The crazy story about how my "mutt" turned out to be a champion purebred

[maggiesmommy]

First, I'd like to introduce myself as a lifelong border collie fan. My dad owned a farm when I was a kid and raised working border collies, who I adored. I was on the look out for a border collie or BC mix when my sweetheart showed up at the shelter where I volunteer.

She was being surrendered by owners who had clearly neglected her. She was about five months old and most of her fur had fallen out. She was covered in fleas and rail-thin. Of course, I fell head-over-heels in love with her and decided to adopt her.

I knew that working BCs don't always look like the "normal" BCs that are bred as companions or show dogs, but I still would have never guessed that my sweetie was a purebred, especially since her original owners didn't seem to care enough about her to indicate that they were the types of people who would go to the trouble of buying a purebred. The vet, shelter staff, and other volunteers guessed that she was a BC-corgi, a BC-GSD, a BC-husky, but nobody guessed purebred BC.

Anyway, my dad came to visit a few weeks ago and met my doggie for the first time and, as a former BC owner/handler, he kept watching her behavior and told me that she was definitely a purebred.

Well, I looked around and I found only one kennel in my area where working border collies are bred. The front page of ther website showed a BC female who looked almost exactly like my dog. I emailed the owner of the kennel with a photo of my pup and asked if she'd sold any around the same time that my dog would have been born. She said she was almost certain that my dog came from her kennel and was the only female of a litter born last October (which was my pup's estimated birth date based on vet estimates). She had been sold for $1,200 at 12 weeks old, just about two months before her owners abandoned her. The breeder sent me photos of her mother and father (whom she closey resembles) and of her as a puppy (exact same markings) so I'm almost sure she's the same dog! Her father's an agility champion and her mom's a champion herder.

I thought the whole thing was pretty crazy! It just goes to show that even shelter "mutts" are often much more than meets the eye.

[Gideon's girl]

We often got purebred dogs at our shelter. People would rather throw them away than admit to the breeder that they made a mistake getting the dog in the first place. Of course we get 10 pitties for every 1 of another breed.

[maggiesmommy]

I see a lot of purebred pits and toy breeds at our shelter, but I wouldn't have expected someone who specifically got an expensive, working-stock BC to surrender her. Most people who surrender purebreds are the kinds who buy from pet stores and backyard breeders.

[GentleLake]

 

 

I knew that working BCs don't always look like the "normal" BCs that are bred as companions or show dogs,

 

 

Working BCs are the normal ones! The ones bred for show, for colors, or for dog sports such as agility (i.e. the AKC dogs) are the ones that aren't true BCs.

 

So happy you found this gal and are giving her the love and care she deserves. You rock!

 

Oh, and she's gorgeous!

[maggiesmommy]

Agreed... We do definitely need to reclaim what a "normal" border collie is! And thank you for complimenting by baby.

[PSmitty]

Purebred border collies from all kinds of sources end up in shelters. All the time. And while it is unusual to find out a rescue's origins, it's not unusual for them to be more than meets the eye. Congrats on adopting your cute girl.

[Donald McCaig]

Dear Doggers,

 

". . .$1,200 at 12 weeks old."

 

?

 

Donald McCaig

[Gideon's girl]

Show dog prices.

[PSmitty]

Sport dog prices, too.

[mum24dog]

Sport dog prices, too.

 

I guess so. The photo doesn't look like a show bred dog.

 

Strange (but not impossible) that someone should pay that much for a working bred dog then ill treat it so badly over such a short time and then surrender it to a shelter.

 

I wonder if the breeder has checked with the buyers whether they still have the dog.

 

Also from the above photo she doesn't look to have particularly distinctive markings to identify her there may be some hidden though. Our Kye apparently has dopplegangers all over the place.

[maggiesmommy]

I think the high price is because her mom and dad were both very well-recognized as excellent working and agility dogs. The breeder ONLY breeders working/sporting BCs, not show BCs, and doesn't AKC register.

She said she had contacted the buyers at the phone number they had given her and the number no longer belongs to them.

One thing that helped me ID her is that I'd noticed shortly after adopting her that her dew claws had been removed. The breeder does that with her pups before selling them. It's not a distinct ID mark, but dewclawing isn't normally something that someone one have done for a non-working non-purebred.

[maggiesmommy]

I almost wonder if they could have had some kind of family emergency, like a serious illness or death in the family. It was so easy to think that they were just bad people when they brought her to the shelter in such bad condition, but I wonder, given the fact that they paid so much and then mistreated her so quickly, if it was an issue of suddenly being unable to care for her.

[bcnewe2]

Working dogs don't normally cost that much unless they are started. Removing dew claws is not something working dog folk do either.

You got a really nice dog. That is what i'd concentrate on. Her past is just that, her past. Its her future that is the important thing! Enjoy your dog!

