Nose Work vs Tracking

[Alfreda]

Does anyone have a good idea about the differences between Nose Work and other kinds of tracking/scent training? I mean in the progression of training etc.?

[rushdoggie]

Well, basically, tracking is ground scenting along a path someone walked to find dropped articles, while nose work is air scenting to locate the source of odor.

 

I'm not sure what you mean about the progression of training.

[Alfreda]

thanks Rushdoggie-

 

I guess I'm wondering if starting one way (in one activity) would prevent, or confuse the dog from doing the other? There are certain rules and levels in Nosework -are they applicable to real work in scenting or tracking, or would working dogs be started and taught differently?

 

Is it possible that starting in Nose Work could be a good foundation in some way for applied tracking or scenting skills?

 

At some point tracking must be about finding a particular scent and following it to the exclusion of other scents. I thought it would actually involve both air and ground scenting...no ?

 

Tracking is not only about following one human's path alone. Sometimes it is about tracking the scat of a particular endangered species, or sniffing out an invasive plant for census-taking.

 

Is NoseWork more comparable to drug or bomb detection than to tracking then?

 

thanks for any info/thoughts

[Guest Jule]

I've done tracking with a working line german shepherd. Tracking is specifically focuses on man tracking. They track the scent of the human, locate and indicate articles belonging to that human along the way. They must not be distracted by human cross trails along the way but remain focused on the human whose scent you gave him in the beginning. Air scenting is discouraged and will result in lost points if you are in a trial. The exception is if a dog overshoots a corner where're the human has turned on an angle. The dog may stand and air scent to locate which direction the ground trail goes and must then put nose back to the ground.

Nose work is not about following a trail but instead locating a scent the same as that which the dog has been introduced to. i.e.: scented oils etc or in a practical working sense, a drug, money, fire arms, animal scats. It is different in that you are not asking the dog to follow a trail (tracking) to the scented item but rather to "search" for it using air scent.

Great pains are taken when hiding scented articles as scent particles must not waft in the air risking laying a ground scent to the article. Items to be hidden must be in an air tight plastic bag and an airtight plastic box. Many changes of gloves are used while preparing.

Scenting is just a term used for both styles. You are scenting the dog when you introduce it to the odour you want it to find be it human or other. Term also used in respect to saying the dog is scenting i.e.: when the dog is sniffing the ground or the air. You often hear nose work also referred to as scent work.

In respect to training, there is not a progression from one to the other as such, usually you do one style or the other. If you wanted to try both it would probably not be wise to start with nose work first because you would later possibly have greater trouble teaching the dog that it can no longer air scent once you switch to "tracking", which is not to say that it couldn't be done.

On the other hand, if you start with tracking, once your dog has reached champion level it can then move to urban search and rescue which involves a mix of both disciplines tending a little more towards nose work:i.e.: locating any human scent or cadaver etc.

 

Both of these styles are excellent mental stimulation for any working dog.

While BC's are not traditionally used for tracking or nose work they actually do a fine job of it provided they have the drive. There are BC's used here in Australia very successfully in search and rescue work.

 

I loved tracking my WL GSD, he was a natural and he lived for it. He would gaze longingly up at his tracking harness in the same way many dogs gaze at a ball or frisbee. My BC is only young and although I will probably not trial him I will give him the chance to enjoy it if he likes doing it. It's a lot of fun and helps builds a great relationship with your dog. The key is being able to read your dogs body language and putting your trust in him.

[gcv-border]

I think Jule makes very good points. ^^^

 

From my very limited experience (I took a tracking class [nose to ground] when my BC was ~ 16 months old; I know people that work their dogs in SAR; and also pet owners who train and trial in the increasingly popular AKC-style Nosework), I believe that for trialing purposes, the dog is not only judged on finding the object, but also the manner in which it attains its goal. i.e. in a tracking trial, the dog should not be air-scenting. For working purposes, the people I know in the local SAR train their dogs for air-scenting, but if the dog should need to use some tracking skills, they are not going to discourage that. They need a dog to find the victim regardless of how they do it.

[Laurelin]

^^ AKC doesn't have nosework. UKC does and NASCW in the US. AKC does have a version of tracking, which I believe is different than IPO style tracking.

 

I do NASCW style nosework with my dogs but will likely branch out to UKC since it's more common.

 

Think of nosework as a drug detection dog simulation. Vs tracking/trailing a person or animal. I've never done tracking but from what I've heard they are two totally separate skills.

