door with paw and get toy. He can't do it anymore though. There is now a HUGE hole in the wall from the door knob! DH says, no prob, that I can fix!

[Kitch]

That is too funny.

 

Dublin does stuff like that to me a lot. In one of my "did I honestly think this was gonna work" moments, I purchased a garbage can for the bathroom that had a fairly heavy lid and had a pedal to lift the lid. I bought this in an effort to keep Dublin from getting into...um...stuff.

 

I proudly put it in my bathroom and the next morning as I was getting ready, Dublin was following me around like always. I finished cleaning my face and stepped on the pedal to throw away the cotton ball. Dublin watched me and when I was done he calmly walked over to the can, stepped on the pedal, sniffed inside, then stepped back and sat down. He had an injured dignity look about him and I swear I could almost hear him say, "if you wanted me to stop taking things out of the trash, all you had to do was ask..."

[Rainierlass]

One stands out in my mind the most of late - Tess has many - -

 

Since getting the pup Roz the two of them play really nice together - - Tess never takes any toys or bones away from the pup - -

 

Well last week the pup had one of Tess's favorite toys - - she sat for a second staring at her toy and that darn pup - - looked over her shoulder at the toy box - up she jumps ...runs over ...grabs the bone that Roz seems to end up with the most - - took it over - offered it to Roz - - yep - - Roz dropped the toy grabbed the bone and VOILA!!! Tess took her toy to the other room!!

 

LOL!! I love it!

 

Maggie, Tess, and Roz

[border_collie_crazy]

a couple summers ago when my grandparents were over I was doing some reasoning tests with my dogs, first I placed a ball under a 5 gallon pail, I released all my dogs exept Happy, the other 4 all sniffed around the pail pushing it with their noses. then I shooed the other dogs away and let Happy have a go, she looked at it for a few seconds then grabbed the handle flipped the pail and took the ball.

 

then me and my grandparents were sitting at the table on the deck, I placed the ball in the center of the table and told Happy to get it. she stood on her hinds legs and tries her hardest to reach the ball, then she tried the bench but it was too unstable, so she kept looking at me, so I told her to "do whatever it takes to get the ball" in the blink of an eye she has leaped onto the table, grabbed the ball and jumped off.

 

Happy and I were at my friends house, Happy had been playing in the water, then I opend the door to get a drink and Happy rushed inside, she leaped onto my friends bed, grabbed a towel off her bed, dragged it onto the floor, threw it down, and started to dry herself with it lol

 

Misty was playing the the hose last summer and as she was playing with it she discovered that if she kinks the hose, it will spray with poor pressure. so what she would do it place one paw on the hose, and use her other paw to pinch it upward, then she would wait till me or Happy came close to her, and then she would let it fly at us!

 

not really deductive reasoning but this one is funny lol my friend jokingly said to Misty "who's the ugliest doggie in the world!" and Misty immediently turned her head and look at Happy! :eek:

[nes]

We had Madison sitting on command at 5 weeks old!!

 

That was pretty amazing!! And sooo cute!! She'll still the best sitter I've ever seen, she just naturally sits up really straight.

 

Nes.

[Beth G]

Wow love your stories. Will have to think on if I've got a really good one to tell yet or not...as my pups are only 6 mos old yet.

[JackoDog]

We play with a longe whip with a washcloth on the end for Jacko to chase. When he catches the washcloth, we give him a treat and start over. He hates to give up that washcloth though, but had a hard time hanging onto it since he has to drop it to take the treat. Then he realized that if he stood on the washcloth he could keep it AND get his treat.

 

He also knows that he has to work for treats, so if you have a treat (or anything he perceives as a treat, such as your breakfast) in your hand he will sit, then lie down, then stand, then shake, and go through every command he knows - some more than once! - and a few he doesn't know, trying to get the treat. Our trainer always laughs and says "poor border collie brain."

[Beth G]

OK I've got one, when playing frisbee poppy will bring it back and drop it at my feet.

 

Well the moment he drops it, in will rush pepper and grab and take off, trying to initiate a chase(She loves Poppy to chase her).

So he quickly learned to drop the frisbee and put a paw on it so she can't pick it up before I can reach down, grab it and throw it..lol.

[Sky92x]

Rezso cheats at games.

 

My favorite game with dogs is 'Tug' You know those big "rope bones?"

 

I have one about 2 feet long.

