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Madison's Mommy,

 

What lines are Madison and Astro from? I know some of the replies seem to be harsh but behind each of them is a loving and caring owner who sincerely cares about the purpose (or lack of) of breeding Border Collies.

 

I'll preface it all with the confession (and on these boards it's a confession) that I have three Border Collies from show lines. I also have three Border Collies mixes from rescue. I make no excuses. I love all my pooches equally. They're exceptionally smart, athletic, smart, and have I mentioned smart? I'm involved, as time permits, with doggy sports and obedience, but for the most part, they are my pets, my kids, that special part of my heart that I just can't live without.

 

The three come from great show lines, they're healthy, they're beautiful and I've been approached multiiple times to breed them. But I can't.

 

Gracie, my female, is exceptional. She is most certainly the brightest of the bunch and the ruler of the roost. Her heart is as big as the world and she is the ultimate foster mom to the various litters of puppies that I foster. She plays with them, protects them, and puts up with sharp puppy teeth when I want to call it quits. She even herds a little bit. We've tried her on sheep and she has some abitlity that I could probably expand on if I wanted to, had the time to...but nothing exceptional. She was after all bred to be pretty.

Because she is a great dog I had her spayed.

 

I can't and won't run the risk of her getting ill and losing her sooner than I have to. I had two females that I spayed late in life (never had litters btw) and both ended up with mammary cancer which ultimately spread. A childhood collie ended up with pyometra at the age of 15 and had to be put to sleep. Granted she was 15, but still, had she been spayed, maybe we would have had her another year.

 

Cooper, my soul mate is also from show lines and has, for my needs and expectation, the perfect temperament. He is an old soul. I've put minimum training into him and yet I can go anywhere off leash and he's right by my side. It's as if he reads my mind. If ever I've wanted to clone a dog, it would be him. But would I breed him? No.

 

Breeding him wouldn't give me another Cooper. As some have suggested, another pup from the same lines would be a closer match and if I wanted another Cooper, I would go back to the same breeder in a heartbeat.

 

I've been flamed, or rather scolded, various times because the herding ability is not one of my priorities, but I understand why it is one for most of the people who post here and I respect that.

 

So don't get upset with those who are ultra-protective of the breed. But do take to heart some of the advice given. I know I have. I would never breed my dogs, they're just way too special.

 

 

Maria

 

And I wanted to add, Gracie was spayed at 7 months, the sooner the better!

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Madison's Mommy, when I came to these boards I knew little to nothing about border collies. I knew my pup was very intelligent, very quick to learn, fast, agile, and a stubborn little bugger. However, I would never breed her (or any other BC) because of these reasons (aside from the other obvious ones, such as her not being purebred):

 

#1. My dog has NO experience in herding. The very qualities that make our BC's special to us is those qualities that have been selected and bred for herding. If a breed was originally bred for its herding ability and we do not in turn breed with this as our criteria, then what will we have? We will eventually simply have a pretty dog that can chase a ball, not one that can do what it was meant to do.

 

#2. I don't have the experience - herding, breeding, or otherwise. Period, paragraph. Too much can go wrong. Not to mention if I don't have the experience, how do I REALLY know what my repurcussions are going to/could be?? Answer is that I don't. There are experienced people that DO know what they are doing. I plan to leave them to it.

 

The people who have advised you and Madison's Daddy know that of which they speak. Set aside the defensiveness and look a little closer. They may not cover it up with roses and pats on the hand because the points that they make are straightforward and important. They continually give of their time and effort to protect the breed, and I think to protect YOU as well.

 

I would challenge you to spend some time pouring over these threads, and searching for old ones on the subjects. Do more homework. Know what it is you do, because there is ALWAYS a ripple effect for the choices we make in life. Creating life is never something we can take lightly. Hang around a while, we're glad to have you. :rolleyes:

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I don't think anyone here thinks you are not good owners - quite the contrary, I think most everyone thinks you ARE good owners, or they wouldn't waste their time and effort to respond to you as thoroughly as they have. I think they just want you to carry that one step further - not to just be the excellent stewards that you are *for Madison*, but to become just as diligent in your stewardship of the BREED.

