My teenager. It's a stare off.

[kcooper]

Hi everyone!

 

I'm not completely new to the forum. More of a longtime lurker. I would greatly appreciate any advice to this post! I'm at a total loss here.

 

Anywhoo...So. My BC pup, Bowie - one month short of a year old now. Has entered the teenager phase. I'm having a really hard time with his stubbornness.

 

The biggest issue currently is during outdoor playtime. I can't place any rhyme or reason to it. Some days he's wonderful. Comes when called. Always retrieves his toy happily. Other days. A bee flying by steals his attention. And that's its. He's off in search of greener pastures.

 

His ears shut off and he's oblivious to my calls. Well, not totally oblivious. He will turn to me and stare from a distance. Like he sees me there. Calling. Yet it's a stand off. If I so much as take a step in his direction he turns and makes a dash for freedom. The stare off can last nearly a minute. It's like blatant defiance.

 

It's a rare occurrence. Maybe once a week. Several good days in a row. Then one bad day. Now granted he does come back home within a few minutes. On his own good will. But I hate that I can't be sure if and when this will happen.

 

We live rurally. So putting up a fence would cost a fortune. But I've tried different methods. Treats work. Off and on. Walking in the opposing direction has worked. Off and on.

 

What can I do here? My apologies for the long post. Any advice I would be great!

[Donald McCaig]

Dear Doggers,

 

First: re train the puppy recall. Short distances, inviting posture, high praise, on a light line. Walk to him until he comes or -if you're very close - takes a step toward you. Recalls are pattern behavior - the more he does it, the more he'll do it. If he gets the notion the recall's optional, you are in trouble.

 

If his recall is optional, I've used this tactic on a dog that ALWAYS ran off. It takes a while to set up and the line can tangle so before you try it, you'd best be sure this is one of those days your dog is going to run off.

 

 

Attach a fifty foot light nylon line (parachute cord) to his collar Plus his leash. Walk him around briefly on leash and unhook the leash. Make a big deal out of releasing him. If he goes away a short distance, call him to you. He comes? Serious praise. If he starts the staredown. DOWN or SIT him, whichever command he knows, and take a step toward him. If he downs/sits go to him with high praise. If he bolts, you take off in the opposite direction (wear a glove). When he does his tumble, you release pressure and offer an inviting recall.

 

Don't drag him with the line. If he doesn't come (he probably will) DOWN or SIT and go to him murmuring his name. If he stays, high praise, reattach the leash and back in the house. Don't let him understand the light line deception.

 

Donald McCaig

[kcooper]

Dear Doggers,

 

First: re train the puppy recall. Short distances, inviting posture, high praise, on a light line. Walk to him until he comes or -if you're very close - takes a step toward you. Recalls are pattern behavior - the more he does it, the more he'll do it. If he gets the notion the recall's optional, you are in trouble.

 

If his recall is optional, I've used this tactic on a dog that ALWAYS ran off. It takes a while to set up and the line can tangle so before you try it, you'd best be sure this is one of those days your dog is going to run off.

 

 

Attach a fifty foot light nylon line (parachute cord) to his collar Plus his leash. Walk him around briefly on leash and unhook the leash. Make a big deal out of releasing him. If he goes away a short distance, call him to you. He comes? Serious praise. If he starts the staredown. DOWN or SIT him, whichever command he knows, and take a step toward him. If he downs/sits go to him with high praise. If he bolts, you take off in the opposite direction (wear a glove). When he does his tumble, you release pressure and offer an inviting recall.

 

Don't drag him with the line. If he doesn't come (he probably will) DOWN or SIT and go to him murmuring his name. If he stays, high praise, reattach the leash and back in the house. Don't let him understand the light line deception.

 

Donald McCaig

Thank you. I appreciate the advice! As this is an entirely new behaviour pattern I've been contending with. I swear it's as though it happened overnight. It's obviously time to reaffirm my authority. I was previously given the advice to "walk away" by my local trainer. Can't say that method did much good for long. Two attempts at that. And he figured it out.

[GentleLake]

I'd let him drag a leash or a long line and walk him down when he does it.

 

And/or put him on a long line and reel him in if he doesn't come.

 

Remember, every time he gets away with not coming to you, it reinforces the idea that he doesn't have to do it if he doesn't want to.

 

It's quite possible that the cue has already been poisoned. It would probably be a good idea to start all over with Recall 101 with a brand new cue that you'll enforce each and every time until you know it's reliable.

