bubbles Posted April 25, 2006 Report Share Posted April 25, 2006 Hi there, I am needing some help with a very obnoxious little border (male - 4 months). This little boy doesn't take no for an answer - constantly nips at our feet, goes after the older shepard who finally bit a hole into the pups nose for stealing a bone!! We have tried everything - time outs, redirection, treats for being good and no attention for being bad (although naturally he gets attention). If he has something he shouldn't he knows to run around the coffee table and goes one way while I go the other. It's very frustrating. Won't come when called unless he feels like it. Herds everything in site from cats to cows to cars!!! Only once did that happen (cars). I don't have sheep and may decide to use him for cattle but my last border was nothing like this. She was calm and we really didn't have to do much training. This little guy is crazy!! Any help appreciated!! Thanks! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mosstheboss2000 Posted April 25, 2006 Report Share Posted April 25, 2006 Where in Canada are you located? Cindy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PennyT Posted April 25, 2006 Report Share Posted April 25, 2006 Positive training: Tell your pup, "You positively will not do that." Your pup will not understand this statement. In regard to obnoxious behavior like chasing around the coffee table, demonstrate its meaning by giving him a good little shake and if that doesn't work whack him one. You can do this if you have a leash on him so that you can step on it. Oh, and get a crate. There's a great post somewhere on these boards on teaching recalls. Search "recall." Penny Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
laurie etc Posted April 25, 2006 Report Share Posted April 25, 2006 Arghhhh...I don't advocate "whacking him one" but how about setting some firm guidelines up and sticking to them. Positive is not Permissive. Definitely agree with the Crate, and limiting his freedom with a leash or confinement, especially if your older dog is having to take matters into his own "paws" and dole out the discipline. That's not really fair to the older dog, and likely to escalate and cause some vet bills. Check out "Nothing in Life is Free" ! http://k9deb.com/nilif.htm Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
karrie Posted April 25, 2006 Report Share Posted April 25, 2006 I will second get a crate and he is in it unless leashed. I didn't think attaching the leash to me would make a huge difference in Sam but when I did it ~It really worked. Nipping~ Are you still walking once he starts or stopping and correcting him? If you are still walking stop/freeze tell him Firmly NO or ANNNT. Course, if he is leashed to you it becomes difficult to herd you. Running/recall~ There is some really good recall info on the general board. One thing I would like to say is don't chase. It is a game then. I made that mistake with Tuck. He had an excellent recall in the house but his outside was more of when he choose. It cost him his life. I used the info the others gave for learning recall and Sam is the opposite of Tuck. Sam comes no matter the distraction. We still have some work in this area when it comes to my boys on their skateboards but even then no more than 2 calls. The second call is when he is coming but stops and looks like he wants to go after the board. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Miztiki Posted April 25, 2006 Report Share Posted April 25, 2006 Click here: How to teach a solid recall. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bubbles Posted April 25, 2006 Author Report Share Posted April 25, 2006 thanks for advice - yelling and saying NO when nipping at ankles does nothing!!! Even shaking him off firmly does nothing. He just comes back for more! Vet says he is the mouthiest pup!! He goes into the crate when we need a break and as well for time outs. I will try leashing him to me! thanks! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Little Bo Boop Posted April 25, 2006 Report Share Posted April 25, 2006 LOL, you might try putting some theragesic,or Ben gay type stuff on your ankles. My Mike was a terrible biter as a pup, no matter what we did. So I just started putting Theragesic on my hands, when he started to bite, he'd get a whiff of that stuff and he quit in no time. It really works. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mosstheboss2000 Posted April 25, 2006 Report Share Posted April 25, 2006 I would recommend find a good trainer in your area familiar with the breed and starting puppy classes or privates... sounds like he may be already figuring out things while you are trying to keep up.. It is so important to know what your training criteria is , and how to get what you want. Letting him run around loose and herd all that is moving and be a overall brat is letting him have a unconstructive outlet where these behaviours will be self reinforced. He is getting exactly what he wants and his behaviours reinforce what he is doing.. you can hit him or treat him it doesnt matter. I definitly DO NOT recommend whacking him OR shaking him...you CAN train without intimidation or creating conflict. It may be that this pup needs some EXTRA foundation and impulse control work so that he understands the rules to life and that he is working with you! Long lines are GREAT for pups like this... if he is loose and you cant catch him you have already set yourself up for failure.. If you havent worked with a dog like this or