 

I've said it before, but perhaps not clearly enough: I am MAD for my BCs. Absolutely besotted. Obsessed, even. That's saying something, given that I'm so into dogs in general that I've chosen to devote my life to their well-being (and this is NOT an easy job, let me tell you; if it were, everyone would do it. I'm willing to put my money where my mouth is, even though it's often gruellingly difficult.) HOWEVER: part of really loving something - and I mean REALLY loving something, not just the sentiment, but the real-life nitty gritty of it - is having the humility to step back for a moment and see it for what it really is. Only in this way are you having a real relationship with the object of you affections. Otherwise it's just your version of the thing, not the thing itself.

 

I have NO doubt whatsoever that Madison is bright, alert, athletic, charming, engaging, and by far the best dog you've ever had, maybe the best you've ever even known. But Finn is ALSO almost scary-smart, active, extremely athletic, sound, charming and all the rest. So are most BCs. He's excellent in many activities, and I have no doubt he could acquit himself well at whatever we try. BUT: That does NOT mean that he should be bred. It just doesn't. He should only be bred if he'll better the breed - and right now there are two problems with that: One, though he's demonstrated ability and drive, I don't currently think he has *enough* talent ON STOCK to justify breeding him (and I've done him the honor and the kindness of looking at him to see him for what he REALLY IS, warts and all, not just for what I love about him). And two, and more important at the moment: I don't think *I* have sufficient judgement to select the appropriate bitch. I'm by no means ignorant of dogs in general - I just don't think I know enough about *stock dogs* to make the right choices.

 

I would do anything to keep from harming what gave me my deeply beloved BCs in the first place. And what gave me these incredible dogs is the long line of people who have carefully bred BCs generation after generation to be the best stock dogs in the world. That's it, plain and simple. THAT'S why I have these dogs I love so much: Because of how they've been bred in the generations leading up to the ones I have now. Why would I do anything to undermine that? Some day I'm going to want another BC, and I hope to God the breed has not been completely ruined by careless breeding by the time that day rolls around.

 

I, like many others, congratulate you for having kept with it instead of just flouncing off (as some people are wont to do) the first time someone disagrees with you. That you're still here suggests you really DO care about this, and you really ARE willing to at least listen to what someone else has to say. I think that shows both grit and moral fiber. Having been here for a little while, I will say that I think that it's sometimes hard to convey nuances of meaning over the 'Net, and that questions like "What makes Madison so special?" are probably meant, not as sarcastic digs, but as honest questions: What, specifically, is it that distinguishes her from other members of the breed in such a way as to justify her use as a brood bitch? I'd expect exactly the same question if I were to announce that I had chosen to breed Finn, even though we DO go to sheep and he has proven ability. So that isn't a personal attack, it's a request for information. Part of the trouble with BCs is that they ARE such great dogs that the first one you have can be so dazzling compared to other breeds that it's hard to see how dazzling it is (or isn't) compared to other members *of its own breed.* In the land of the blind the one-eyed man is King and all that.

 

Anyway, I'll say again that no one looks down on you for not having your dog on stock yet - nor will they if you NEVER have your dog on stock. It has nothing to do with OWNING a non-working dog, it has only to do wth BREEDING a non-working dog. I am a causual hobby herder at best, and no one has ever suggested to me that I have no biz owning a BC.

 

Anyway, I do hope you stay and I for one thank you for listening to the words of those of us who are passionate about the breed. My dogs need to get out - still pretty good weather of October in Alaska, not going to waste it!

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Let's try an analogy and see if that gets through, because this is really frustrating.

 

Let's say you want to be a race car driver.

 

First, you buy yourself a race car. You look at a lot of race cars, but you don't just buy one based on the fact that it's shiny and looks nice. Because there is SO much more that goes into a race car than just looking fast. You have to think about the engine, and the aerodynamics and the tires and (insert other important race car features here).

