Pipedream Farm Posted October 28, 2004 Report Share Posted October 28, 2004 Naaa, I don't get carded anymore. Of course being a guy, getting carded at my age is no thrill; it's just a hassle. I started reading your comment about how Sam looks now at 35 (I mean 34) and thought you were going in a different direction. I'm a baaaaaaad boy. Mark Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bordersprings Posted October 31, 2004 Report Share Posted October 31, 2004 Andrea, It has become clear that your entry in the trial was exceptionally intimidating to all other Kelpies...as you have the only entry in the Kelpie class. The trial is now full - the Our Dog Blue (wine) is chilling, the firewood is stacked and ready for the evening fires, and coolers are ready for ice and libations. Hmmm, is there anything else need for a sheep dog trial? Craig Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blackacre Posted November 1, 2004 Report Share Posted November 1, 2004 Craig, Excellent. A man who knows how to put on a trial. Do you have enough Nursery dogs entered? I'm in the mood to whup some border collie butt and take Kelpie Boy to the Nationals this year. Oh, wait. I'll have to run against that blue-eyed monster of Sam's, won't I? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bordersprings Posted November 1, 2004 Report Share Posted November 1, 2004 I currently have 7 nursery dogs entered. We need one more to get two qualified each day. If all goes well - we should enough time on Saturday to run Open and Nursery - then go to the local winery on the Blue Ridge Parkway (Chateau Morisette - the home of Our Dog Blue) and then return to run ranch dogs. We shall see. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bordersprings Posted November 1, 2004 Report Share Posted November 1, 2004 I have a question for all...what is your perspective on using Vick's (or other high olfactory gels or aroma's, e.g. vanilla) to put up a dog's nose before going to the post at a sheep dog trial. It would seem to me that it would/should be considered a training aid. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cgt Posted November 1, 2004 Report Share Posted November 1, 2004 Sorry I'm so dense, but, well, I am dense. Or my sense of humor is too poorly developed to detect an instance of your rapier wit. Why would somebody do that? Does the dog have a cold? Did this actually happen? Perhaps in some bizarro universe? charlie torre Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bordersprings Posted November 1, 2004 Report Share Posted November 1, 2004 Someone else may know better all the reasons why someone may want to do this - One reason is because they don't want their dog to become distracted by other smells on a field. And yes it did happen - but I don't think this is a particularly rare occurance. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cgt Posted November 1, 2004 Report Share Posted November 1, 2004 You mean people are worried the dog will stop and sniff about during a run? Or that males will be distracted by females in heat? If so, that's a shame. And kind of sad & pathetic. I've not been around THAT much, but I've certainly never heard of this practice. Soon we'll have to have random drug tests (or nose tests, as the case may be). May the best dog win. charlie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cgt Posted November 1, 2004 Report Share Posted November 1, 2004 On a related note... Do people think that when a dog is out searching for sheep on an outrun (which happens a lot out here with BIG outruns on varied terrain) that the dog uses its sense of smell to help them find the sheep? I always assumed they did. But maybe it's not a big factor. But, if so, wouldn't the nose-treatment business interfere with that? charlie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shoofly Posted November 1, 2004 Report Share Posted November 1, 2004 Hey Charlie - I'd think they use the nose on those kinds of outruns. I used to have one of my old dogs get sheep out of wooded areas and i'd see her tracking them with her nose. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blackacre Posted November 1, 2004 Report Share Posted November 1, 2004 I always assumed a dog would jump over a two foot stack of steaks and a tethered bitch in heat on his way out to get sheep and have never seen anything to disabuse me of this conceit, and I've had plenty of males. However, I did have one male stop to breed the set out bitch, who turned out to be in flaming heat. Duh. Anyway, he came around, lifted, got a whiff, swung a leg over and then noticed the sheep were heading downfield, swung his leg back off and raced down the field to head them before they got to the barn. This was at Hop Bottom, where they head downfield plenty fast, but he got there. A. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cgt Posted November 1, 2004 Report Share Posted November 1, 2004 Well, Andrea, that's what I thought. If the dog doesn't feel that way ... well ... see "Sad and Pathetic" in a previous post. charlie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blackacre Posted November 1, 2004 Report Share Posted November 1, 2004 Ah, so. And if anyone on the team is going to be sad and pathetic, it had better be me. Wait, it IS me. A. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cgt Posted November 1, 2004 Report Share Posted November 1, 2004 Hey! We have something in common! c Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tucknjill Posted November 1, 2004 Author Report Share Posted November 1, 2004 I have often thought of using it on Tucker when he is whining his butt off for three weeks in the crate when I have a bitch in heat...I dunno, I just never did it. I hate using any chemicals on them at all and It just kinda bugged me..wouldnt want that on MY nose. Anyway, he knows he BETTER not think about any bitch in heat while working and with one notable exception..never has...so was this an issue at a trial craig? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tucknjill Posted November 1, 2004 Author Report Share Posted November 1, 2004 Oh A, So is the visit in question on? What is your eta to get here? