My fella needs to lose some weight!

[Breana']

Hi guys, I don't post on here ever but am an avid lurker – love this community!

 

So my Rook is 7 years old and a little more than hefty. He's not a working dog, my backyard is tiny, and the field we used to run freely at was turned into a K-9 Police Academy. The vet denies that he's overweight but at almost 80 lbs (aggravated his hip which added inactivity to the mix) that's a ridiculous thing to say for an agile breed, even though he is on the bigger side.

 

I have a few questions about food and exercise! Can anyone with experience in this area give me some pointers? 1) I'd like to switch food as he's on a generic brand and would like to know what you guys like for your dogs and 2) How can I go about amping up his activity slowly? I know most of these seem like common sense but since he is heavy and a little older I don't want to start out full throttle and compromise his health anymore than it already is.

 

TL;DR – my BC is fat and I need help with his weight loss.

[Sekah]

Weight loss in dogs (and people) is mostly calorie control. Activity level certainly helps, but it's really only ~20% of the solution. Good for you for identifying a problem and deciding to do something about it! As you've figured out, some people (including vets) have lost sight of what a dog at a healthy weight looks & feels like. Going by weight alone isn't really a good approach since dogs' frames can differ so much, especially in a breed like BCs.

 

The first step is familiarizing yourself with what a healthy dog is supposed to feel like. You can go by appearance, but getting your hands on your dog is more effective. Feeling some bones is okay -- it's good, even! Here's a blog post to help you assess your pup: http://www.successjustclicks.com/fit-fido-or-fat-fido/

 

Get an accurate weight measurement on your dog. Your vet's office may be able to help you with this. Around me, there are also a number of boutique type pet stores with scales for customer use.

 

The next step is calorie reduction. Get used to measuring carefully the amount of food you feed during mealtimes, and keep track of treats or snacks between meals too. I would likely reduce the amount you feed by 15% or so for a month. Aim for weight loss in the range of 1-2% of total body weight a week. If you're missing this goal after a month, reduce calories again.

 

Regarding activity, this is less important so I wouldn't overthink it too much. Hikes, daily walks, play, trick training, etc should be enough to start shedding weight. Opportunities to explore off-leash are pretty great, if your dog is reliable, as he'll be able to self-regulate exercise this way.

 

7 years old isn't that old. My girl is coming up on her 7th birthday this year and she's not slowing down anytime soon. Don't let his age get in the way of your plans.

 

Here are some links for you too:

http://www.pethealthnetwork.com/dog-health/dog-checkups-preventive-care/7-surprising-ways-help-your-pet-lose-weight-and-why-its

http://www.dogfoodadvisor.com/dog-feeding-tips/dog-lose-weight/

http://pets.webmd.com/dogs/guide/overweight-dogs-and-canine-weight-loss-diets

[herdcentral]

Wow 80 lbs is some dog! 7yo is not exactly old, my sheep dogs will be 7 this year and in their prime, lean, mean machines lol. My big boy weighs 42 lbs and he is around 22.5 inches at the shoulder.

 

Does he get regular walks ? and can you do some swimming with him. That is a good fat burner and keeps weight of the joints, you can get a flotation jacket for him. I did that when bringing dogs back from injury. You certainly don't want to risk cruciate injury

 

Cant help with the food cos probably different in Australia. I tend to feed Black Hawk and Wellness core with some commercial BARF. How many cups a day are you feeding? I also make up a vegie with a few sardines for flavour puree with plenty of pumpkin, this can be used as a low calorie bulker if he is feeling hungry when you cut him down, Raw carrots and apples are also good for low cal treats . My dogs are raised on them so enjoy them.

 

Cant believe your vet thinks this is normal for a collie. Most of our vets have those charts in their office which shows you from above what dog looks like when it is too fat or thin and ideal.

[simba]

I perhaps would continue on the same food until you have it under control- when I was working this out generic brands are often lower in calories. Some of the expensive foods can be very high in fat and my dog didn't seem to find them as filing. You can feed green beans, carrots, apples, pumpkin etc. as treats and for fullness.

 

Weighing scales are more accurate than cups, for measuring food. Work out how much he 'should' get according to the bag for his ideal weight (not the weight he's at now, guess if you like). Then feed him that. Then weigh him regularly. If he starts losing more than 2% of his body weight per week, feed him more. Titrate it based on what your dog is doing.

