BC breeders in CA, USA

[WildFlower]

Hi!

 

The best way to find good breeders is to go to stock dog trials and talk to people. Or, even better, volunteer at stock dog trials. Check out the USBCHA website for a list of trials. (Sorry I couldn't paste the link for some reason.) I think I counted 5 trials in CA between now and the end of the year. The stock dog world is full of wonderful helpful people. Meeting them and their dogs is the best way to learn about litters and more about the dogs. (I read that you went to a trainer, too. That's great!)

 

I know that you were given some names of folks in CA to contact and it sounds like you contacted them. Could you try and contact them again to ask if they know of any other handlers that are having pups any time soon? Please do keep in mind that when you first posted this thread most handlers were likely trialing. Some of the biggest trials in the western USA are in September.

 

Another website to keep an eye on is www.handlerspost.com. This website has a classified section that lists dogs and pups for sale.

 

One other thing that I will mention, is that most handlers only breed when they want another puppy - they aren't breeding puppies to sell puppies. That is not the "business" that they are in. So litters are fewer in number than other types (i.e. AKC or BYB) of litters.

 

I am a relative novice in the stock dog world - only been in the stock dog world for 5 years. One thing that I have heard over and over again is that if you want a puppy from a particular person or dog - get on the list for a pup. So when I started to think about wanting another dog - I did just that. And I have been waiting for 2 years to get a pup from a particular breeding. I am happy to wait. I know what I want. So the point of my little story is - if you really want a nice working bred pup you may need to be more patient. Not what you wanted to hear, I'm sure.

[Maralynn]

Get on the waiting list of the trainer you've met and try to convince the wife of the virtures of smoothies? Nothing like cuddling a pup to change a mind...

[gcv-border]

Correct me if I am wrong - it sounds like you are limiting your search to only breeders in southern CA. Obviously that is very limiting. Consider purchasing a well-bred pup from outside your area. It may have to be transported, or you could make a trip to pick it up.

 

With regards to a smoothie and your DW's likes/dislikes: IMHO the beauty of a dog is in what is IS and DOES, not in how it looks. In fact, I really like the ratty looking dogs, the ones that no one gives a second look, but when they are on the field, they show up all others.

 

My DH wasn't too sure about getting a smoothie. Same old story, he was used to the fluffy BC. Now he really likes the shorter coat - cleaner, less/no brushing, fewer burrs in the coat, etc.

[Cass C]

Honestly I'm one of the people who prefers a fluffy dog it's just personal preference, but I would certainly be willing to look at smooth coats as well. Maybe you can see if your DW would be willing to at least look at the smooth puppies. You never know one could just steal her heart. Lots of people end up with great dogs that don't neccicarily look like the dog they had imagined. I had it in my mind I wanted a traditional marked border collie and I fell in love with my little split face girl.

 

If she is willing to look then get on the list as long as there is no obligation to buy, should your wife not like any of the puppies.

[TEC]

Coat, markings and ear-set are features many people see first when they look at a dog. Choosing a working dog involves lots of additional considerations which in the long term will strongly impact your satisfaction.

 

There are finely built border collies, and heavier structured. Border Collies have numerous body types: long legged and short, wide viewed from the front and narrow, compact and lanky, etc. Your choice would likely depend on the jobs you have in mind.

 

Watch their gaits: walking, trotting, running. Are they loose and flowing? If you are selecting a pup, try to observe its parents. Watch them working stock.

 

You can observe interaction in a pack, and thereby find-out about their demeanors and temperaments. How do they interact with people?

 

Is the dog/puppy or its parents on the hard or soft side for stock training? How is work ethic and heat tolerance?

 

Chapters and books are written on the subject of border collie characteristics, so the above are just a few things to further look into and consider. Observing parents and the puppy provide clues, yet part of the fascination with pups is all about possibilities, and working with what they eventually give us.