[gcv-border]

^^ AKC doesn't have nosework. UKC does and NASCW in the US. AKC does have a version of tracking, which I believe is different than IPO style tracking.

Thanks for the correction. Because of the trial format, I made the leap to AKC. I now remember reading several years ago that it was a separate organization.

[Maralynn]

To all this I'll add that dogs may pick up tracking on their once they learn to use their nose. I have an airscent SAR dog and have to be careful how I set up search problems so he doesn't track instead of scenting. A cadaver dog on my team also quickly figured out how to track to get to the source (he followed the track of whoever set it out).

 

Both dogs figured out tracking on their own - we never introduced it and wanted to avoid it. My dog has done a perfect 1/3 of a mile track through fields and woods.

[rushdoggie]

I track with my dogs, and I dabbled for a few weeks in Noseowrk.

 

I found that introducing nosework to my Border Collie confused him a lot in tracking, he spent a lot of time air scenting instead of ground scenting. He seemed more confused at corners especially.

 

Based on that, I stopped nosework for now and will introduce it later after he is done tracking.

 

That's one person's anecdotal info, and its quite possible that like many things he would have done better after time when he really understood nosework (and realized that tracking was different), like how a dog learning a drop on recall has a hard time with regular recalls until they get the DOR completely. But I am more invested in tracking than nosework so I quit nosework.

 

I don't find tracking hard, really, it takes some time like anything else but its cheap, and lovely spending quality 1-1 time with my boys in the great outdoors.

[Laurelin]

Nosework is cheap and easy too. You can buy a kit for $25 or less if you make your own. It's my 'lazy day' go to for the dogs. Just put out 3-4 hides at a time and run all the dogs a few times. They love it and any dog can do it.

[Guest Jule]

To all this I'll add that dogs may pick up tracking on their once they learn to use their nose. I have an airscent SAR dog and have to be careful how I set up search problems so he doesn't track instead of scenting. A cadaver dog on my team also quickly figured out how to track to get to the source (he followed the track of whoever set it out).

 

Both dogs figured out tracking on their own - we never introduced it and wanted to avoid it. My dog has done a perfect 1/3 of a mile track through fields and woods.

What great dogs ! Yes tracking comes very naturally to them and they will use it when they can. We don't really need to teach them to do it but rather, just structure how they do it. On the flip side to your experience, we have a dog in our club who tends to air scent, so when he picks up that scent he short cuts directly to the human by following that air scent, consequently missing half the track that was laid for him and failing to locate and indicate the articles left along the track. I guess in a real life situation it's a win as long as the person is found but in a trialling situation for tracking, it is a fail. This dog would probably be well suited to SAR's work.

[teresaserrano]

I don't do any formal nosework with Tess but we do play nose games. If we're out in the woods and I hide her toy, go back to her and release her to go find it, she mainly tracks, otherwise she is likely to miss the toy. But If I go hide (I walk between 200 and 600 steps) she will go find me by airscenting mostly, running. She only puts her nose on the ground when she misses a turn. She does usually follow my trail though, and only deviates when she's near me. So she seems to work in the manner she has found works better for each situation. She seems to prefer airscenting to tracking though. Looks a bit as if she finds tracking slower and boring.

[urge to herd]

So, how do you find a tracking class or did you get a book? What book?

 

Gibbs has his nose to the ground a lot, he certainly seems to me, (and I'm no expert) interested in following a scent track. If I can, I'd like to look into it as something we can do.

 

I am not thinking of doing any thing like SAR - just want to have a new kind of fun with my dog.

 

Ruth and Gibbs

[Maralynn]

Here's a good write up on beginning tracking. Classes can be super helpful but it is also something that you can do on your own

 

http://dogden.proboards.com/thread/2435/beginning-footstep-tracking

[rushdoggie]

So, how do you find a tracking class or did you get a book? What book?

 

My tracking mentor recommends these 2 books:

 

About Track Laying

by Betty Mueller

 

About Tracking Dog Training

by Betty Mueller

 

I thought they were good, but wanted a more step-by-step as I tend to track alone and sometimes feel a little like I'm not sure how to progress, so she recommended

 

Enthusiastic Tracking

William "Sil" Sanders

 

The Audible Nose

Judi Adler

http://www.sweetbay.com/

 

She says that this is the most complete book about tracking. You have to order it from the author but I did read through a copy and liked it a lot so I ordered it.