 

Walking or swimming are suitably low-impact exercise. If you think he's overweight and has problems with his hips I wouldn't go any faster than that.

 

Could you put up pictures of him? Pictures show very little compared to actually putting your hands on the dog, but other people here might be able to give you pointers. I've done it before for my dog's weight. I took one from above to see the dog's shape from above, and one from the side showing the dog's profile, up-tuck etc.

[gcv-border]

Agree completely with Sekah ^^^. Her post was much more complete than I would write.

 

You are correct about introducing activities gradually considering his weight (and his age). Although I don't think that 7 is too old (my 8.5 year old dog is still active in agility and is still one of the fastest ones running), his weight would be more of a concern to me.

 

If it was me, I would start with 2 extra 15 minute walks per day (in addition to diet) to see how he did - particularly how his hip held up. If he tolerated that well, I would start introducing more activities. Do you live in an area where you can access a rehab vet/orthopedic vet? I think that they would be a good mentor for your weight reduction program.

 

Regarding swimming: It can be a great tool, but in your case, I would first consult with a rehab vet to make sure that there is no possibility of self-harm considering his current state. Then I would carefully monitor his swimming to make sure he isn't overdoing it. Another option would be a canine water treadmill, but they are less common.

 

Consider going to a grain-free kibble - just because I have heard of many stories of dogs that have trouble keeping weight on, and their owners actually have to add some carbs to the diet. I have heard of many people who add green beans to provide a low-cal food that helps the dog feel fuller. And of course, portion control is paramount.

 

Good Luck.

[gcv-border]

Weighing scales are more accurate than cups, for measuring food. Work out how much he 'should' get according to the bag for his ideal weight (not the weight he's at now, guess if you like). Then feed him that. Then weigh him regularly. If he starts losing more than 2% of his body weight per week, feed him more. Titrate it based on what your dog is doing.

Um, no. The feeding instructions on the bag are usually an overestimate of what the dog should actually eat (even at their ideal weight).

[GentleLake]

Regardless of whether you have easy access to scales or not, the best way to tell whether your dog is at the correct weight is by feeling your dog. You should be able to easily feel ribs (that is, without having to push in at all do find them) and the spinal protuberances. If you have to push at all to feel ribs, then the dog's probably at least a bit overweight.

 

Here's the body condition chart that vets use. IMO, border collies should be on the thin side of moderate. You'll have to use your hands to show you what your eyes can't see beneath the fur.

 

http://vet.osu.edu/v...n-scoring-chart

 

I've also used things like green beans or pureed non-starchy veggies to add bulk to a dog's diet and help him feel more satisfied.

 

And I agree that the feeding recommendations on most dog food bags are too much. They want you to buy more of their food after all.

[simba]

Um, no. The feeding instructions on the bag are usually an overestimate of what the dog should actually eat (even at their ideal weight).

Yup, I have argued this before. And in this instance this means that if the dog is moved down (presumably) to that level then it will still not be being fed too little, and will be gradually moved down as the titration process happens. Means that in practice you get a gradual reduction of food.

 

Important to remember too that once the dog is at their ideal weight, it will take less food to maintain them at that ideal weight than it would if they had always been at that weight and never were overweight. So you might need to feed less than you think.

[rushdoggie]

I have a hypothyroid dog and even though his bloodwork now says he is in the normal range, hes still gains weight very easily. I also have a genrous spouse who thinks that the dogs are being abused when they get fed a normal amount of food.

 

I found that swimming is what keeps him the leanest. It took me a long time to teach him, but once he started swimming twice a week his physique slimmed all over. I live in a temperate climate so he can swim 9-10 months of the year and also we have dog pools available (not cheap, but super fun).

 

Now, hes not that overweight (he should be 38-40 lbs, he can get up to 43-45 lbs when he gains weight) and hes pretty fit otherwise, so like others said you would want to ease into it if your dog is really out of shape.

 

But if you can find a swimming spot, or a dog pool, thats a fab way to keep him fit.

[Gloria Atwater]

Um, no. The feeding instructions on the bag are usually an overestimate of what the dog should actually eat (even at their ideal weight).