 

As already mentioned, 1) health checks, 2) papers from reputable registry, and 3) dog's/parents'/ancestors' degree of success in the field (farm and/or competition) are no doubt the big three in choosing a dog/puppy. Everything you look at increases the chance of lifelong happiness. -- Best wishes, TEC

[CptJack]

Lots of people end up with great dogs that don't neccicarily look like the dog they had imagined

 

I would absolutely join you in encouraging you to actually meet the puppies and see what happens.

 

I have a really big love of fluffy, traditionally marked (full collar, socks, blaze), upright eared border collies who are also lightly built and all around small. What I came home with was, well.

 

Not enough white, short coat, wild ears, and probably going to be bigger than I wanted.

 

The thing is, she was and is the right puppy for me, she just wasn't wrapped in the package I find the prettiest. And you know, yeah, it'd be nicer if I found her cute (I honest to god think she is the goofiest looking dog I have ever seen - she's not just not fluffy and little with more white, she's got strange proportions and a funny shaped head) but she is so, so very right for my home and what I wanted in a dog. It's almost impossible for me to care that she looks weird because she is just... she's perfect. She's playful and fearless and eager and willing and bold and driven and I can not express in words how much I love this stinking puppy. And I honestly can't imagine her with perfect ears and markings and a lot of coat, much less wish she had those things, because if she did? She wouldn't be HER.

 

I'm not going to tell you to settle. Settling for a dog you don't want is never really going to be a great idea and can be a huge disaster.

 

I am going to suggest you spend a little time with some puppies as individuals and see what happens. You might find it easier to look past the packaging than you think.

[highway61]

I agree CptJack...she's perfect

[D'Elle]

I am glad that you are listening to the advice you are getting here. Please do not buy an AKC registered puppy under any circumstances.

 

I was about to make that mistake, myself, once. I got set straight about that, and it might really help you to read the conversation that we all had here, which educated me. I thought that I understood prior to that, but I did not, and I am grateful to these folks here for being willing to educate me. I want to give a link to that thread, but do not know how to do that. Can anyone help me out with that? I think that it was about 4 years ago, and I think the title was "Well, I think I am getting a puppy".

 

Also, I would like strongly to encourage you at least to consider getting a puppy from rescue. Border Collie Rescue of southern California is a large and very active group and they have a lot of dogs all the time. they are also very knowledgeable and helpful. And, yes, they get puppies!!

My male BC came from them, and he was bred for working, and he has been an absolutely awesome dog for the past 12 years.

 

I know you want a young puppy, but you also want certain characteristics. The cool thing about getting a rescue dog is that maybe the dog is already 6 or 8 months old and the personality is pretty clear by then, a lot of the time. You know what you are getting. And if you are stuck on wanting a baby (which I can understand)....well, they get in babies, too. Contact them. Talk to them. Not all the dogs that they have are necessarily on the website, so talk to someone about what you want.

 

and, all of the above things are also true of Arizona border Collie Rescue, and I suggest you contact them as well.

Best of luck and thank you for not supporting the backyard breeders or the AKC breeders!

[Sue R]

If you started the topic, go to the "new content" page and, on the left, go down most of the way and choose "items I started", which will take you to a list of topics you began. Just scroll through those to find the topic.

 

If it was just one you participated in, then the search would be much longer!

 

I am glad that you are listening to the advice you are getting here. Please do not buy an AKC registered puppy under any circumstances.

 

I was about to make that mistake, myself, once. I got set straight about that, and it might really help you to read the conversation that we all had here, which educated me. I thought that I understood prior to that, but I did not, and I am grateful to these folks here for being willing to educate me. I want to give a link to that thread, but do not know how to do that. Can anyone help me out with that? I think that it was about 4 years ago, and I think the title was "Well, I think I am getting a puppy".

[Sue R]

This is *such good advice* and sums it up very well.

 

When I am no longer in the position of needing/wanting a dog to work stock, rescue is where I will look for an active companion. And rescues have pups but you may just have to wait a little before one becomes available to you.

 

Meanwhile, contact rescues, fill out the application forms and let them know what you might be interested in in particular. Also, don't be close-minded because the dog out there that is perfect on the inside may not be the dog that seems perfect on the outside. And it's what's inside that matters.