[Sue R]

A farmer in VA bought a very well-bred pup from a person whose name just anyone in the working sheepdog world would recognize. He probably paid what would have been top dollar for a working-bred pup (not overpriced, but not run-of-the-mill pricing, either). At six months of age for the pup, the farmer turned him out into a field with a flock of sheep and said to go get them. The six-month old pup did not execute a lovely outrun, lift, and fetch (and who would have expected that of any pup of that age on its first exposure in an open field with undogged sheep?). The farmer took him directly to a kill shelter and dumped him. Fortunately, a knowledgeable rescue got him from the shelter and found a suitable home.

 

The world is full of all kinds. We can say "generally" or "usually" but it's hard to say "never" or "always" with really risking being incorrect.

[mum24dog]

You got a really nice dog. That is what i'd concentrate on. Her past is just that, her past. Its her future that is the important thing! Enjoy your dog!

Good advice.

 

If the OP had been planning to buy the pup from the breeder lots of people would be waving red flags.

 

I know people with real working dogs who would be prepared to use them at stud to a sport bitch if the price were right, but I find it hard to believe that an outstanding working bitch would be put to a sport stud - bitch out of action for a while and little or no chance of getting any really good workers out of the litter (but as Sue R says, we can never say never - there's money in it.)

 

On the face of it I'd take this breeder's claims of working ability with a pinch of salt.

 

We all like to think our dogs are special in some way but what is most important is how they fit into our own lives.

[maggiesmommy]

We all like to think our dogs are special in some way but what is most important is how they fit into our own lives.

 

Absolutely. I don't expect her to be magnificent in some way, and I agree that there are some red flags as far as this breeder goes. I was just surprised that the dog I thought was a mutt was a purebred at all, and especially one that was (however unreasonably) sold for so much money.

[Tommy Coyote]

Lucky you. And a really lucky dog.

 

Sounds like you two are just made for each other.

 

What a wonderful ending.

[Pam Wolf]

working/sporting BC's ? Oxymoron?

[maggiesmommy]

working/sporting BC's ? Oxymoron?

 

She breeds for both agility and herding. I guess from the same lines. I don't really know though.

[Pam Wolf]

You cannot serve two masters. You either breed for work or breed for other things.

[maggiesmommy]

You cannot serve two masters. You either breed for work or breed for other things.

 

She seems to be trying to breed all-around "perfect" BCs. It looks like most of her stock is bred and trained for agility but she got my dog's dam from a breeder/trainer who exclusively raises working dogs and she seems to be integrating working dogs into her training and stock.

 

I'm not saying she's doing it right, and I'm not saying I would buy from her. I didn't know that much about BC breeding (except what I knew from my dad raising herders when I was a kid) but I can see where the breeder's getting it wrong.

[bcnewe2]

Do a bit more research and you will see why putting a working dog in her breeding program does not make working dogs. Working dogs are about as perfect as you will get, adding anything else just muddies the waters.

 

But again, enjoy what you have and don't look back!

[maggiesmommy]

Do a bit more research and you will see why putting a working dog in her breeding program does not make working dogs. Working dogs are about as perfect as you will get, adding anything else just muddies the waters.

 

But again, enjoy what you have and don't look back!

 

I can see that, definitely. Since I rescued her thinking she wasn't a "real" BC at all (and would be perfectly content if she was a mutt) I'm happy with her exactly the way she is, even if her original breeder might be a little clueless.

[bcnewe2]

Unfortunately I wouldn't call it clueless I'd call it dangerous. She is passing on to new people information that goes against what we are trying to preserve in our wonderful breed. That, can come off to new people to this breed as if she knows what she is talking about.

 

But that's just my opinion.

[maggiesmommy]

She does definitely seem like she knows what she's talking about, and I can see how that's dangerous. I know that the overwhelming opinion here is that real BCs are bred to work livestock, and anything else is polluting the breed. The fact that she's spent most of her time breeding for agility is already kind of problematic now that I'm learning more about the breed, but crossing working and sporting lines without knowing what her ultimate goal is seems problematic.

I think the reason she was able to sell these pups for so much money is that their dam-- if not an excellent herder herself, as the breeder claimed-- came from a very well-established working line. (Her dam came from here and was started here: http://tennesseebordercollies.com/ and they seem legit)-- and her sire is an agility champ bred and raised on site. I guess the breeder thought that if she crossed the best herding-line dog she could get with the best agility dog she already owned, the pups would sell like hot cakes, and from what I can tell, that's exactly what happened. The idea must have been "best herder + best agility = dog I can sell as a perfect BC for any purpose." And, again, the original owners who surrendered her had expressed intent to use her as a herder, so they clearly didn't know better, either!

Based on her behavior and agility, I do think (and my dad thinks, based on his experience handling BCs and sheep) that she would be an excellent herder.

I would link you guys to the breeder's website but I don't want her to get too many angry emails. I do think I'll link her to this discussion since I've still got an open conversation with her. The criticism might be a bit much, especially since I didn't actually buy from her so I'm not in a position to criticize, but I hope that seeing this discussion might lead her to rethink some of her policies. Or she might register on the forums and join the discussion.