deadlywarbler Posted January 7, 2014 Report Share Posted January 7, 2014 This is my first post on the boards here, but I have been following frequently. I brought home an 8-week border collie a couple weeks back (put deposit on her a few months ago) Since putting a deposit on her, life has begun to get quite busy with work and finding out that I will be attending graduate school and I've begun to doubt my ability to provide the environment I had hoped for this brilliant pup. I recently found myself trying to figure just how much i can crate her during the day to get what I need to get done, but it often feels like all day (with visits to let her out, of course) This is the exact scenario I hoped to avoid for such a great dog that will require so much attention, stimulation and exercise. I am so conflicted over what this might mean for this puppy. Her needs are such a high priority for me. Have other owners come upon this situation? How were you able to remedy it? I have done such extensive research on the breed, which is why I have so much worry. The worst thing I could imagine would be to bring her up in an environment that didn't foster her abilities, which even at 10-weeks she is displaying so brilliantly. I'm literally tearing up inside. I would love to hear people's insight and experience. Thank you! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GentleLake Posted January 7, 2014 Report Share Posted January 7, 2014 Are there other ways you could provide for more stimulation and free time for her, such as putting her in a doggy day care, even for half a day, while you're at school? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Camden's Mom Posted January 7, 2014 Report Share Posted January 7, 2014 One thing you have on your side is that young puppies need a LOT of sleep. I work from home, but still crated my puppy often throughout the day to allow to him to rest and "turn off" (and to give myself time to actually get some work done). I also thought it was a good idea for him to have those stretches of time away from me as I've heard that can help avoid the development of separation anxiety (something I read... no idea if it's true). Could you give us a more precise idea of your schedule? How many hours a day would she have to be crated and for how many hours at a time? How long are the breaks when you can come home and engage with her, and how often? People's definition of what is or is not an appropriate amount of time to crate a puppy can vary, so any details here might help! I wouldn't despair just yet!! Doggy Day Car, as GentleLake suggested, would tire her out and be great socialization for her at such a young age! You could also hire a dog walker or enlist the help of friends and family to take her for a walk and play with her throughout the day. There's a lot to be said about how you take advantage of the her time outside of the crate. If she is getting plenty of attention (play, exercise, training, etc.) when she's out of the crate she should be OK resting in it for a few hours at a time, IMO. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G. Festerling Posted January 7, 2014 Report Share Posted January 7, 2014 I have found that I am rarely truly too busy. My schedule is very unpredictable however. When crunch time comes, I find it boils down to choices. After work the choices maybe reading a book or playing with puppy. Or going out or playing with puppy. Seeing a movie or playing with puppy. And I make those choices every day. Not always in her favor either. Having said that though, I recently have found myself letting go of some "older" beliefs. This has made it much easier for me to fit in many, many small session during the day. 5-10 minutes of playtraining. This is so fun for both of us that the choice is easy. I expect more yet stress much less. Funny how that goes. So yeah, maybe you won't have the time. But maybe it is just about structuring your interactions different. I do crate as well. For them as much as me. I do think it is about being honest with yourself though. Is she important enough to you to make some, at times less convenient choices or not. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G. Festerling Posted January 7, 2014 Report Share Posted January 7, 2014 And to add, they also do get just hangout and playtime. On top of the training. That time is in a safe environment where I don't have to be 100% present. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alchemist Posted January 7, 2014 Report Share Posted January 7, 2014 A lot of the graduate students at my university bring their dogs to their offices (as do I). As long as they're well-behaved, no one minds. It's easy to steal a few minutes here and there for a spot of training or a chance to go pee. And the socialization opportunities are great. My dogs now get regular invitations to social events for undergraduate students (most of whom miss their own dogs). JMHO, but I wouldn't leave a young puppy at a doggy day care. I think it's easy for a pup to get overwhelmed (or even hurt) by boisterous older dogs. I looked into one once and the one near my office wouldn't allow you to drop a dog off unless it was (a) at least six months old; and ( neutered. I ended up using a dog walker for those days when I'm out of town all day. I think ultimately you'll have to make the call as to whether you're too busy for a pup. If you're too busy to sign it up for an evening obedience course, train it once or twice a day for five minutes at a time, and let it out to pee and poop (what's the rule, no more than one hour at a time in a crate per month of age?), then yes, you might be too busy for a pup right now. On the other hand, if you're worried that a Border collie requires four hours of exercise every day - that's a myth that's actually harmful to a pup. Good luck with your decision - and with the new challenges facing you! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GentleLake Posted January 7, 2014 Report Share Posted January 7, 2014 JMHO, but I wouldn't leave a young puppy at a doggy day care. I think it's easy for a pup to get overwhelmed (or even hurt) by boisterous older dogs. I should have been more specif in my post. I agree that not all doggy day cares would be suitable for a puppy. But some have segregated areas for puppies and/or small dogs where they wouldn't be in a general population of older, rowdy dogs. If a doggy day care didn't offer this, then, no, I wouldn't recommend it. And I'd never recommend a pediatric spay/neuter just for the opportunity to go to day care. Actually, I wouldn't recommend it at all. Definitely, if you have an office at school, explore the possibility that you might be able to take the puppy with you. And you might be able to find friends who'd be more than happy to help you raise this pup to an age where she can spend longer periods of time at home alone. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deadlywarbler Posted January 7, 2014 Author Report Share Posted January 7, 2014 What great advice, I'm really glad I posted. What I am doing now is scheduling myself to be able to come home every two hours to let her out (if I have a day where I have to crate her a lot) She seems to be getting the routine and doesn't fuss much. I'm mainly just training her to understand her routine and boundaries right now, not so much on the exercise end. I just give her activities that burn up that puppy energy. Thank you all for the helpful advice. It will require a lot of effort to keep her happy while being around a household rather than our working on a farm, but then it was always going to be a lot of work anyway! I will look into bringing her to the office at school to see if she does well there. There is a lot of anxiety and worry that comes with wanting to take a great breed and make a great dog! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maralynn Posted January 7, 2014 Report Share Posted January 7, 2014 I take my dogs along to school and crate them in the car then get them out to play/train on breaks. Not sure if this is an option for you but it has worked great for me at my semi rural college in MI. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alchemist Posted January 7, 2014 Report Share Posted January 7, 2014 Just remember, Border collies need mental stimulation far more than physical exercise (especially as puppies). But even that you should keep in balance. I think giving a pup constant attention runs the risk of creating a monster that seeks attention constantly. Nothing wrong with crating periodically to instill the ability to "chill out". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D'Elle Posted January 8, 2014 Report Share Posted January 8, 2014 Having said that though, I recently have found myself letting go of some "older" beliefs. This has made it much easier for me to fit in many, many small session during the day. 5-10 minutes of playtraining. This is so fun for both of us that the choice is easy. I expect more yet stress much less. Funny how that goes. So yeah, maybe you won't have the time. But maybe it is just about structuring your interactions different. I will second what others have said above, especially this quote. sometimes quality is more important than quantity of time, and if you can take 5 minute breaks from what you are doing to have a little play/train session with the pup that may be well enough. When I got Jester, (who, mind you, was two and not a puppy) I lived in Los Angeles in one room with no yard. How ridiculous to get a young energetic border collie. But I needed one; couldn't go on without one. And the rescue trusted me enough to let me adopt him. I simply dedicated myself to making sure he got enough attention and exercise, despite my working 8 to 10 hours a day, during which time he was crated. It took effort on my part, sure, but I managed it and he turned out well. :-) You can do it.........you have come to a great place for help, suggestions, and support. Welcome. And stick around.....you will probably learn a lot. I sure have. Show us photos, please. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deadlywarbler Posted January 8, 2014 Author Report Share Posted January 8, 2014 Thanks everyone for the supportive words! It makes a huge difference to get support from those who have gone through raising a BC pup. She's really a great dog, but as expected a brilliant animal can bring out all kinds of insecurities in yourself. I am working to stay consistent and positive with her as she learns her way around her new life! Here's a couple shots of the girl. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G. Festerling Posted January 8, 2014 Report Share Posted January 8, 2014 She looks like a little stuffed animal. Very cute. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GentleLake Posted January 8, 2014 Report Share Posted January 8, 2014 She's as cute as cute can be!! I hope the 2 of you will have wonderful lives together. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mdaniels Posted January 8, 2014 Report Share Posted January 8, 2014 I want to agree with everything and add something as well. I knew when I adopted my border collie, I would need to dedicate some time to exercise and stimulate him. He gets a lot of exercise and we have a lot of fun. But I have discovered that sometimes his exercise is as much fun for me if not more than it is for him. It doesn't take a lot of time to give him what he needs, and allows us to have 10 to 15 minutes spurts of bonding, at the minimum. Really, what he wants to do, is be with me. So wearing him out is one good thing to do, but being with him is also important for both of us. Even if it's in small periods. Good luck! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NJSwede Posted January 9, 2014 Report Share Posted January 9, 2014 More on the same note: When we fostered and eventually adopted Seana, I was preparing myself for hell on four legs after all the horror-stories I've heard about Border Collies destroying homes and driving their owners to mental illness and an early grave. But here I am a few months later, still alive to tell you my story. In terms of physical exercise, she's really not challenging at all: A one mile walk in the morning and another in the afternoon/evening. Sometimes we even skip the second one, but she gets it most of the time. In terms of mental exercise, all I have to do is to listen do her. When she's bored, she'll let us know by tap-dancing around us and pawing. Most of the time, we stimulate her with some training. I always start with a few sit/down/stay/come and continue on to tricks. We're working on teaching her the names of her toys and she REALLY enjoys that. Each training session lasts for about 15 minutes or until she loses focus, whichever comes first. Whenever we don't have time for or don't feel like training her, we encourage the kids to play with her. They do tug of war, hide-and-seek and similar games and they do a pretty good job of running down her batteries and burning off that excess energy.The rest of the time she sleeps or just hangs out with us. She gets a herding lesson every week (which seems to burn off a lot of energy). We adopted a 2 yo and you have a puppy, so things are a bit different. But the common theme here seems to be that if you give your dog small portions of mental exercise and a moderate amount of physical exercise, they seem to be just fine. YMMV... And, oh... I've never been a big fan of crating dogs (mostly because of the culture I grew up in), but we recently got a crate we use mainly for transportation and our dogs are literally fighting over who gets to sleep in it, so it can't be that horrible... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zorro13 Posted January 9, 2014 Report Share Posted January 9, 2014 Thanks for posting this and all the replies. I'm currently raising a pup with a very unpredictable schedule as well and have been a bit worried that it might negatively affect him. I travel 3-4 days at a time a couple times a month and have my roommate and friends take care of him. When I'm not traveling I work really short days so he gets spurts of spending a ton time with me and then short periods where he doesn't see me very often. Glad to see that others have been through similar situation and made it through successfully. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G. Festerling Posted January 9, 2014 Report Share Posted January 9, 2014 The beauty of the dogs is that they adjust. I think they worry much less about it than another person would. Yes, they need and want their time. But they do take it when they can get it. At least around here. And I am more than blessed to be able to work from home and spend quite a bit of time with them. But often it is just hanging out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deadlywarbler Posted January 9, 2014 Author Report Share Posted January 9, 2014 Thanks again, everyone! She seems to be adjusting to the crate well. She barely wines, which I take as a good sign. Yesterday she had to put up with three 2 hour crate sessions, but had a nice stimulating play session following each. She seems to be genuinely happy about that. Hearing everyone's stories actually helps with MY anxiety about her being crated when I have busy days. Oh, and yes, she is VERY cute except when she is relentlessly trying to get up on the furniture. I have been doing basic obedience training things like trying to get a quick down and stay, sit and stay, walk at my heel, sit at heel and come when called when I can. Being 10-weeks old, can you recommend any other fun tricks she can work on. I like the idea of teaching her the names of toys. I think she'd pick up that pretty quick. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gcv-border Posted January 9, 2014 Report Share Posted January 9, 2014 Re: trying to get on the furniture Are you on the furniture when she tries? If so, she just wants to be with you. I found that if I sat on the floor and played with my pup, he began to understand the difference between playtime (on the floor) and boring time (on the furniture). Of course, he did try the couch a few times for naps, and he was told to remove himself. I just don't want the dog hair on the couch. OTOH, I have been dropping hints to DH that we should buy a cheap/second-hand loveseat just for the dogs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kat3cats Posted January 28, 2014 Report Share Posted January 28, 2014 I love reading these posts! After our visit to the vet yesterday I started second-guessing myself BIG time. Y'all know the spiel, about how these are working dogs and how it's cruel to try to turn them into house dogs, hours of exercise and mental stimulation, horror, horror, fear, etc. I'm trying to find that fine line between happy puppy and exercise-aholic! And as far as "on the furniture) we don't want Jack on our furniture either- I don't want to fight to sit on my couch. We have a cushion for his crate, and a cot on order for when we start mat/place work. I AM thinking seriously of signing Jack and I up for classes at pet-smart or something. The only other place around here that offers classes uses those collar thingies that they "swear" doesn't shock dogs. **insert eyeroll here** Thank you for posting, everybody! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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