puppy rebellion

[ramsespapa]

Ramses,my 8 month old male and i are bonding well. At least most of the time. He recalls wonderfully for days at a time . But occasionally absolutley refuses. He never runs out of earshot or disappears. He will always come to line of sight or within 10 feet or so. I'm wondering if its lack of respect for me or just occasional ,rambunctiousness. Ramses is never scolded for being hard to get back,and i rarely go to get him. He's always made to come to me,unlessnear the road. Any help or input is appreciated.

[waffles]

It is not lack of respect. It is lack of training. He is 8 months old, of course his recall isn't 'perfect' -always remember there is no such thing as 100% recall. For a very solid recall though, you want to only call him when you know that he will come. Every time you call him and he does not listen, the less meaning the recall has. If you don't think with certainty that he will come, don't use his recall. It takes practice and more practice to get it down. When you do call him, make it amazing-I use beef liver I cook in the oven to dry it out as treats. He gets a handful and I scream, jump up and down, fall on the ground, pretty much through a party. He only gets beef liver when doing recalls and then I release him back to whatever he was doing. Even after 2 years together we still practice every so often because it can never be 'too good' plus it is just fun to practice! I personally only use Levi's recall (we use "here") when I really need to use it, which is rare. He is off leash all the time (except for leashed walks on the road) and we use other commands to communicate his directions if we need to and use his recall if we need him to "come now, right to me, this very second". So you may want to use one word for casual 'come to me' and one word as an emergency recall.

 

Also, if he does not listen, you go get him. Don't let him ignore you. Hence, the less meaningful it will be if he gets to blow you off. If he does not listen, you go get him and put him back on leash. Don't yell or do it out of anger. Just do it to make it clear that you will follow through on your commands (you being you, not the dog).

[gcv-border]

Pretty much what waffles said.^^^ Practice with awesome treats, or a toy reward, or running away, thus setting up his chase instinct, or running away while you wave a toy around to get your dog really aroused. Whatever you can do to make yourself the most interesting thing in his environment at that moment helps build his desire to come to you.

 

Also, is this a recurring problem? or one that seems to have cropped up recently? At 8 months old, he may be in his 'terrible teens' so you may want to take a step back and work more on fundamentals.

 

Jovi

[olivehill]

Is there an underlying theme to when he does this? Maybe he's not been out for very long? Or it's when you're recalling him off something interesting? For instance, I know if my pup of about the same age is in a certain area of the property where there's interesting things to sniff, he'll blow off my recall. So I either head him off before he goes there or if I happen to miss it and he goes over there I won't use his recall, I either walk over and get him or I'll just hollar to get his attention and then invite him to do something else instead; "Hey! Lets go for a walk." or "Hey! Wanna biscuit?" or the catch all command of "C'mon!" as in "C'mon! Hurry up and go through the door, it's cold." or "C'mon, I want you by this gate not that one." or "C'mon! We're going to go do chores now." or "Well, C'mon, then get up here and cuddle before your face freezes like that ya little beggar." or ... well you get the idea, C'mon for him means, I want something of him and he's got to be close to me to figure out what the context is this time. ;)/>

 

If there's no theme so you can predict when it's going to happen and work around I think I'd put him back on the long line until his recall firms up -- or maybe even if there is a theme. Maybe my expectations are too high, but at that age I'd expect him to forget his commands in high stimulus environments or under pressure, but would consider blowing off commands at home every few days with no consistent trigger a more significant hole in the training and/or rebellion that needs to be nipped in the bud. (Though honestly, I suspect there IS a trigger even if you can't think of what it might be right now... there pretty much always is.)

 

I'd also second the treats and the recalling him just to let him go back to his business. Part of it may very well be that he's learned recall means the end of his fun time and he' just resisting because of it.

[ramsespapa]

Thanks guys,i believe also that it's just a need for practice. If.we're in the field next to my shop playing frisbee he is excellent. But i guess going to the truck with me isn't as appealing as practicing with cattle,and finding deer bones.lol . Thanks for the advice.

[brady's mom]

My boy did the same exact thing at about the same age and all of the advice you're getting is wonderful!

 

Another user on here also suggested "walking him down" when he refused to come when called. It worked for me but I'm awful at explaining the steps. I'll see if I can hunt down the post.

[rushdoggie]

I posted this in another thread, maybe it will be helpful.

 

I'm a 99% non-correction trainer, but I believe there will come a time in every young dogs life when the reward for coming that he has always gotten will be overshadowed by whatever is more interesting. And, I will have to "walk the dog down."

 

Usually, I only have to do this once, especially with a fairly sensitive dog. Some dogs have to have this happen more than once.

 

They key is that she comes and is rewarded (sometimes lavishly) or you will go get her. Do not call her, have her ignore you and you let it happen. This can be a real PITA when you are busy and the damn dog is ignoring you. But, its worth it, to take the time to do it as it makes a point.