 

I was just gonna say, bag estimates are only that, estimates. According to my dog food bag, (Taste of the Wild Pacific Stream) my 40 pound spayed Aussie girl should get a minimum of 2 1/3 cup a day. If I fed her that, she'd be round as a wheel of cheese! She gets only 1 cup a day.

 

Like with people, calorie intakes have to be adjusted according to one's individual activity level, body type and metabolism. I also second the suggestion of adding pumpkin and green beans and such as filler, when you start cutting his food back. It may not be so much a change of feed as just feeding less of it.

 

How much are you feeding him, by the way? And what brand?

 

For my own part, foods I find readily available and within my budget are Taste of the Wild, Chicken Soup for Dog Lovers, Premium Edge and the Costco Nature's Domain brands. All seem like good stuff and my dogs have done well on them. Presently my guys are active and working, so that get ToTW.

 

~ Gloria

 

[Breana']

Thank you to everyone who replied! Running short on time right now (in nursing program) but:

 

I will post recent pictures as soon as I can, we are trying to increase walks, I have a food scale that I use for myself daily, and last but not least I didn't mean to make it sound like he's an old man! I always forget that he's 7 because he still acts the same as he did when he was a puppy! Minus the chewing, digging, and occasional nipping I am just worried that the extra weight is going to age him. Will be back some time this evening, thank you all again!

[moosikins]

dogfoodadvisor.com is a great resource. I think someone on here directed me to the site to pick a highly rated food and learn about its ingredients and components.

[aschlemm]

The extra weight WILL age him!!! Cheers to you for recognizing this and being proactive!!!! I'll suggest staying on the current food (with a reduction of amount) and adding green beans. Carrots and other veggies for snacks (if he'll eat them) or diet treats. Walk him on soft ground (not the road) to prevent further joint damage until the weight comes off. Or take him swimming.

If you do change his food look for "diet" or "less active" and compare the protein/fat to what you currently feed him. Never feed what the bag tells you to, they want to sell dog food!

Good luck and post pics!

[herdcentral]

Regarding feeding what the bag tells you. I have found the supermarket brands overestimate but I have found that for my working sheep dogs the instructions on the good quality foods are spot on. However for my Australian cattle dogs it does overestimate a little so it is very breed and activity variable. One size does not fit all. I also find I might add a little extra in winter. I just keep and eye on their condition and vary accordingly.

 

My Koolie needs up the top end of the recommendations or he falls away quite fast. If I am feeding dry he needs minimum 3 cups a day and he is about 49lbs and very lean, my similar weight cattle dog needs 1 1/4 cups or she starts to put weight on. Something you get to work out for each dog.

 

With swimming for physically challenged dogs I always use a buoyancy vest to start with so they are not floundering around, I feel it is a safer way to start.

[Breana']

I got a few pictures today and hoooooly smokes. No excuses at all but this is definitely something that kind of snuck up on me with my nursing program and work schedule within the last year. I tried to get better ones but this is what I got for now! He's eating beneful and I think he's eating around two cups a day which is clearly too much! So I know where to start for sure. He doesn't like swimming and we don't have anywhere around here that allows that, but I have a cabin in northern Michigan right on the lake and will try harder to coax him in this summer.

IMG_2064.JPG IMG_2010.JPG

[Sekah]

Regarding feeding what the bag tells you. I have found the supermarket brands overestimate but I have found that for my working sheep dogs the instructions on the good quality foods are spot on. However for my Australian cattle dogs it does overestimate a little so it is very breed and activity variable. One size does not fit all. I also find I might add a little extra in winter. I just keep and eye on their condition and vary accordingly.

The way I understand it, is that the feeding guidelines are formulated for the most active, young, intact, working dogs who by nature will require the highest caloric intake. Dog food companies don't want any lawsuits to the tune of "I fed my dog what you told me to and it died of starvation". Most dogs are obviously not nearly as active as that.

I got a few pictures today and hoooooly smokes. No excuses at all but this is definitely something that kind of snuck up on me with my nursing program and work schedule within the last year. I tried to get better ones but this is what I got for now! He's eating beneful and I think he's eating around two cups a day which is clearly too much! So I know where to start for sure. He doesn't like swimming and we don't have anywhere around here that allows that, but I have a cabin in northern Michigan right on the lake and will try harder to coax him in this summer.