done the training work before finding someone to work with weekly or on a occasional basis will help you to be consistent and figure out what exactly you are wanting to acheive. You dont want to end up in 6 months finding that you are tying him up all day because he has found chasing cars to be a super fun past time. Consistency is the key!! Good Luck with your active boy! Sounds like he will be a learning experience for all. Cindy http://www.bordercollierescueont.com Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyrasmom Posted May 2, 2006 Report Share Posted May 2, 2006 All of his behaviors are self rewarding, even if you raise your voice, shake him off, or chase him around the coffee table, it's a big game that he has created and gotten you to play. Whacking him over the head won't help either if it still garners him the attention, albeit negative, that he is still getting in his little games. Restrict his world, get a crate, put him on a long line so that you can control his behavior, set up the behaviors that you know he will exhibit so that you're expecting them and can correct them appropriately. He sounds active and bright, some organized classes would be great, not only do they have to attempt to focus, they're often tuckered out afterwards. Take him for walks, do leash training, show him new things that make his little mind process. The activities need to be initiated and controlled by you. Perhaps it would be helpful to know what things he does do right and what things you do together. I think if you can put time into his training, you'll enjoy it and ultimately enjoy each other a whole lot more. Good luck, Maria PS: I said get a crate, I always have mixed feelings about advocating crates. Crates are great but that means putting time into crate training, a crate is not a place to stick the pup when you're exhausted, it's a training aid, not an alternative. It can be a time-out for him, but not time for you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest doggoddess2006 Posted May 2, 2006 Report Share Posted May 2, 2006 I'm am new to this breed, and some people may disagree with me, but that's ok. I'm still learning. Ok, Some things I have tried that worked were, sticking my finger down his throat, saying "NO bite" and then turning away, and ignoring him. If that didn't work,putting his butt in his crate for time outs of about 2-3 minutes.(He hated those! Which is why I think it broke him of the habit so quick- within one week). sometimes having a smart pup doesnt seem very fun but it is a blessing. My pup hosuebroke in two weeks and I got him at 6 weeks. He would cry or go to the door! But I had to watch him because he only had so much time to give notice with his tiny bladder so I was amazed he could even do that!! He is now 14 wks old. And hasn't had an accident since. But I still let him out every 2-3 hours. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyrasmom Posted May 2, 2006 Report Share Posted May 2, 2006 Don't worry, having a smart pup will become a lot more entertaining as he gets older if you learn right along with him. It's about channeling both the energy and the brains. It's good that you found some corrections that worked, so obviously he can learn and make progress. But what I would still like to know, is what you're doing to keep him from finding his own entertainment? The key to keep him from bad behavior, and it's more like busy-as-a-bee-want-something-to-do behavior, is to encourage him to do other things. Interaction, and lots of it, will be key in getting him to calm down. So, what fun/instructive things do you do together? Maria Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
liane Posted May 2, 2006 Report Share Posted May 2, 2006 your pup sounds like mine!!! i found that when he was doing something naughty i said "bye Jake" and walked out the room,he soon found that he would not get the attention and stop what he was doing. hes 8 months now and still has a naughty moments but this works everytime. with the nipping i found he liked to do it on the stairs so i taught him that if he wants to go up or down the stairs with me he had to carry something like a bone or toy, sounds wierd but it worked. good luck and enjoy your pupxx Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beth G Posted May 11, 2006 Report Share Posted May 11, 2006 What do I do with my pup?(Not sure if you meant me or the poster..lol. ) Well I'm disabled so I'm home all day. On a daily basis, I do training, teach tricks, give long walks, play fetch, and the two pups have 1-2 hrs a day of off- leash run fun together! We live right across the street from a park so we take our 2 yr old son there to play 1-2 times a day at an hour at a time, and run our pups (trying to loosely teach frisbee fetch- but no jumping yet). And since, we always pick up our poop(we hate people that don't do that!),everyone there knows us and loves the pups. They see us walking them all over town and are always commenting on their growth and petting them so their socialization is also coming along nicely. We have alot of fun and it wears them out so we don't really have any house chewing plus they know where their rubber maid "toy box" is and go get out whatever they want to chew. They're really good about it! Occasionally they may try and chew on a toy my son leaves out but I'm watching them like a hawk and so catch them right away. They really learn quick too! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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