 

You don't need fancy lines or harnesses especially at the beginning, I use a Premiere Sure Fit Harness on both of my dogs and I do have bio-thane tracking lines but you can use any non restrictive harness and line you can find. I got some leather gloves at Harbor Freight and found assorted other stuff to use as articles around the house.

[Guest Jule]

So, how do you find a tracking class or did you get a book? What book?

 

Gibbs has his nose to the ground a lot, he certainly seems to me, (and I'm no expert) interested in following a scent track. If I can, I'd like to look into it as something we can do.

 

I am not thinking of doing any thing like SAR - just want to have a new kind of fun with my dog.

 

Ruth and Gibbs

I am in Australia so it might be a little different. I just googled "Dog Tracking Clubs" initially and that got me on to the club I then joined. Once I got into it I realised it was a dog sport recognised by the ANKC (AKC for those in the US) so contacting your AKC could also help.

It is probably one of the easiest dog sports to do because it comes so naturally to them. Yes, it is a whole lot of fun and very exciting when your dog takes you through all types of terrain for up to 1.4kilometres hot on a track. It really adds a new dimension to your bond with your dog because he is the only one who actually knows where you are going, the handler of course is not permitted to know where the track has been laid. You really learn to read your dog and trust him. As you progress through the levels more corners and articles are included and depending on how well they do you can achieve a grading of Good, Very Good or Excellent. There are 3 trials to achieve TD title, 3 to achieve TDX (X being excellent) and then 2 trials for CH (champion). Well, this is in Australia.

There are books around and vids on utube but I found most just had their own idea's which was often contrary to info you get when you do your initial workshop with a Tracking club.

The style of tracking used in IPO (Schutzhund) varies again. While regular tracking is through all terrains sometimes with grass 6ft tall, IPO tracking is done on short mown grass in a flat field and is slow with a higher obedience factor i.e. when indicating an article they must drop in the direction of the track and wait to be released. In regular tracking the indication simply has to be clear i.e. sit, drop, stand over and look, pick up etc. The dog can move on as soon as it has indicated even though you are 30ft behind on the end of the line. In regular tracking the dog also contends with scent drift and pooling, dependant on the terrain. IPO tracking is also trained initially by leaving food trails that mingle with the human scent, whereas regular tracking is only about the human scent right from the beginning. To me an IPO track is a walk in the park for a tracking dog, except for the slow, controlled manner in which IPO is expected to be done.

If you watch an IPO dog finish a track, he just sits there at the finish flag waiting for the next instruction. When you see a tracking dog finish it is very different. My boy would be pumped and rightly impressed with himself, prancing around like, Oh yeah, I'm the man !!!!

[TxMom]

So, how do you find a tracking class or did you get a book? What book?

 

Gibbs has his nose to the ground a lot, he certainly seems to me, (and I'm no expert) interested in following a scent track. If I can, I'd like to look into it as something we can do.

 

I am not thinking of doing any thing like SAR - just want to have a new kind of fun with my dog.

 

Ruth and Gibbs

 

Fenzi has a Tracking 101 course running right now. http://fenzidogsportsacademy.com/index.php/courses/17#course-details Registration ends 12/15, so you've got some time if you're interested. Livi and I are currently doing Nosework 101 and so far it's been money well spent!

[Alfreda]

thanks everyone! this has been very helpful to me in understanding the differences etc.

 

Tx mom thanks for the heads-up on the Fenzi trackin 101 !

[GentleLake]

... we have a dog in our club who tends to air scent, so when he picks up that scent he short cuts directly to the human by following that air scent, consequently missing half the track that was laid for him and failing to locate and indicate the articles left along the track. I guess in a real life situation it's a win as long as the person is found but in a trialling situation for tracking, it is a fail. This dog would probably be well suited to SAR's work.

 

I have a friend who was training her English shepherd for SAR (until the group dissed her and she finally quit) and he was like that. It seemed like he couldn't see the sense in following the track when he could scent where the "victim" was and get to her or him directly.

 

In a real life situation where the goal is finding an injured person needing assistance, I guess this would be best. But if it were for an investigation where authorities wanted to collect evidence the tracking dog who followed the trail and alerted to items along the way would be preferable.

 

I guess it would depend on the situation, but I know which dog I'd hope was looking for me if I were laying bleeding in the wilderness somewhere.