I met a BC snob....

[highway61]

...at least that's how he kinda came off to me at least

 

So I take my BC puppy and 9 yr old heeler/mix a few blocks to the school play yard that's used mostly as an off leash in the summer. And as we're passing through I see the guy and a young girl (daughter?) throwing the chuck it with three beautiful BCs. So I said to myself "this isn't something I see every day" so we gravitated toward them. The young girl immediately pets the pup and I ask the guy if all three are his. He told me a little something about all three. I can tell right away he's from UK and he asks me if my pup is a BC? I said yes and he mentioned something about long legs. And then, without me asking, he tells me "his coat is short". I wasn't sure what to say other than I told him he's supposed to be a rough coat but at only four months I'm not sure what he will develop into.

 

So I ask him if he had all three as pups and he points to one of them and says he was brought over from the UK. Says something about how he's a champion herder and won these trials or something and then says "as you can tell, he's not like to others". And he wasn't kidding, although there was no livestock to observe you could just tell this dog was special. He then went on some more about his accomplishments. Anyway, I walked away kinda feeling like he thumbed his nose at me and my BC pup that has "long legs" and a "short coat"

[Sue R]

I don't think you can tell much about a dog's ability unless you can observe it working stock. That certainly wasn't anything you could see in this situation. And neither can anyone "evaluate" your pup in a playground setting when it comes to what your pup will be like as an adult. If he was pointing out your pup's "long legs" and "short coat", it makes me wonder if he's not got KC dogs (Kennel Club) dogs rather than ISDS/working-bred dogs - although there are certainly enough working dog people with preferences for size, shape, and appearance in general. But no true working dog person will dismiss a pup or dog on appearance rather than on what it can demonstrate it can do at work. JMO.

 

And some people are just rude, no matter where they are coming from.

 

PS - There are some very top handlers in the UK and Ireland with very accomplished leggy dogs and short-coated dogs. If this guy knew anything really about working sheepdogs, he'd know that and not dismiss your pup on those superficial observances. And people with working dogs rarely call them "champions". A dog doesn't have a title, at least not in the ISDS/USBCHA world - a dog may be the National Finals Champion or Bluegrass Champion, but never a "champion herder". That sounds much more like a KC or AKC outlook. Forget about what he said and enjoy your pup.

[ArtTalKat]

I usually take no offense to those kinds of things from people. Sometimes people just like feeling superior in any way they can.

 

I was once told by a lady at the dog park that my border collies ears were not "real" border collie ears. I of course replied with "His ears fell off one day so we glued on some german Shepherd ears, thought it was better than prostetics." She was not impressed but my boyfriend and I had a great laugh from it. lol

 

Also if it helps, my BC has a pretty short, but still rough, coat as well. I think it's gorgeous

[gcv-border]

Sigh! It sounds like someone fed him a lot of B.S. and he believed it without doing his own independent research.

 

I had a somewhat similar story with someone who had a fluffy-coated (and washed) BC. Funny, though, when both my dog and the other dog chased after a ball, guess who got there first?

 

Jovi

[mum24dog]

Reminds me of the time someone told me his stumpy little show bitch with no stamina or muscle strength was "what BCs are supposed to be like".

 

I agree with Sue R, I don't recognise the term "champion herder" here in the UK, or "herder" of any kind for that matter except maybe amongst ill informed dabblers.

 

Short coated leggy working dogs are very common here in the north of England and in Scotland and no one who knew the first thing about real working dogs would comment on it in a derogatory way.

[Donald McCaig]

Dear Doggers,

 

I confess it - I'm a snob. I'm not a conformation snob; I don't care how long a dog's legs are or whether his ears stand up, nor am I a breed snob; I don't give a hoot whether a dog is a Border Collie, a Kelpie, or a Little Blue Dog: I am a work snob - I value the dog that can gather, fetch, drive, pen and sort livestock of all dispositions under all conditions when and where I want him/her to. I understand those snobs who value other working dogs: sled dogs, SAR dogs, obedience dogs, agility dogs, upland hunters, retrievers, demining dogs, protection dogs; in another life I might have worked with such dogs.

 

But I confess that I don't understand ownership snobs who believe that by paying money for a dog and OWNING it they are better than those without said dog.

 

Conspicuous consumption whether by absentee show champion dog owners or those who carry their dog's pedigree in their billfold bores me senseless. Why should I care what you have enough money to buy?

 

Those who make a clean run or earn a CD or FEMA certification or step to the post at a Novice/novice sheepdog trial - those who have put in the hours and thought and endured the humbling disappointments to learn the lessons their dog can teach them; when they talk, I listen.

 

Donald McCaig

[Sue R]

Well said, Donald.

[mum24dog]

Well said, Donald.

 

Ditto.

 

I'm a rescue snob too. I ask people where their dogs are from and if the answer is a breeder my first reaction is "What a shame" but I don't say it out loud.

 

But then I only need a dog to do unimportant stuff with; my income doesn't depend on it being up to the job.