IMG_2064.JPG IMG_2010.JPG

Your images didn't upload correctly. But Beneful is pretty much the bottomest of the bottom of the barrel when it comes to dog food. Go check out dogfoodadvisor.com to get a better handle on food. If you're looking for something relatively inexpensive but decent, the Costco brand grain-free dog food is a good starting point. There's plenty of better foods than that, but it's a good place to start.

[Breana']

Oh shoot, I'll try to figure out why. And I know that stuff is pretty much all junk, it's just what my mom bought unfortunately. I've been looking around on that site and trying to compare here and there, and I'll definitely take into consideration Costco's grain-free variety. To be honest I'm super disgusted with myself and just really disappointed that I wasn't paying as much attention to him as I should've been We'll get his fluffy butt healthy and in shape!

[gcv-border]

Just seconding the advice about Beneful. Horrible food, but great marketing. They pander to the naïve dog owner who thinks that some photos of healthy ingredients actually means that the food is healthy. Whenever I see someone in the grocery store buying Beneful, it is all I can do not to start telling them how bad it is. Last time I actually checked the ingredients, it also contained sugar.

 

I don't have a Costco near me (closest is about 2 hours away), but I order food through Chewy.com. [Free shipping if you buy over $49 - which is easy to do. Fast shipping too.]

 

Life happens. At least you now recognize the problem. Glad to hear that you are taking charge of his diet and exercise.

[GentleLake]

Ditto on the Beneful warning.

 

petfooddirect.com also has free shipping for $49+ orders . . . for comparison shopping if nothing else.

[Alchemist]

If you're an Amazon Prime member, they'll ship dog food to you for free. I often buy big bags of Taste of the Wild from them if I don't have time to stop by the feed store. Their prices are pretty good.

 

Agree with what others say about Beneful.

 

If your dog is giving you sad eyes because he thinks he's starving, you can always add some "filler" to his diet - I've heard good things about using cooked green beans for this purpose. Just be careful (if you're using canned ones) to get them without added salt.

 

And plan on his losing weight gradually - don't try to do it too suddenly.

[Breana']

Thank you all so much everyone! Still trying to figure out why my pictures won't post on here but oh well. I'll be posting about progress as we make it, and I really can't thank you all enough for being supportive and encouraging instead of ripping my head off

[gcv-border]

Thank you all so much everyone! Still trying to figure out why my pictures won't post on here but oh well. I'll be posting about progress as we make it, and I really can't thank you all enough for being supportive and encouraging instead of ripping my head off

It might be your browser. I am not a techie (others here can help), but I do know that depending on which browser you use, the quote function won't work (IE doesn't seem to support the quote function).

 

Not being able to post a pic may be as simple as size (too large?) - or something else. As I said, some computer savvy person may chime in.

[chene]

Thank you all so much everyone! Still trying to figure out why my pictures won't post on here but oh well. I'll be posting about progress as we make it, and I really can't thank you all enough for being supportive and encouraging instead of ripping my head off

 

It might be your browser. I am not a techie (others here can help), but I do know that depending on which browser you use, the quote function won't work (IE doesn't seem to support the quote function).

 

Not being able to post a pic may be as simple as size (too large?) - or something else. As I said, some computer savvy person may chime in.

 

 

I'm decently tech-savvy, but I have no idea what the issue is. As far as I can tell from your first attempt to post pictures it looks like you just copy-pasted the name of the pictures,so I'm just going to give some general info since I have no idea what your level of tech knowledge is or isn't. To attach a picture, make sure to go to "More Reply Options" beside the post button, click choose file, and then don't forget to click "Attach This File". If it's too big a red error message will show up right above the "Attach Files" text. If that's the case I usually just embed them from an image hosting site (I use Imgur or Photobucket but anything similar will work). Once you upload a picture to one of those sites it'll give you a few different links to copy and paste. Either copy and paste the BBcode (the one that starts with ) directly into the post, or paste the direct link using the image button on this forum at the top of the post, beside the all bold, italic, etc font stuff (again you'll have to be in the "More Reply Options" part).

 

And and gcv-border mentioned, if you're using Internet Explorer you may have problems regardless.

 

Hope something in there helped.

[highway61]

You could host your pics on a free photo site like photobucket.com and then just paste the HTML link in the body of the message. That way you don't have to mess with altering/re-sizing the pictures.