 

With most dogs, I hold it up, and swing it back and forth. (Like a pendulum) The dogs go nuts trying to catch the bottom of the swinging rope.

 

Not Rezso.

 

He took one bite for the bottom, missed, then sat down, watching it swing for a few seconds. Moments later, *chomp* he jumps up, and grabs the stationary top of the tug, right where my hand is holding it.

 

Needless to say I was pretty impressed, I've never seen a dog actually realise that grabbing the still part is much easier than grabbing the swinging end.

 

 

And perhaps this doesn't count, but it's a very unique behavior to him...

 

If I give him a treat that he particularly likes, or share "people food" he doesn't wolf it down.

 

He will grab it with his paws, and nibble at it. I've never seen a dog savor the flavor before.

[painted_ponies]

Last night, it became odiferously obvious that an ex-mouse was somewhere in our bedroom. OH walked around the room, sniffing and looking under things, trying to figure out where the corpse lay. Finally, having no success, he said to no one in particular, "Where *is* it?"

 

Violet, who'd of course been following his every step, walked across the room to the bedroom door, looked behind it, then stared back at OH for a good few seconds before leaving the room.

 

Sure enough - expired mousie lay between the open bedroom door and the wall.

 

I've never trained her to find anything, much less dead bodies, so I've no idea how she knew what OH wanted, unless she just figured it out from watching. Or maybe she was tired of the stench herself and thinks OH is really smart to have figured out her "command" to him to remove the source.

[sweet_ceana]

I am brand new to this site and I have a new puppy who is nine weeks tomorrow. My story is not as clever being that my Ceana is so little, but as a proud new mom I want to brag:

My other half loves his remote control to our televison. Of all the things Ceana has attempted to chew on in her first week with us, he is quickest to respond to her attempts at the remote. Since she is so little things she cannot have go "out of reach" onto the couch. Yesterday after running and playing with the kids next door I was fixing lunch while I hoped Ceana would take a nap. Instead I found her in the family room with her the oh so coveted remote. In stead of chewing, I found her picking up the remote and jumping up to place it on the couch. She would then knock the remote of the couch and then "put it away" again. I am amazed at her capacity to learn as well as understand not only us but her new surroundings.

[Keith Ramsay]

Cute threed... and some great stories!

 

OK... I was having a problem with Angel getting into a certain trash can. I tried all the normal measures, then resorted to a drastic measure.

 

I went and purchased a mousetrap. I got a different type because it only swings 1/2 way and seemend to be a lot more sensitive.

 

I placed it in the trash can:

First day: trash raided, dog sore nose

Second day: trash raided, dog sore nose, dog aware that mousetrap=sore nose

third day: trash left alone

Fourth day: trash raided, dog happy, worst toy in the toy box stuck in mousetrap

 

Moral of the story... some toys are acceptable losses.

[BustopherJones]

When we were housebreaking Annie, whenever she pooped in the house, we would rub her nose in it and throw her out the window. (Fortunately, we only lived on the second floor.) After a couple of days, she understood; now when she poops in the house, she sticks her own nose in it, and then jumps out the window on her own.

 

(Of course, I'm just kidding...)

 

Seriously, the number of references as to the incredible problem-solving abilities of Border Collies are too numerous to list here. But they do seem to have an inherent ability to find creative solutions, and Annie still continues to amaze me on a reguloar basis...

[Sue R]

When Celt has something that Megan wants, she brings me a ball. As soon as I throw it, Celt drops the desired object and goes after the ball. Meanwhile, Megan goes right to that desired object and takes it. Celt comes back and wonders what he missed. Poor guy. She's clever and devious and he's straightforward and open.

[BustopherJones]

Poor guy. She's clever and devious and he's straightforward and open.

Are we talking about dogs here? Because in human relationships...Never mind, I can see myself getting into BIG trouble with this one...Women marching in the street in front of my home carrying signs...Hangings in effigy...Tar and feathers...

[Anda]

Keith Ramsay wrote

First day: trash raided, dog sore nose

Second day: trash raided, dog sore nose, dog aware that mousetrap=sore nose

third day: trash left alone

Fourth day: trash raided, dog happy, worst toy in the toy box stuck in mousetrap

OMG, this is the most amazing story I've heard What a smart pup!

[Rebecca, Irena Farm]

When we were housebreaking Annie, whenever she pooped in the house, we would rub her nose in it and throw her out the window. (Fortunately, we only lived on the second floor.) After a couple of days, she understood; now when she poops in the house, she sticks her own nose in it, and then jumps out the window on her own.