[Sue R]

There are snobs of all sorts, and they all deserve to be ignored. I had the runt-of-the-litter Airedale bitch, the most willing dog I've ever known (well, other than Celt, maybe). Once a stranger asked if she was purebred and I, proud of her as I was, replied in the affirmative. The stranger said that was "too bad" and walked on. To this day, I'm not quite sure what she meant but it certainly wasn't complimentary.

 

When we moved to WV, our daughter met another young woman her age and as they exchanged information about each other, Lisa volunteered that we had a Border Collie/Aussie cross, a non-papered farm-bred Aussie pup (her brother's pup), and a stray German Shepherd bitch we'd taken in. And the new acquaintance turned up her nose to say that her family had a "pedigreed" dog. You can be that potential friendship went right down the tubes with an attitude like that (and it wasn't only that way about pets). Too bad that "pedigreed" dog probably came from a backyard breeder...

 

I have been guilty of being a Border Collie snob in my own way (although I try to keep my mouth shut about it) so I know I shouldn't talk...but I know whereof I speak!

[maggiesmommy]

Well said, Donald. The dog park here is Snob Central and it makes me gag. I can be impressed by a well-bred dog and I'll congratulate anyone with an exceptional working dog of any breed, but what impresses me more than anything is responsible owners with happy pets.

[highway61]

I agree with Sue R, I don't recognise the term "champion herder" here in the UK, or "herder" of any kind for that matter except maybe amongst ill informed dabblers.

I admit I can't remember the exact language he used. This of course is really no big deal but when at first seeing them I was somewhat in awe (from distance) that someone was in the same play field with three BCs that were chasing the ball, having fun. So I thought I'd go over and have a good conversation with the guy given the dogs we have in common. But instead I walked away feeling a little like the guy who ties to pass off his little mongrel for a pedigree

[Maja]

I had once and exchange with a mailman who saw my dogs and asked what breed they were, and I said they are border collies.

He answered:

- I have a collie too, only yours are a mix.

 

Now I have two BC rough black and white and one smooth, tricolored. Try and explain to people these are one and the same breed.

 

Concerning snobs, I find it very annoying when people write as a motto or have stickers "If' it's not a border collie, it's just a dog". What the blazes is "just a dog"?

 

Maja

[maggiesmommy]

Have any of you guys met people who are breed snobs but don't even know the name of the breed they have?

At the dog park, I once asked a guy if his dog was a Staffordshire terrier. He said, "No, she's a pit bull." Staffordshire terriers are a type of pit bull.

A woman who lives near me recently bought a rough collie pup and when I was commenting on what a lovely breed they are, she said, "No, he's not a rough collie, he's just a regular collie. Like Lassie." *blink*

I mean, really, if you're going to go to the trouble of getting a purebred, know what you've got!!

And there's no such thing as "just a dog." All dogs are wonderful.

[TEC]

I train and work an unregistered border collie, and proud of her. I think she is at-ease about it, too . Josie plays and romps with all courteous dogs. She hasn't read a written breed standard, nor evidently have the sheep.

 

"I said yes and he mentioned something about long legs. And then, without me asking, he tells me 'his coat is short'. I wasn't sure what to say other than I told him he's supposed to be a rough coat but at only four months I'm not sure what he will develop into."

 

Like you said, most puppies I have seen have short coats, and are all legs and ears. They grow. Some folks are just full of themselves. Those owners and their dogs should be required to wear warning labels. Wait, I don't mean to stereotype a good dog based on the owner's personality. -- TEC

[highway61]

 

 

I mean, really, if you're going to go to the trouble of getting a purebred, know what you've got!!

 

 

 

Unless that breed is a Border Collie. Really not much to know about them....

[G. Festerling]

I ran across a little girl carrying a Dachshund pup. Girl about six and the pup was maybe 4 months. So I asked her "what a cool puppy! Is it a little Dachshund?" She looked at me like I was stupid and said in a quite offended tone, "no, it is a Wienerdog!"

[maggiesmommy]

I ran across a little girl carrying a Dachshund pup. Girl about six and the pup was maybe 4 months. So I asked her "what a cool puppy! Is it a little Dachshund?" She looked at me like I was stupid and said in a quite offended tone, "no, it is a Wienerdog!"

 

LOL!!!

[Syncrope]

I'm always surprised by how many people I meet who apparently owned border collies are so stumped by my dog. I mean, mine isn't even a merle or anything, she's pretty much a traditionally-colored border collie, and I still get the Australian Shepherd discussion more than anything else. Or, they'll say "she looks like a terrier, her hair looks so wiry and she's so small" or, "oh, she's OBVIOUSLY a mix, her legs are too long" (even though another littermate was proven to be 100% by other adopters test), or "what's with the hair on her cheeks? it sticks out so much!" You would think people who owned border collies would understand how much variation there is! According to the lady who told me she was a terrier, the fact that she wasn't the size of a freaking Irish Wolfhound meant that she wasn't a full border collie, like *HER* dog was. Or, even the fact that she's a tricolor, it means she can not possibly no way no how in any universe ever EVER be a purebred border collie. Some lady thought she was so friendly that she couldn't be a border collie, because border collies are supposed to be shy and timid?! Wtf?! I wouldn't care if she's a mix or not (I was almost disappointed to hear that she wasn't!) but honestly, I think I know my dog better than some random stranger on the street!

