nancyp Posted October 13, 2013 Report Share Posted October 13, 2013 Ive been at the National Finals and noticed several different ways of managing young dogs under the tent. One woman had a puppy, 3 mos old or so, on a choke chain and just kept yanking on it even though the pup was doing lots of appeasement behavior (and not otherwise being bad that i could see). Not sure what the best strategy would be--ignore? Say something? It's just so hard to see puppies treated that way. What would you do? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nancyp Posted October 13, 2013 Author Report Share Posted October 13, 2013 Then to watch her kick at it as she is pulling on it with the choke chain and its cowering from her, what a horrible sight, hope she doesnt consider herself a handler or at all knowledgeable in dog behavior! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
airbear Posted October 13, 2013 Report Share Posted October 13, 2013 That's disgusting. I would say something to her. Maybe she is just ignorant? Hope this isn't a sheepdog handler, because we don't need people like that displaying that kind of ignorance at our premier event of the season. Poor puppy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beach BCs Posted October 13, 2013 Report Share Posted October 13, 2013 Sad. I would say something. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PSmitty Posted October 13, 2013 Report Share Posted October 13, 2013 Was it a spectator? Please tell me it wasn't a handler. Although that really makes little difference. Poor puppy! Sounds like she needs a swift kick. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gcv-border Posted October 13, 2013 Report Share Posted October 13, 2013 Which tent? the handler or spectator tent? I hope that someone teaches her better methods for control. Jovi Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gloria Atwater Posted October 14, 2013 Report Share Posted October 14, 2013 I'd damn sure say something. What could she do, kill and eat me? Handlers' tent or spectators'?~ Gloria Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PSmitty Posted October 14, 2013 Report Share Posted October 14, 2013 Since this is under the "handler's tent" section, I'm going to draw my own conclusions. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nancyp Posted October 14, 2013 Author Report Share Posted October 14, 2013 I have no idea who the women was, not being from the east I had never seen her , but yes she was under the handlers tent, i have to say I have never seen a Border collie handler with a choke chain on a dog, Ive seen BORDER owners with them , but this pup really was doing what it could to please her, shame shame on that person! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
roscoe11 Posted October 14, 2013 Report Share Posted October 14, 2013 That is unbelievable Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shoofly Posted October 14, 2013 Report Share Posted October 14, 2013 I missed that. Lucky for them i did. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sue R Posted October 14, 2013 Report Share Posted October 14, 2013 It's too bad that someone responsible (like Robin) didn't see it, speak up, and be able to make a difference (hopefully). I never saw any of that sort of behavior but I did see at least one dog under the handlers' tent with a prong collar and (I think) also another with a choke chain. One belonged to a handler and I don't know about the other. There were spectators, particularly earlier on, who wandered into the handlers' tent. Who knows? This does remind us, though, that there are handlers who do not respect or care for their dogs and that is a shame. The vast majority of folks I saw were caring and respectful of their dogs, understood dogs, and would not approve of this sort of behavior - too bad no one who saw it stood up for the pup. Poor thing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nancyp Posted October 14, 2013 Author Report Share Posted October 14, 2013 Yeah sue thats what i wanted to do make a scene clear across the country, after i posted this she let up on the abuse so not sure she saw this, got a heart or what! Gloria , im afraid she could probubly have eaten me! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shoofly Posted October 14, 2013 Report Share Posted October 14, 2013 I wouldn't automatically assume a prong collar or even choke chain are bad but from the way nancy describes it, the poor pup wasn't being handled fairly. I'll occasionally use a prong on a strong willed yearling who can drag me around if he chooses, but i don't abuse the dog with it. I had Devin (aka Devil dog) with his leash wrapped around his belly under the handlers' tent this past week just so i'd have some "power steering", but he wasn't being abused with it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sue R Posted October 14, 2013 Report Share Posted October 14, 2013 I'm sorry if I gave the wrong impression as I don't find prong collars abusive when used well. I was just meaning to say that I hardly saw anything but flat collars and I should simply have said just that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WildFlower Posted October 14, 2013 Report Share Posted October 14, 2013 I had Devin (aka Devil dog) with his leash wrapped around his belly under the handlers' tent this past week just so i'd have some "power steering", but he wasn't being abused with it. Robin, I have a "Devon" who is also referred to as "Devil" or "Demon" by my trainer and I on ocassion..... LOL. Must be the name. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nancyp Posted October 14, 2013 Author Report Share Posted October 14, 2013 Wasnt you for sure Robin, id mever seen this gal Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shoofly Posted October 14, 2013 Report Share Posted October 14, 2013 I wonder who it was. I'd have busted them for sure. :-) Sue - no worries! I knew what you meant, just explaining why i had my wildebeast lashed up. ;-) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gloria Atwater Posted October 17, 2013 Report Share Posted October 17, 2013 Yeah sue thats what i wanted to do make a scene clear across the country, after i posted this she let up on the abuse so not sure she saw this, got a heart or what! Gloria , im afraid she could probubly have eaten me! Lol, yeah, the getting eaten thing is a bit of a deterrent. I'm always more of a badass behind the computer than I am in person. But I'd hope I would have the gumption to say something to a person like that. Glad she eased up, whatever the reason. Maybe someone else did say something! ~ Gloria Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tea Posted October 17, 2013 Report Share Posted October 17, 2013 hum, i am a BA Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NancyO Posted October 17, 2013 Report Share Posted October 17, 2013 Hmm, didn't see it either. Actually saw very very few dogs under the tent due to the weather, who wants wet muddy puppies jumping on people. I've used my foot to sweep puppies and move them back to the side (kinda of picking them up slightly with the foot and moving them over), when teaching them to not walk in front of me and continually trip me. Kicking them no, but who knows what people are thinking about it. What is "appeasement behavior"? Robin, leash around the belly seems to be an approved method anymore, since so many agility people use it now, tho I've heard warnings about abdominal and groin injuries from the method. But then so are bungee cord type leashes. Yikes! Once you've had a dog run and hit the end of the bungee leash, and then fly back thro the air and hit you in the chest, YOU WILL NEVER EVER USE ONE AGAIN! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gcv-border Posted October 17, 2013 Report Share Posted October 17, 2013 Robin, leash around the belly seems to be an approved method anymore, since so many agility people use it now, tho I've heard warnings about abdominal and groin injuries from the method. But then so are bungee cord type leashes. Yikes! Once you've had a dog run and hit the end of the bungee leash, and then fly back thro the air and hit you in the chest, YOU WILL NEVER EVER USE ONE AGAIN! I have also seen a few handlers using the leash wrap method at agility trials without anyone thinking that they are 'bad' handlers/owners. I have never thought about the possibility of abdominal injuries, but it makes sense if the dog is too strong/reactive. Wow! I didn't know that the rebound effect of a bungee leash could result in a dog flying through the air in reverse. I have never liked the idea of bungee leashes anyway. Jovi Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gloria Atwater Posted October 18, 2013 Report Share Posted October 18, 2013 There are bungee leashes? :blink:Color my mind boggled ...~ Gloria Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GentleLake Posted October 18, 2013 Report Share Posted October 18, 2013 What is "appeasement behavior"? Things like lip licking, averting gaze, submissive urination, submissive postures, etc. that a dog will do to try to appease another dog or a person who they think feels threatening. Sometimes called calming signals, too. Whatever people call them it's dog speak for "Hey, I feel threatened and I'm begging you to stop and I'm trying to tell you I won't fight back." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smalahundur Posted October 18, 2013 Report Share Posted October 18, 2013 There are bungee leashes? :blink: Color my mind boggled ... ~ Gloria Same here, wonder what genius came up with that idea.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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