 

Very best wishes!

 

Also, I would like strongly to encourage you at least to consider getting a puppy from rescue. Border Collie Rescue of southern California is a large and very active group and they have a lot of dogs all the time. they are also very knowledgeable and helpful. And, yes, they get puppies!!

My male BC came from them, and he was bred for working, and he has been an absolutely awesome dog for the past 12 years.

 

I know you want a young puppy, but you also want certain characteristics. The cool thing about getting a rescue dog is that maybe the dog is already 6 or 8 months old and the personality is pretty clear by then, a lot of the time. You know what you are getting. And if you are stuck on wanting a baby (which I can understand)....well, they get in babies, too. Contact them. Talk to them. Not all the dogs that they have are necessarily on the website, so talk to someone about what you want.

 

and, all of the above things are also true of Arizona border Collie Rescue, and I suggest you contact them as well.

Best of luck and thank you for not supporting the backyard breeders or the AKC breeders!

[D'Elle]

Thanks, Sue, but when I did that it only listed one thread, the most recent one I started. Maybe the Boards do not keep threads that are over so old. That one was about 4 years ago.

[Sue R]

Okay, sorry. I guess I haven't searched that far back before.

[sharatk]

Hello All,

 

Thanks for lot of wonderful advices. I will contact all the people mentioned here. I will try to volunteer in events whichever happens over weekends.Would somebody here have a list which would have local events in Southern CA. It can be small event, not necessarily national. A few good people always show up.

 

I do not like AKC one. They have this "Aussie" BC. Looks like a Golden Retriever spray-painted in Black and White. Nothing against them, but they look too fat and lazy to keep up. They might make good cuddle puppies though.

 

For my first puppy, I do not want to get a shelter one. I want to meet the parents before I buy one and train them from infancy (On obedience).

 

I have nothing against any dog's looks. I look at the dog who I can admire and can keep up with what I want it to do. DW(I guess it stands for Dear Wife) on the other hands likes a dog which is drop dead beauty . I convinced her on BC (Her pick was a golden retriever). Took me over an year. I can ask no more from her. I would need her to like the puppy.

 

I am not limiting my searches to South CA. I will be ok to buy a puppy from anywhere in US. But before buying I would like to meet the breeder, the parents, living conditions. And any good breeder would like to see me in person. It is not very easy if they are too far off. I can though drive to say North CA(Around 600 miles), if I have three farms/breeders to visit and they show signs that they can consider non-working homes (Not possible to go there for every single breeder).

 

How do you guys meet your breeders. Do you buy without meeting them and the litter? If they are far off, do you drive/fly or meet at some event?

 

Thanks

Sharat

[Root Beer]

My husband was not keen on the idea of a smooth coat, either. I'm not sure why - as we have had three smooth coated dogs, and his favorite among all of our dogs is one of them!! I twisted his arm very hard and he went along with what I wanted and we got on the list for a smooth coat breeding. I knew it would all work out once we had our puppy.

 

And then . . . . having gotten a puppy from two smooth coated dogs, guess what we got? A puppy who is growing a longer coat and is shaping up to be a drop dead beauty!!

 

So, I would say get on the list if you like the breeding and you can. You really never know. My husband, who was not initially thrilled could not be happier with our puppy!! The coat is a bonus - we really love him for who he is.

[Gloria Atwater]

Hello All,

 

Thanks for lot of wonderful advices. I will contact all the people mentioned here. I will try to volunteer in events whichever happens over weekends.Would somebody here have a list which would have local events in Southern CA. It can be small event, not necessarily national. A few good people always show up......

 

How do you guys meet your breeders. Do you buy without meeting them and the litter? If they are far off, do you drive/fly or meet at some event?

 

Thanks

Sharat

 

Here is the list of USBCHA sanctioned trials for the whole US:

http://www.usbcha.com/sheep/upcoming_trials.html

 

You can also look at these websites for more localized California trials:

http://www.norcalsheepdog.org/events/

http://www.sjvbca.org/events.html

http://resda.com/_/RESDA.html

 

You might be able to find events on those sites that are close enough for you to go and watch and meet people.