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blackacre Posted November 1, 2004 Report Share Posted November 1, 2004 Yup, I emailed Robin. I'm back from Cleveland on the 22nd, can leave the next day or whenever suits you and Robin. Maybe play at your place for a day or two and then head to Craig's? Your call. Don't know how you Americans deal with Thanksgiving being midweek. A. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bordersprings Posted November 1, 2004 Report Share Posted November 1, 2004 I first heard of the practice a month or so ago when a novice handler's dog sniffed the set out dog and an Open handler told her she should put Vicks up his nose before a trial. The novice handler figured it might be a better solution to train her dog not to such things at the top - yeah for the integrity of some folks! Then this weekend I actually saw it being done. It would seem if you could put things up a dogs nose you should be able to put any "special" collar on a dog, or maybe a collar with an amplified speaker on it as it appears my dog can't hear me! I just don't know how prevalent this practice is - and has the USBCHA ever addressed it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jennifer Glen Posted November 1, 2004 Report Share Posted November 1, 2004 I was always getting so mad at my Bob dog that I almost used it but never did. It wasn't that he'd stop on an outrun to sniff or pee but once he picked up sheep from a bitch that was in flaming heat and he went up on his tippy toes and put his tail in the air until my screaming penetrated his hormones and he went on with his work. Most of the time when the bitches are in heat he just isn't at his best. When he's waiting to run his nose is on the ground and I have a horrible time getting him to spot sheep. My solution was to neuter him. I wasn't going to breed him anyway and the fact that he was more into smells than his work cemented my feelings that he didn't need to reproduce. That strikes me as funny tho. The only dogs that I think should be reproducing are the ones who don't have an interest in it. (of course there is a time for work and a time for play) I'd like to say that Bob won the National Finals after he was neutered, but sadly it didn't help that much! However, Jo Woodbury neutered her dog for the same reason and he did get in the top 20 this year. Jenny Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tucknjill Posted November 1, 2004 Author Report Share Posted November 1, 2004 Steve is working thanksgiving thurs so we can just drive to Craig's Fri morning as I dont think he is starting till Noon on the Friday...Just come on whenever..what day/time will that put you here and how long are you staying? Welcome as long as you like, and do you want me to set up stuff for you to look at as we discussed? We can work puppies till we drop, fun fun! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bordersprings Posted November 1, 2004 Report Share Posted November 1, 2004 We will have to start in the morning on Friday as we have 50 dogs (30 Open + 7 nursery + 11 Ranch + 3 on the "wait and see list") to run and it will be dark at 5:00 PM. We will run a smaller course on Friday so that we can start somewhat casually - but I think we will need to start no later than 9:00 - 9:30 and run a 8:00 minute course. There is so little afternoon sun. I noticed today that the sun went behind the mountain at 5:09 tonight - yuck. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shelby Kennels Posted November 1, 2004 Report Share Posted November 1, 2004 The discussion about Vicks and trials reminded me of a quote from Donald McCraig in the Dog & Kennel Aug 2004 issue regarding Border Collies being bred over the years for one primary function "These dogs have been bred for over 300 years to work. They are so obsessive that if you're running a Border Collie at a sheepdog trial and you have a bitch in heat, you can run them side by side and the dog won't pay any attention to the bitch. If you throw a steak at the dog, it won't pay any attention. If you have two dogs that dislike each other, you can take them out and work them together". I have never taken Trip out to run around a female in heat, nor have I thrown a steak at Trip or Abby (only because I am too much of a chowhound myself probably). But I can honestly say I do not think I would ever put Vicks up their nose! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tucknjill Posted November 1, 2004 Author Report Share Posted November 1, 2004 Is it OK to get there Thurs night late then, even with it being Thanksgiving..and what day am I judging..can it be Fri or Sat so I can leave at a decent hour on Sunday? I am definately pulling the camper so I think all three of us should be ok for accomodations...Just the wine over ice in a dixie cup for me thanks! Congrats again on your placement with Jake btw. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rebecca, Irena Farm Posted November 1, 2004 Report Share Posted November 1, 2004 In my very novice opinion, this falls into the category of, "If you have to resort to abuse to get the dog to work, that dog needs to grow wheels." I heard a story that someone would put hand lotion on his dog's nose, same idea, little less drastic, I guess. One weekend he forgot his lotion and went around asking if anyone had some, right before his run. One person offered him some Vick's - not thinking he'd take it (knowing what he wanted it for, as everybody did). He did and the dog went to the post, the dog salivating, nose running, squinting his eyes so people weren't sure how he could see. Apparently he was never really a factor in the competition so no one ever called the handler on it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bordersprings Posted November 2, 2004 Report Share Posted November 2, 2004 Thank you, Sam. Jake and I are not very consistent but every once in a while. I started his lifting on grain training yesterday but I don't really have the right sheep for that - always something. It would be terrific if you would judge Open and Ranch on Friday. I will have someone not running a nursery dog judge nursery each day. I wish the mountains would be as pretty on Thanksgiving weekend as they are now - what a sight. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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