 

Now, if you don't know anything about race cars, the first one you look at or buy might seem fantastic but actually just be sort of average. Except you don't know the difference between a good car and an average car, beccause you still don't know how to race the car ... you've driven it around town a few times and it seems nice enough - for your first race car. But ultimately, you are no position to make the call because you don't really know anything about race cars (except you've seen races on tv and once you went to the Indy and it all seemed really cool).

 

With me so far?

 

Now you've gone and bought the race car and you like it because it's really unusual (let's say it is blue and white and realllly shiny, okay?) but you have no idea if the car is worth racing.

 

So the next step is to learn how to be a race car driver. You practice and go to school and learn how to drive really fast cars really well. You drive all sorts of cars, in all sorts of conditions, because you can't be a really good race care driver with 5 days of practice in a Yugo on your neighborhood street, right?

 

So you race other cars in all sorts of places, and with more practice comes more knowledge. After a few years, you are one of the better drivers on the circuit, you spend all your time tinkering with race cars and racing them and you can tell if a race car is a really exceptional piece of machinery just by driving it for a few minutes, or looking at who built and when and where.

 

It's been a long hard road, but gosh - you are now getting pretty close to being an expert at race cars and all things involved in race cars. So finally you feel confident enough to start your own race car company ... not something you would have done a few years back when you first deciced to be a race car driver, because now you realise that back then you didn't know nearly enough about race cars to start your own company.

 

Got all that?

 

Noe, substitute border collies for race cars, working sheep for car races and yourself for the race car driver. Okay? You don't breed border collies until you know the breed inside out and backward, until you know how to evaluate a dog on sheep, until you can confidently say with AUTHORITY that the dog you are about to breed is worth it, because you are a little bit of an expert on the subject of sheepdogs what with all the years you've put in to working them and studying them.

 

Don't make excuses and don't change the subject. If you do not have access to sheep and lots of practical knowledge working border collies on stock successfully, you should not be breeding border collies. Don't have an SUV(?) Can't get to sheep? Don't breed your dog. Simple as that.

 

If you decided to be a race car driver without having any idea how to drive a car or a race car, you'd crash the car, kill yourself and possibly kill a few other people too. Sounds like a bad idea right? Well, if you breed your border collie irresponsibly, you might kill your dog, you might kill her puppies, and you might contribute to the decline of the very things that make Madison the dog you love - because a bad breeding can mean lousy puppies.

 

You say Madison is the best dog in the world - I am sure that is true ... relative to YOU. My three dogs, I am completely convinced, are the best dogs in the world too. Relative to me, at least. But it doesn't mean that ANY of them are worth breeding. And every single litter makes a difference. And every single neutered dog makes a difference too, in a completely different way. So make a difference, and spay your dog!

 

RDM

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A straight answer, her vulva will swell about 5 times of its normal size, she will leave little drops or blood all over your house. After the bleeding stops she will be ready to breed. Thats about it in a nut shell. Books DO tell you the heat cycle of a bitch, and maybe your vet dosent think you should breed. I am even wondering if this is a **REAL** post as the way you worded things seem fake to me.

Now, let me say something, having been in your shoes and actually breeding my dog I will tell you it is not worth it. I had eyes and hips checked. We had 8 pups 5 males 3 females, I had buyers BEFORE i bred, guess what when it came time to take a pup they did not want one anymore. I spent tons of money on food, vet bills for the pups check-ups. I gave a pup to my sister and 8 yr old niece, and she purchased another one. The pup I gave to her and that she loved very much started having seizures. Late one night she had to have that dog put down by my dad, because the seizure had gone on for over an hour. I had to look my 8 year old niece in the eye and tell her how sorry I was, because after all it was my fault because I am the one who bred my bitch. So my health checks on the bitch didnt do me any good, because I DID NOT KNOW ENOUGH TO BREED HER. We kept one of the pups because I could not sell him. I did not make any money, not even enough money to have my bitch spayed, nor the pup neutered.(I did get them fixed right away however). I sold 3 pups in all and gave the rest away. So my advice is love your dog by spaying her.

You came on the board looking for answers well here it is, everyone of these people have just laid it on the line and did not sugar coat it. I personally perfer it that way. So dont get upset when you read answers that dont side with you. I also think you should research border collie rescue all across the US and think about a pup you raised being tossed from home to home to home.