 

As for buying pups ... I'd say it varies. If the dogs are known by their breeding/pedigree and the breeder is known for their accomplishments and those of their dogs, then very often people will buy a pup from them sight unseen. Otherwise, I've known people to pick a pup from a breeder by photographs or videos and if they live at a distance, they'll drive or fly out to pick up their puppy.

 

Finding a good pup is not easy! I've only recently made up my mind that, with my current dogs now at ages 4, 5 and 6, I'm ready to find a new pup to raise and be ready to take on the footsteps of my other dogs, when they get older. But quality pups don't just go on trees and I'm a little picky what I get, so ... I wait. And watch. And hope.

 

Wishing you luck!

 

~ Gloria

 

[JohnC]

Thanks, Sue, but when I did that it only listed one thread, the most recent one I started. Maybe the Boards do not keep threads that are over so old. That one was about 4 years ago.

 

This it?

 

http://www.bordercollie.org/boards/index.php?showtopic=29596

[D'Elle]

YES.

Thank you, JohnC. How did you find that?

 

To the OP: above is the thread I mentioned. Although you are already planning to get a good puppy from a responsible breeder who is breeding for working ability, you might find the thread, which thoroughly explains all of the reasons why a person getting a BC should do that, interesting and educational. I sure did!

[JohnC]

YES.

Thank you, JohnC. How did you find that?

 

Just did a site search using Google. Used your ID and "getting a puppy' and it came up as the first result. Interesting thread!

[sharatk]

Hi D'Elle,

 

I went thro the post (well most of it). I already understand that I should keep distance from AKC/Dual registered breeders, regardless of what I want to do with the puppy. In all my enquiry emails I make it loud and clear.

 

Though I am not 100% convinced to the idea, that I should not register it with AKC to run in one of their trails, when I do not plan to breed the dog.

 

There were many who messaged me in PM and I thank them for taking the time out. Tomorrow I will head to a training run for upcoming AKC/AHBA trials. I hope to meet some good people there. *DO not Worry, I will keep in mind everything you guys told me*

 

I have someone who can check dogs for me in WA (He lives in Seattle). Do you guys mind dropping me some PMs with references of people active in WA.

 

Thanks all of you

[Gloria Atwater]

Though I am not 100% convinced to the idea, that I should not register it with AKC to run in one of their trails, when I do not plan to breed the dog.

 

.......... Tomorrow I will head to a training run for upcoming AKC/AHBA trials. I hope to meet some good people there. *DO not Worry, I will keep in mind everything you guys told me*

 

 

Also bear in mind that what you'll see at AKC and AHBA trials, and the way they train their dogs, will be markedly different from anything you'd see at a proper border collie field trial. I know, I got my start in arena trialing and it's an entirely different world. Much smaller, much more controlled, much less natural for the dog.

 

If you simply must run in AKC trials, you don't have to register your dog with AKC. If the dog is spayed/neutered, you can just get an ILP (indefinite listing privilege) number.

 

Personally, I won't give AKC a dime in any form. They do not preserve and promote the true working border collie and in fact, breeders under their umbrella have done grave damage. But that's another discussion.

 

~ Gloria

[GentleLake]

Personally, I won't give AKC a dime in any form. They do not preserve and promote the true working border collie and in fact, breeders under their umbrella have done grave damage.

 

I couldn't have said this any better.

 

When I had one of my dogs certified as a therapy dog, I could have gotten the AKC's CGC title on him for an additional $5 I think it was (May have been $10, but I think it was $5) because all the components of the test were included in the therapy dog evaluation and the evaluator was also a CGC evaluator.

 

Everyone else testing that day who didn't already have a CGC on their dogs opted to also get the CGC, though, much to their surprise, I refused to give the AKC one red cent for their title. Heck, I wouldn't have taken it if they'd have offered it to me free.