 

You get this stuff a lot. Nobody's dog is safe... Everyone thinks they're the expert, and don't you dare tell them otherwise!

[Syncrope]

I'm always surprised by how many people I meet who apparently owned border collies are so stumped by my dog. I mean, mine isn't even a merle or anything, she's pretty much a traditionally-colored border collie, and I still get the Australian Shepherd discussion more than anything else. Or, they'll say "she looks like a terrier, her hair looks so wiry and she's so small" or, "oh, she's OBVIOUSLY a mix, her legs are too long" (even though another littermate was proven to be 100% by other adopters test), or "what's with the hair on her cheeks? it sticks out so much!" You would think people who owned border collies would understand how much variation there is! According to the lady who told me she was a terrier, the fact that she wasn't the size of a freaking Irish Wolfhound meant that she wasn't a full border collie, like *HER* dog was. Or, even the fact that she's a tricolor, it means she can not possibly no way no how in any universe ever EVER be a purebred border collie. Some lady thought she was so friendly that she couldn't be a border collie, because border collies are supposed to be shy and timid?! Wtf?! And one old guy thought she was a COYOTE. Hm... I wouldn't care if she's a mix or not (I was almost disappointed to hear that she wasn't!) but honestly, I think I know my dog better than some random stranger on the street! I won't even get started on all the older folks who think my dog is underweight and "all bones" because, y'know, she isn't carrying a barrel of lard around her waist!

 

You get this stuff a lot. Nobody's dog is safe... Everyone thinks they're the expert, and don't you dare tell them otherwise!

[Syncrope]

Woops sorry, somehow I accidentally quoted my post when my internet blipped and I tried to repost it! Sorry again for triple post, yikes!

[Aidan]

I meet Border Collie snobs all the time here. The funny thing is they do not now or never have owned a Border Collie. The Border Collie owners that I have met almost all seem to know that Border Collies do come in different sizes, colors and coat length. Someday I am sure I will meet a Border Collie snob with a Border Collie.... so far I have been very lucky.

[Sue R]

Your post makes me laugh because I have be "accosted" twice by people who insisted that my dogs (which are purebred, working-bred dogs) that my dogs *must be crosses*. The woman who did so at the pet food store was insistent, in spite of my telling her otherwise - her opening remark was, "What other than Border Collie are your dogs crossed with?" She would not only believe what I (their owner) said, but also would not believe what the store owner (a Border Collie fan and owner of more than one rescue dog that was part Border Collie) said, which was the same thing. And the store owner also pointed out that they were working-bred and that working-bred dogs did not all look the same or look like the show dogs. But, no matter what, that person who did not know my dogs or where they came from, knew better than their owner or the pet food store owner did.

 

The second was a man who insisted that the youthful Celt was "part greyhound" because a Border Collie did not have longer legs or such a sparse coat (he's a medium rough coat with plenty of guard hairs but a thankfully not abundant undercoat). He, too, knew more than I did even though Celt had been my dog since 7 weeks of age and I had met his mother and father both.

 

Isn't it interesting how perfect strangers who have never had a Border Collie know so much more about your dog and his background than you do? Well, those folks and the ones who have only known show-bred dogs or watched Westminster...

[highway61]

Isn't it interesting how perfect strangers who have never had a Border Collie know so much more about your dog and his background than you do? Well, those folks and the ones who have only known show-bred dogs or watched Westminster...

 

And their response if told, I'm quite certain would be "yeah...so....what's your point?"

[Aidan]

Sue R, on 05 Aug 2013 - 13:32, said:

Isn't it interesting how perfect strangers who have never had a Border Collie know so much more about your dog and his background than you do?

At first I tried to explain and reason with them about the Border Collies individual differences. Now I just tune them out and as soon I can walk away. They are really not worth the time or the effort.

 

Also our Aidan sounds like your Celt... he has the "longer legs" and a "medium rough coat". He also has been called a "part greyhound" in a nice way at a 'Running of the Hounds' a local Greyhound event to support rescued retired racing Greyhounds. At their annual event they set-up a short sprint course of about 25 yards for the dogs to run in. The fastest on the course was a Greyhound at 27 mph.... Aidan was not that far behind at 22 mph. He was then also accused of being a Greyhound wearing a Border Collie coat.

[maggiesmommy]

I got my BC originally thinking she was a mix, so I'm definitely not surprised when other people make the same mistake. What I don't get is why any of them seem to care. Does it somehow personally offend you that I call my dog a BC? Even if she WAS a mutt, is it doing any harm if I choose to identify her by the breed whose traits she predominantly shows?

I don't tell people with clumsy and dumb AKC "border collies" that they don't have real border collies. I think Barbie collie types should do us the same favor and just ignore it if they see a BC that doesn't meet the criteria they think should be established for the breed.