 

 

Originally posted by Madison's Mommy:

Solo River,

 

I KNOW that Madison is way too young to breed now, and we are not planning on doing it for at least a year and a half to two years (if we do at all, which we are not 100% sure). That is why I am TRYING (without much luck) to find out how I can tell if she is in heat. My vet has not given me a straight answer, books have not either, and now this board has not. I do not want her to become pregnant at this time. And by the way, there are really no such thing as working border collies on Long Island, unfortunately. I wish she had a herd to work, but alas she does not. I exercise her plenty and try to give her other "tasks" to do to keep her mind and body active.

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Madison’s Mommy and Daddy,

 

Welcome to the boards. This place will educate you, entertain you and save your sanity.

 

Here’s a perspective from a regular person who will never (sob) be able to live on a farm and herd sheep.

 

I grew up having dogs all my life (Boston Terriers). I love dogs but never was able to adopt any until we got Oreo, who is a tri-colored, saddle-marked border collie mix. Within one week of living with him, I told my husband I was totally smitten with this puppy. He’s 2 ? years old now, so I’m REALLY in love with him now.

 

Three weeks ago, we adopted Lucky, a 13-month-old female black and white border collie. Her owners no longer had time for her and she was left alone outside for 14 hours at a time. When we got her she didn’t even know how to play with a toy. I told my husband I would give up an arm before I would ever get rid of one of our dogs.

 

She is such a wonderful addition to our lives. She and Oreo adore each other. They’re both neutered. We never once considered breeding them. You can ask Oreo – he’s “the bestest dog in the whole wide world”. He knows this because he is told this every day of his life.

 

My brother in Wyoming has always had red heelers. They bred one of their favorites (she was about 6 years old at the time) about 5 years ago, to (according to them)an awesome male heeler. Their dog nearly died. At the end she looked like she was carrying two watermelons. It turned out to be 10 puppies. One of the puppies died immediately. The momma dog had to have a Caesarean and the whole experience was an extremely costly one.

 

It broke their heart every single time they sold one of those puppies. They worried about their new homes and their new lives. Mind you, I think they were TOTALLY IRRESPONSIBLE to breed this dog. But they have NO control over the lives of those puppies. They hear about some of them occasionally and it hasn’t always been good.

 

They ended up keeping two of the nine remaining pups. One they neutered right away; one is still intact because they have this misguided notion that they need to breed her to get the kind of dog they want. Balderdash! BTW, the female they bred – she has never been quite the same. The pregnancy and delivery were hard on her and she got SO TIRED of being pestered by puppies.

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Originally posted by Keegan's Mom:

[QB] Just out of curiousty, you say that Madison's "parents" are prize-winning Border Collies. Prize winning in what? Herding?

 

Her line includes Clan Abby Too Much Tartan (Best of Breed at Westminster in 1996), Clan Abby To Hell and Back (Best of Opposite Sex, same), Clan Abby The Wizrd of Oz (won the herding group and became the 1996 Pedigree Dog).

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Ah, yes.

 

Do not breed this bitch under any circumstances would be my advice.

 

These lines do not need to be replicated or extended. They are probably Australian-based (having been imported from NZ), bred exclusively for show and conformation. If your bitch has any herding ability, it is probably a throwback, and it would be doubtful that it would be reliably reproduced in the offspring, as the selection pressure has been taken off herding ability for at least five or six generations (if not longer) in these show lines.

 

As I've been saying all along, if you cannot answer affirmatively that this breeding will improve the breed, you should not breed. And the only way to improve the Border collie breed is to breed for herding ability.

 

This does not mean that you are second-class citizens or poor dog owners. It means that you have a bitch whose genetics are not from the breed that we are discussing here, and breeding her would not improve the breed.

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Hello, I thought perhaps some insight from the potential owners of your pups may help.