[Gideon's girl]

Both of mine went through this phase and needed to be reminded that they earned the right to be off leash by always responding to me. I started treating them like they were little puppies that knew nothing and had no training. I seriously think I mortified them by treating them like babies. My more laid back boy needed to be treated like a baby for a grand total of 20 minutes, before he decided that he preferred to be a responsible adult. My more intense boy needed a couple weeks to get the idea.

[teresaserrano]

"The biggest issue currently is during outdoor playtime. I can't place any rhyme or reason to it."

 

Do you have kids? have they been through adolescence yet? If yes to both questions, was there any ryme or reason to it?

More and more, I think the answer is just "Keep working on it, calmly and consistently". I remember when I had to tell my kids to wash their teeth, again and again and again. Oh, and shower. There was a period when I had to pay close attention if they had showered. Because they wouldn't if they could.

Then they grew up. And they where perfectly normal polite charming girls that bathed every day.

[CMP]

^^

Oh yeah, the pre-teen shower thing - I had almost forgotten. I had to watch like a hawk that I did not have dirty children for a while, as I recall.

 

-------

 

I 100% agree that you MUST not let recall fail. At this age, I would not be giving second chances, either. In my world of corrective training, by this age they come when they are called or there is a consequence that they can link directly to that disobedience. Usually tethering or leash attachment, sometimes banishment into the house. I doubt it has been rendered ineffective (takes a lot of disobedience to undo the conditioning of that most-used command) but it is definitely going to break if allowed to bend.

 

It is undoubtedly a good idea to go back to a long line or a training line (I use a lunge line under similar circumstances) to remind him that freedom from a leash is an earned privelege.

 

Don't forget to call him like he is GOING to come to you and that when he does, it will be a fine experience for everyone

 

That all said - this is VERY normal - even the best trained puppies go through testing phases. Interestingly, you might consider this a lemonade from lemons moment: recall is the one thing that must always be rock solid and you have been presented with an opportunity to really ingrain the notion in your dog who is at exactly the right age to "get it" and get it for good.

 

Good luck.

[Two Labs & Mia]

Boy does that sound familiar. Going through the same thing with 5 month old Mia right now. We set up a small "little kid" yard with square wire fence and metal posts off one side of the deck and bought a light line. Started taking her down the stairs to that side of the deck with a lead on her collar, trade the lead connection to the line connection, let her have her time to sniff/potty, call her back, tell her good, lead back on, back up stairs. She doesn't like it much compared to being allowed to go down the other side of the deck into the large privacy fenced yard with the big dogs.

 

She will come in with them when I give the everyone come signal, 8 times a day, for days in a row. Then all of a sudden, one day, 2 out of the 8 trips, she'll fail. Following day, if she's been getting by with it, no come at all. Times she's broken a string of consistency and I've switched her right back to the line the very next trip for an entire day, she gets the idea much faster. Got lax over the week end with DH just opening door for all three to run out, he let her fail twice, this a.m. I've had trouble 2 of 2 trips. (Heehee, looks like I need to work on both of them.)

 

I know she needs to run and play, but she does need to know the string attached to that is that you come back when called, and on the spot, end of it, or there goes the privilege. She'll pretend she has to go out more when I'm doing this, and do little "courtesy pees", just to see if I will continue to hold. Yep. She's back to the line for a few days. Gotta sink in permanent sooner or later. :-)

[kcooper]

Thanks for the replies guys! I appreciate the stories and advice. It's good to know that I'm not alone in this matter. It's been ongoing for about a month now. I'm going to attempt the long line and recall redo. And yes. The whole no rhyme or reason statement was a little silly to say in hindsight. I was a teen once. I should know he's capable of being a walking brain fart. I know I sure was!

[ourwully]

My recall with 10 month old Juno is still an issue but CMP gave me a great piece of advice which I have been trying for the last two weeks or so. CMP elaborates more on the "whistle as an interupter" thread, but basically I have been using the whistle to build a solid recall. The first day I loaded the whistle like a clicker by blowing the whistle near her and giving her a good treat every time. After that I would blow the whistle in situations where I was positive she would come (no distractions or she was already on her way) and then treat her on arrival. I am still working on verbal and non verbal recall so I am not rushing the whistle. I am using it a few times a day in many different situations. After two weeks I am now whistling for her from the bottom of the yard where she can't see me but I can see that she isn't distracted.Two days ago she didn't respond immediately and I was very surprised, but also quite angry with myself because I hadn't noticed that she was totally focussed on a squirrel. So overall she has only failed to respond once in two weeks and I consider that my fault. I see this as a several month, maybe longer, project. I am still doing other things including the use of a long line and I am sure they will work eventually, but I really have the sense that the whistle is a sure thing. So far so good.

Bill