 

(Of course, I'm just kidding...)

The tears are just rolling down my face at this. I SO needed a good laugh today! And the funny thing is, that this is actually pretty much true - this is exactly how a Border collie would learn what you expect them to do! Someone asked me the other day, how do you train them to pop themselves in the crate on command, even when the crate is stacked up or whatever? I take pup and propel him in the crate and say cheerfully, "Load!" About three times of this and pup propels himself right in when he hears the magic word (it helps if there is always a nice treat waiting in there of course ). You have to be careful with this - with great power comes great responsibility - Border collies are smart but they can be VERY literal!

 

Here's a 45 pound dog in a 12" tall crate because I didn't realize the little crate was open and the large crate beside it was shut!

 

 

Border collies are such a peculiar mix of biddable, smarts, and lack of ability to generalize that living with them can seem like crossing into the Twilight Zone sometimes.

[fooshuman]

Rebecca that is such a great picture! I fell out of my seat laughing.

[Maralynn]

Okay y'all, I'm impressed!! My dog still hasn't figured out that when you set the ball down on the water to get a drink, it will sink, to the bottom, and it will take me at least five minutes to find something to fish it out with...

 

Now to be fair, she does know 4 cats, a dozen or so people, and a couple sheep by name... Not to mention she is always watching me and trying to figure out and do what I want her to. She tries sooo hard.

 

Rebecca, I've seen that picture a few times now, and it never ceases to amaze me!!

 

Missy once scrambled to the top of two round hay bales stacked on top of each other (10 feet) when I told her "up" . They aim to please!

[Anda]

Rebecca, that is an incredible picture! LOL

[sandra s.]

That crate picture is priceless

 

Kessie's brains aren't more than average when compared to other BCs, but she has the right scientific spirit .

 

There was a hedgehog in front of our house last night, so I brought it to the porch for her to inspect. And inspect it she did! From all angles and distances. It was hilarious to watch.

And she did figure out that after getting her nose pricked, she'd better skip the paw-slapping experiment.

She spent some time wondering how to get it to move without touching it. In the end she decided to talk to it.

"Rrrro!"...nothing. "Rrrrroo!!!"...

 

Then the cat came out, and since cats are more important, I never learned the next step of hedgehog behaviour analysis.

But I loved the fascination and curiousity, and absence of frustration (which Timmy, for example, would have displayed). She has the perfect mentality to accompany someone through the study of geology !

[Kat's Dogs]

These are amazing! (LOVE the crate picture )

 

At some sale I found a really cool book. " Caninestein" It is like a fun Doggie-IQ test you can do with your dog. It is really fun to do and Dazzle has so much fun with it - it REALLY makes her think. Some of the things are really cool - not just a bunch a tricks to teach your dog.

 

Anyway, Dazzle seems to do things with "scary smarts" a lot. Everything for doing a stand-stay at 3 months old to, well, I won't put a limit on it yet - she is only a year old.

I thought this one was cool (and other people can try it - it is from the book).

 

I gave her a nice bone to chew on. After about a minute of her happily chewing, I took the bone away. I kept the bone in her sight - meanwhile I tied a string around it and now had a long piece of string hanging down from it. I put the bone on a high shelf that she can't reach by jumping up. Then I SHOWED her how to get the bone down - I pulled the string, and caught the bone when it fell. Then I told her to "get it" (one of her commands). She looked at me, then looked at the bone. I was about to tell her to get it again because she was just looking at bone and not doing anything. But just then she grabbed the sting, pulled the bone down, and caught it when it fell!

 

I was impressed. And I knew that things on shelves with strings hanging down are no longer safe!

[Lin]

Skye is in beginning Agility. We were practicing the tire with a ball as a lure. I'd throw the ball through, say tire, she'd jump through, bring the ball back. On one return trip, while she still had the ball in her mouth, I said "tire". She ran up to the tire, stopped and tossed the ball through the tire with her mouth. I just about died laughing

Lin.

[Janet Hannigan]

Great stories!!!! I was watching a Gaelic football game (our county was playing) when Rebel was a couple months old. I was yelling to the TV. GET THE BALL, GET THE BALL. The poor pup ran around and came up to me with HIS ball. I had to pet the wee boy and try to stop laughing (and yes- Tyrone won that game!!!)