 

I?m new to this board but I am not new to Border Collies. I got my first Border Collie about 12 years ago when my husband (then boyfriend) brought home a beautiful Blue-eyed, blue-merle puppy. I had warned him against getting a BC because back then all I knew is that they were ?insane? dogs with a propensity to get in trouble. My father was a handler and judge so I grew up traveling with a carload of terriers to many AKC shows, I was not new to dogs just this breed. Well I fell in love with Mac anyway and learned just what wonderful dogs they could be and that was before I read ?Eminent Dogs Dangerous Men? by Donald McCaig.

 

Mac came with a supposed working pedigree, a Welsh, imported dad and mom from working lines in North Carolina. Sire was a merle and the dam was a traditionally marked black and white. The breeding was done just for similar reasons as you describe. Well we did right by Mac and took him to obedience classes and taught him a ton of cool tricks that he did with great flare, he even won some classes in Frisbee competitions. At the time I worked night shift at an emergency vet clinic and he went to work with me daily. We all brought our dogs but he was by far one of the favorites, in fact, at times I only think they kept me around because of my dog. All dog owners know what I mean when I say he was a ?once in a lifetime? dog.

 

Now for the kicker, Mac?s first problem was two retained testicles. Following a massive, invasive surgery to remove them Mac woke up quite hard from the anesthesia. We watched him carefully and he recovered. Life went on until Mac came up lame in the rear after a Frisbee competition so we x-rayed him immediately. I can not tell you how my heart sunk as we looked at the pictures of his hips. The vet?s exact words were ?I?ve never seen hips this bad?. Mac was only 2 years old. So now I?m faced with a dog that has all the drive and heart in the world and a body that will not sustain it. FHO was recommended. I talked to many vets and got many personal stories and pretty much drove a lot of people nuts trying to decide if we should do this very scary operation. In the end I did let an orthopedist perform the surgery.

 

Mac took over 24 hours to wake up from the surgery. Turns out he also had a shunt in his liver. Despite very careful rehab Mac developed scar tissue and was never sound again. The way to fix that would have been more surgery but alas because the shunt in his liver anesthesia was no longer an option, oh and except for natural remedies medication to alleviate pain from his hips would no longer be an option either.

 

Mac lived to be nine years old but they were heartbreaking years, constant blood draws monitoring his liver function, episodes in the hospital when his numbers got out of control and watching him live with the pain of his hips. Now I?m not a keep a dog alive at all cost person (I worked emergency) but as much as Mac hated the medical procedures Mac loved life, really. Due to the liver problems we had to watch the steady decline of his mind over the years. He became like an old person with altzeimers but even in the end he would still do the things he?d learned in the beginning of his life in his own demented way. I still don?t think he?s forgiven me for putting him to sleep that last day. He could only walk in circles to the right and was having siezures but when you looked in his eyes the lights were still on and his tail was wagging-he wasn?t ready to go but his body was done.

 

The point of this story, Madison?s mommy and daddy is that I realize you are probably going to breed your special girl no matter what we say. Please become informed about white-factoring, recessive genes and what pain it could deliver not on you but to the potential owners of special puppies of their own. In my vets opinion all of Mac?s problems were most likely genetic.

 

My story, much to my husband?s dismay, does have a happy ending that involves 4 more BC?s, 12 acres and a flock of sheep. When my poor hubby grumbles I can only laugh and tell him it?s his own fault he is the reluctant farmer. The pleasure I have gained from trying to learn this art of herding is immeasurable. The bonus is that I?ve not only gained a true appreciation for this special breed of dog but I?ve also fallen in love with a special breed of sheep (not considered the best for herding but I?ve managed to work it out). Because I have a young family trialing is not an easy option for me right now, but I?ve learned so much from managing my own flock of sheep with my dogs that one day I hope I am lucky enough to share what I?ve learned on the trial field-that?s assuming I can ever get over the huge dose of butterflies I have whenever I do get to the post :rolleyes:

 

Sorry this was so long but I couldn?t figure any other way to tell my story,

Kristin

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My Piper is scary smart, extremely fast, extremely alert, etc....you described a typical border collie...and for the record my Piper is the best dog in the world and was spayed at 7 months!

 

Now I'm off to enjoy this October day here in SE Alaska.

 

Stay with these boards Madison's Mom, you'll learn a lot and hopefully will not breed your BC ( unfortunately I believe you have already made up your mind).

