CGC and ABCA?

[BlueDaisyGirl]

Hello, 

I have a ABCA registered pup (a little over 2 years old now) and was curious, if we got him CGC (canine good citizen) tested/awarded, does that interfere with his ABCA registration? I know AKC and ABCA are big no nos together, and as much as I don't want to support AKC, I think there is some merit in having a program for good dogs and for owners with dogs to strive toward a good dog (I know too many "bad" owners and I honestly think having this sort of goal is a good starting point for getting the nation's pet surrenders down and adoptions up) its also nice to be able to show off "hey my dog is a good boy" to friends, family and future realtors.   Anyways, I was also wanting to try teaching him agility and was curious IF he won any of those titles, would those affect his ABCA registration as well?  We don't plan on breading him, im just genuinely curious TIA

[D'Elle]

Hello, and welcome to the forum.

I don't know much about ABCA regulations. I don't think that those things would interfere with it, but someone with more knowledge can say for sure.

But I wouldn't give the AKC a dime of my money if I were dead. It's a terrible organization that causes untold suffering to dogs and I won't support it in any way. All of my dogs have passed the CGC test with flying colors, but not with the AKC. I have done it as part of my freestyle club, and the test is given, with an audience and other dogs, by someone who knows the rules and is qualified to administer it.

My suggestion, (just my opinion of course) is that you train your dog to do all of those things and don't bother paying the AKC for a piece of paper saying he can do them.

And if you want to do agility, there are many venues for competition and titling without the AKC.

 

[urge to herd]

D'Elle wrote what many of us on these boards believe. CGC might get you an extra nod here and there, but I doubt that a realtor or rental agent is going to be swayed by a CGC. They'll be adamant about a pet deposit and hand you the rules about pets in the building, if any are allowed.

http://americanbordercollie.org/services/registration-requirements-instructions/  Here's what you're asking about. From my quick perusal, ABCA does not allow dogs to be an ABCA dog if the dog is also AKC registered. I didn't search any further than the AKC thing, but I'd be very surprised if agility titles, etc would have any effect on an ABCA registration. Those are activity based organizations, and the AKC is all about the 'conformation'. Blech.

Ruth & Gibbs

 

[gcv-border]

From my understanding, the ABCA pulls the registration of a dog that wins a championship title in the AKC conformation ring. Any of the other activities that AKC offers titles for (agility, CGC, nosework, herding (GAH!), etc) will not affect the ABCA registration.  Please double check with AKC.

I agree with D'Elle with respect to AKC. I prefer to participate in alternate venues - of which there are many.

[gcv-border]

Here are 2 paragraphs from the link that urge to herd posted that should clear things up.

 

• Registration with the American Kennel Club, United Kennel Club, the Kennel Club (UK), Federation Cynologique Internationale, Australian or New Zealand Kennel Clubs, or any such body will not be accepted as a basis for registration with the ABCA.
• Dogs or bitches which have been named a “Conformation Champion” by a conformation registry are not eligible for ABCA registration, even if they otherwise meet the requirements for registration. The ABCA will de-register any ABCA registered dog or bitch should it be named a “Conformation Champion” after January 1, 2004, and will not register the offspring of any dog or bitch named a “Conformation Champion” after that date.

The first bullet point says that AKC registration is not accepted if you try and register a dog with ABCA. It does not prohibit someone from registering and ABCA dog with the AKC. Although, why would you want to?

The second bullet point explains that any ABCA dog that achieves the title of Conformation Champion for a kennel club (AKC, CKC, etc.) will be lose its ABCA registration.

[GentleLake]

9 hours ago, D'Elle said:

...I wouldn't give the AKC a dime of my money if I were dead....My suggestion...is that you train your dog to do all of those things and don't bother paying the AKC for a piece of paper saying he can do them.

I couldn't have said it any better than this. I'm in complete agreement.

And in addition to the reasons D'Elle pointed out (as if they weren't enough) was the ACK's railroading recognition of border collies as an ACK breed. If you're not familiar with the history, check out Donal McCaig's excellent little book Dog Wars.

[BlueDaisyGirl]

I appreciate all your answers! I honestly didn't even realize it was a thing I had to pay for, we took my boy in to an obedience trainer (positive reinforcement) and he did so well they told us that if we wanted to, we could try to take the CGC test with them at our next session. I'll have to look more into it. From what it seems like, since he's already ABCA registered they wouldn't take it away unless he was titled conformation champion... I think the only reason I'm debating it at all now is because our trainer was so nice and excited for us to try to test for it so I feel bad telling her nevermind :x but i completely agree on not supporting AKC in whatever way possible 

[Michael Parkey]

Just to pour gasoline on the AKC fire, we watched a little of the National Dog Show on Thanksgiving day.  It should be called the National Freak Show.

[GentleLake]

17 hours ago, BlueDaisyGirl said:

...I feel bad telling her nevermind...

I always use opportunities like this to politely educate people as to why I feel the way I do about it.

Too many people have bought into the ACK propaganda that they're somehow a seal of quality, when the truth is very far from it.

And way too few people have the slightest clue why ACK recognition has hurt our breed so much.

 

[D'Elle]

Agree with Gentle Lake, above. While I am a person who avoids argument and I won't engage in one on this topic either, I do tend to take whatever opportunity arises to see if I can raise someone's consciousness on an issue that is close to my heart and nothing is closer than dogs to my heart. I find that very often people really don't know about the AKC, and when they start to find out, they care, and may learn more on their own, even pass the info along.

It is amazing to me that anyone in this country doesn't know about puppy mills, for instance, that they even exist, and that the AKC is happy to register the puppies they produce. But if a person doesn't know, I change that if they are open to listening to me.  

If the person is solid in their belief that the AKC is a good thing and cutting off dog's tails and ears and breeding them to be so deformed they cannot have a normal life is acceptable, then there's no point in talking with them on the subject.

 

[Journey]

Go, go have fun with your pup, get your CGC and look into other activities you could do together. Since you won't be breeding him don't let anyone stop you from having fun and enjoying your dog in any activities!