 

When I "walk him down" I try to stay calm, don't act/be angry. Keep a neutral facial expression.

 

You call, she ignores you, so get your collar and lead and walk towards the dog. When she changes direction you do as well, always going in her direction, with no emotion, walk with a determined yet leisurely pace.

 

At first your dog will think shes playing a game of keep away. Resist the urge to lunge for her when she is close. Stay calm, take your time, you are not speaking, you are just coming to get her, you are on a mission.

 

As this continues the dog gets worried and realizes it's not a game. You may worry that she's forgotten that you gave her a command. Too bad, it was her responsibility to react when you called her, and she will learn the importance of this.

 

You start to notice the dog is getting more stressed, she doesn't know how get out of this predicament. She will almost come close to you, then retreat..that's OK...the longer this takes, the better impression it will leave.

 

A successful 'catch' would be when she presents himself where you can put the collar on without grabbing him or restraining him. Always give her the opportunity to escape.

 

You called her to a specific place. Take her back to that place at a quick pace and briskly hand sit her in front of you. No yelling, no anger. You called her, she didn't come, you brought her to where you called her. SO now remove the collar and release her without saying a word. Call her again, and when she comes (and in most cases, she will) reward her as normal.

 

This works on a dog who really understands what a recall means. Be honest with yourself about how fluent she is in reality, how much you have practiced on a long line around serious distractions, etc. Also, as she goes through this stage, be careful that shes not loose unless she is in a safe (meaning fenced) area.

 

The message is clear: come when I call, or I will come get you.

[brady's mom]

^^^^^

All of this!

[Gloria Atwater]

Thanks guys,i believe also that it's just a need for practice. If.we're in the field next to my shop playing frisbee he is excellent. But i guess going to the truck with me isn't as appealing as practicing with cattle,and finding deer bones.lol . Thanks for the advice.

 

 

Oh, for goodness sakes! Lol, he's 8 months old! That's like a 10 year old kid. Which is better, staying on the playground or getting back in the truck to go back to boring old home?

 

Call him when you know he'll come. Walk him down when he doesn't. And reward him! I've used chopped up hotdog bits and cheese cubes with great effect. Just carry some in a ziploc bag in your pocket!

 

Also, make sure you call him for no reason. DON'T only call him when you're done playing. Call him, treat him, praise him to the heavens and make it wonderful. Just like everyone has said. Then let him go play again.

 

And if he really is dragging his feet about going to the truck, then cut the bother. Walk away from the truck, call him to you, reward him lavishly and give him his treat - then put the leash on.

 

Put the leash on, be happy with him, and walk him back to the truck and put him in. Once he's in - give him another treat and tell him how good he is!

 

Getting in the truck is the end of his fun, but if you catch him before he can dawdle, and leash him, you're discouraging that almost-catch thing.

 

Same goes if he refuses to come any other time. WALK. HIM. DOWN. Don't let him get away with refusing. You may have to walk quite a bit, but he'll start giving in. And while you're walking, don't scold him, don't *chase* him, don't register any negative emotion. Just be neutral. Then leash him once you get him and be happy to see him.

 

You've got lots of good advice up there. Go forth and train the puppy. It's just youth and rambunctiousness, is all. Time and miles are all you need.

Cheers ~

 

Gloria

[Liz P]

He is a teenager. If he fails to obey, he loses his off leash privileges for a few minutes and must obey commands and be polite while on leash. If he obeys on leash he can be released again, but the second he disobeys, back on the leash! Teenage humans and dogs test their boundaries. Show them that yes, the rules DO still apply and they will mature into respectful adults.

[mum24dog]

I bet many of us just knew how old the OP's dog is without looking.

Regression in training is normal at that age. Hormones are starting to kick in, boundaries tested and a young brain can't cope with everything at once. He will come out the other side of this period as long as he isn't given opportunities to practise the behaviour you don't want and keep any training you do simple.

[Sue R]

I bet many of us just knew how old the OP's dog is without looking.

Regression in training is normal at that age. Hormones are starting to kick in, boundaries tested and a young brain can't cope with everything at once. He will come out the other side of this period as long as he isn't given opportunities to practise the behaviour you don't want and keep any training you do simple.

Are we talking teenage dogs or teenage people? Sounds pretty much the same to me!

[juliepoudrier]

I have to say that "walk him down" works well for older dogs too, like my livestock guard dogs. In their case, though, sometimes it never changes (that is, I still have to walk them down sometimes, no teenager behavior as an excuse.)

 

J.

[mum24dog]

Are we talking teenage dogs or teenage people? Sounds pretty much the same to me! :lol:/>

 

Both - and I've had 4 of the latter and lived to tell the tale.