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Yes, Piper and FlyAway2Me, I think I have made up my mind. For Madison's health and the health of any future puppies, I am going to make an appointment tomorrow to have her neutered as soon as possible. I have already told my parents (who were hoping for one of Madison's puppies) to go to the rescue farm up north of Binghamton, NY and to rescue a BC. Madison is still the best dog in the world (sorry Piper), and that is why I want her to live a long healthy life.

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Editing to say that I was writing this when you posted last...glad to see that you did make the right decision.

 

Originally posted by Madison's Mommy:

Btw, we do not own an SUV so we can't hop in it and drive upstate. I think Jason's point was simply that on LI, people that own border collies generally do not live on big farms, and border collie owners on this board have to understand that- it is frankly a little annoying that those that are lucky enough to have places for their dog to work somehow look down on us because we do not, and seem to consider us second class citizens (in the world of border collie owners).

You say this, yet MANY of us do not have farms for our dogs...but we try to find farms for our dogs. I am currently in the process of trying to find a trainer on a regular basis...which for me will be about 2 times a month or so. I will have to drive over an hour, probably, to find someone. I don't have an SUV...I have a small Toyota Corolla.

 

If you wanted to, you too could find someone to train you and Madison in herding. I don't believe in excuses...you can do anything that you set your mind to or find anything you set your mind to.

 

Thank you for answering my question on what your dog's parents are prized in. I think that you will find that herding "prizes" are all anyone should base their breeding off of. The history of the dogs is based in herding and not conformation. I think if you did enough reading into the "standards" that conformation encourage, it is just ridicluous (spelling?). Like Brookcove has a 16 inch BC that is much smaller than your typical BC...does it mean that she can't herd because she probably wouldn't meet the AKC standards? But if you talk to an AKC conformation person...like a Sheltie woman I asked...she will tell you that height standards, etc are set up so that you now which dog can do the standard of herding...hog wash!!!! How many Shelties do you know of that still herd sheep...I have seen plenty in conformation but none in herding.

 

I just implore you to READ, READ, READ!!!! I still have a ton to learn but I have learned a great deal from these boards, these people that work farms, and love the Border Collie. I think that you too will speak out against breeding Border Collies for any other reason than the "right" reason if you learn more about the breed itself. The "right" reason being to improve the working dog.

 

I truly think that my dog is the best; however, I know that I would never get a carbon copy so I would never try to. I think you will be disappointed. I would definitely suggest going back to the same lines you got your current dog from.

 

Good luck in your decision making, I trust you will come to the right conclusion.

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Madison's Mommy,

 

I just immediately fall in love with just about every border collie I meet. I've been known to stop my car, get out and go ask somebody walking their bc what it's name is and can I pet him/her!

 

They are all very, very special dogs. You might get an argument from some of us, well, me for one, as to which dog is the best. Samantha, of course! I'm surprised you hadn't heard. :rolleyes:

 

What we all agree on is that border collies are a unique breed, that any other breed is just a dog, and that we all think they are really the only dog to have!

 

I'm glad you're spaying Madison and doing the right thing by her and by the breed.

 

Ruth n the Border Trio

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Originally posted by Madison's Mommy:

Yes, Piper and FlyAway2Me, I think I have made up my mind. For Madison's health and the health of any future puppies, I am going to make an appointment tomorrow to have her neutered as soon as possible.

Good! There are no shortage of border collies in rescue, and definitely no shortage of can't-herd-anything-from-pet-or-other-stock border collies in rescue either. This is the best thing for Madison, and also the best thing for the breed.

 

RDM

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I liked what someone said about rescuing a dog "in their dog's honor". It's the best way to get a companion dog - or even a nice sport or light working dog. My first two dogs were rescues and though they didn't work so well for the type of work I have here, they are still wonderful dogs.

 

If your father gets a rescue he won't regret it! Thanks for hanging with us and keeping an open mind!

 

I do know there's a very nice handler up there who teaches folks with all kinds of dogs, who are interested in learning to work sheep (or ducks). Yes, if you get that 100 acre farm in PEI, you'll probably find Madison comes a bit short in working ability, but you needn't let that discourage you from trying it out.

 

And of course, agility will be ever so much fun when you're not worrying about heat cycles (they ALWAYS come at the worst times) and other reproductive issues. Jen is already starting to forgive me, I think. She's been sleeping on my bed (in a crate so she doesn't jump down) and I keep telling her how much fun she's going to have now that she doesn't have to be locked up half the year.

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*BIG HUGS* to Madison's Mom

 

I had a crappy day at work, my Yuki being sick and my co-worker started talking about breeding his mutt to another mutt to 'start a new breed'. I almost got in an argument. Your last post made my day. It proves how much you really love your dog.

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What a good idea to suggest rescue to your parents! Not only do they then become part of the solution, they also have the opportunity to select a dog whose temperament and activity level will match up with their own. I've bonded very intensely with all of my rescue BCs (of which there have been 3), so bonding shouldn't be a problem. Apart from which, rearing a BC puppy is NOT for the faint of heart, as you no doubt discovered the hard way! :rolleyes: (At least, that's how I learned it - first hand, from Finn. The rescues have been SOOOOO much easier!)

 

I'm so happy for you that you've come to this very difficult decision. Madison will live a longer, healthier life as a result, and your relationship with her will not be interrupted or sidetracked by the whole brood-o-puppies thing, which can be QUITE a distraction.

 

Speaking of distractions, my dogs are all hungry from racing wildly over hill and dale in the "balmy" October sun, so I'd better go feed...

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Hi Maddison's mommy, This is my very first post on this board, so hello to everyone else. I have been reading it for a while now and enjoy it very much. You said you are refering your parents to rescue. I am not sure which one you where going to but Glen Highland Farm is wonderful. The care they give the dogs and all the work they put in, we have adopted from them when they where still in CT. Good choice on not breeding your girl. If you do make it up to the farm you will see the very reason not to. Also you might enjoy reading Jon Katz books, I finished his new one and all are wonderful. :rolleyes:

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Madison's Mom - Terrific!!! You will not regret it.

 

As for training, we travel once or twice a month, three hours each way. I have no sheep (I have to admit we have cattle and can't afford sheep fencing (by we are trying to figure out how). We train on sheep and then work on cattle at home.

 

We have two purebred Border Collies. One, purchased from a working lines, is the better working dog. The other, adopted (she was an impulse buy by a young man without a suitable situation for her) is a light in our lives. Both are neutered, and I have never, ever regretted it.

 

Bless you for your choice, and for your interest in rescue. Folks who rescue and adopt rescue dogs are true heroes.

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Madison's Mom.......... :rolleyes: I am so happy to hear that you are going to have her spayed. I'm on the board of a shelter and there are SO many dogs who need a loving and good home. While our shelter is not strictly BC's...we get our share of them. It's heartbreaking to see. Congratulations again on making the best decision you could have made! Have a great time with her...and stay with the boards. The people here will give you their honest opinions...and to me, an honest opinion is worth its weight in gold!

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Originally posted by Madison's Mommy:

I have already told my parents (who were hoping for one of Madison's puppies) to go to the rescue farm up north of Binghamton, NY and to rescue a BC. Madison is still the best dog in the world (sorry Piper), and that is why I want her to live a long healthy life.

I am tearing up as I read this. Many who read this board or are just coming to it are still on a learning curve. Bless you for having the courage and the will to progress so quickly on it.

I think of my Kit who is one of the most loving companions I've ever had the good fortune to know, and who was tossed away into shelters twice in her young life before she adopted me, and I commend you for having the compassion to do the right thing by your own beloved dog and for the breed.

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Her doctor's appointment is Nov. 10 at 9 a.m. Thanks to everyone on this board for giving me advice. Even though Madison is apparently not a working dog (and comes from a show breeding line), she still means the absolute world to us and she literally has saved my life. Our life has been HELL since February (for reasons I cannot go into), and getting her has been the best thing possible. She is our heart, our love, our life. I cannot even express enough in words how much we love her. All I want to do is what is best for Madision. Madison is the best.

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