Sue R Posted June 21, 2014 Author Report Share Posted June 21, 2014 Good Luck. It sounds like Dan is well-prepared for surgery.I hope not! It's Celt that's going in for surgery! But, thank you! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gcv-border Posted June 21, 2014 Report Share Posted June 21, 2014 I hope not! It's Celt that's going in for surgery! But, thank you! Oh, crap! Sorry. It's Oldtimer's Disease. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sue R Posted June 22, 2014 Author Report Share Posted June 22, 2014 Totally understood! Thanks for being concerned for us. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G. Festerling Posted June 22, 2014 Report Share Posted June 22, 2014 Oh my....I have only read and followed quietly. Sorry to hear about the new hiccup. Best wishes and thoughts for your boy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sue R Posted June 27, 2014 Author Report Share Posted June 27, 2014 Today was our consult with the ortho surgeon, and I could tell that Celt remembered that place as he was not in character, very anxious in the waiting room. He was so anxious that I had to take him out twice - the dog that had done his "business" during his 10 minute morning walk, had to go twice again, each time the stool getting softer and more indicative of his anxious mood. Once in the exam room, he was much more relaxed. The tech took his history, and was the same tech that helped us last visit - I remembered her and she remembered us because she also has a Border Collie (which I remembered was a red one). And then I got to meet a surgeon, Dr Chisnell, who was on her last day of residency at PVSEC, who examined Celt thoroughly and expected that his ACL was completely torn, which would be confirmed during surgery. Dr Chisnell then asked if I would like the surgery done today which quite surprised me because I had understood that the surgery would most likely not happen until Dr Anderson (a vet with seven years in surgery at PVSEC) could do it on Monday. But he is Dr Chisnell's supervising vet and they both were free this afternoon. After a moment's reflection (everyone always advises to go with the most experienced vet, and she did tell me that Dr Payne, his previous surgeon, could do the surgery on Tuesday), I decided to go ahead and have her do the work today. She has done a year's internship at PVSEC and then three years' residency, and has been hired on to the surgical staff now that her residency is finishing. And she would be doing the work under another vet's supervision. I felt it best all around to do it now and not wait even a few more days. Why make an unnecessary round-trip to Pittsburgh on Monday or Tuesday? Why stress Celt any more than needed? Why stress *me* any more than needed? I liked Dr Chisnell, felt she was a good choice for the job and well-qualified, and was content with my decision. Celt, who had been drooling and fussing in the reception area, had settled down to a good nap while we talked about the procedure and expectations. She seemed quite pleased that Shari and I have been working to keep Celt as fit and trim as we could under the circumstances, and concurred that his post-surgical and rehab recovery *should* be easier and shorter with him being in better condition. He not only was 5# leaner than he weighed at his last surgery (I was tough and measured his food, checking his weight weekly at Shari's) but both his hind legs are much better muscled than they were last time, when he was so atrophied. She felt both the weight control and the increased fitness would work in his favor this go-round. At his first therapy visit after the first surgery, his thighs were 4 cm different in measurement - he's going into this surgery with them being approximately the same (as measured last week) and several centimeters bigger in circumference, indicative of better muscle mass and tone. I'll be interested to watch the progress in his thighs as he is rehabbed again. I got a bit weepy when the decision was made - I hadn't been prepared mentally for this to happen *today* but was very glad it was happening. Celt, on the other hand, walked calmly down the hallway to *the back room* with the tech and without a single glance back to me watching him. He knows the drill at the vet office... Meanwhile, I got a call around 4 pm from Dr Chisnell that the surgery was complete, had gone well, and that Celt was waking up in recovery. She commented that there was some noticeable arthritis in that joint (he's almost 12 and some of that would be expected no matter what, I think) but that he should recover well and again be the active dog he likes to be. She asked when I'd like to pick him up in the morning and I said I was planning on 9 am. She said that was great because the 9 am pickup appointment was still available (I didn't remember but they do try to schedule the pickups so everyone has plenty of time for discussion of after-care, exercise, observation of the surgical site, etc.). She did describe two changes in procedure since his first leg was done two years ago - they do the procedure with a somewhat smaller incision and they do not use staples but rather surgical glue to close the outer skin. She felt both changes contribute to less trauma, faster healing, and less irritation. I'm looking forward to comparing this to the photos I took of his first surgery. I'll be trying to run him by Shari's on the way home so she can see him. I think she might laser him if he's up to that, and then he'll be home where I can be with him most of the time for the next few days until I go back to work. Ed helped me set up the xpen/crate arrangement like we used last time so he has plenty of room to get comfortable and move about in a controlled environment. I'll be on the road before 7 am to get my boy and bring him home! Thanks to all here and elsewhere who have wished us well! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sue R Posted June 27, 2014 Author Report Share Posted June 27, 2014 Oh, gosh, I am wordy...no one is looking surprised at that! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chene Posted June 27, 2014 Report Share Posted June 27, 2014 I for one really appreciate the detail you go into (and yes, I would call it detail, not wordiness!). It not only helps make things interesting and easy to read, it'll certainly makes it more helpful for anyone going through the same thing to relate and understand better what to do and why. Other than that, just wanted to offer my support and hope that Celt's back to his old self in no time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
urge to herd Posted June 27, 2014 Report Share Posted June 27, 2014 I like the detail as well. I don't want to ever go through what you're going through, but if it happens, at least I know kinda sorta what to expect. Phew - sending quick healing thoughts for Celt, and support for you and Ed. Ruth and Agent Gibbs Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gideon's girl Posted June 28, 2014 Report Share Posted June 28, 2014 I have to agree. I appreciate the detail you put into it. I feel like I have been there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WildFlower Posted June 28, 2014 Report Share Posted June 28, 2014 Thank you Sue for documenting your and Celt's journey. Next wishes for a speedy and smooth recovery. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sue R Posted June 28, 2014 Author Report Share Posted June 28, 2014 28 June 2014 - 1 day post-surgery and his first therapy session Been there, done that, home with the dog to prove it! I picked Celt up this morning and while the vet was not in today to talk to me, one of the techs spend plenty of time with me going over his meds, his house rules, what to expect and to look for, etc. He was very anxious to be with me and to be out of that place! He was wearing a cone that I immediately took off as he was very distressed with it. I brought along a collar (thanks to Ruth "Urge to Herd" for lending me one a few years ago) that is a stiff, tube-like collar. Properly sized and adjusted, and put on correctly, it prevents the dog from bending his/her neck so it's great for keeping a dog from messing with a site like Celt's surgery, on the upper part of the hind leg, without the mental trauma of a cone. Minor changes from last time (that I was told about by the vet yesterday) were that the incision was shorter than last time and that while there are internal stitches, the external closure was glue and not staples. While glue is less irrigating than staples, it also does not allow for any drainage, so it's a trade-off. A shorter incision is a plus and we'll see how the glue does its job. I did notice less bruising inside his thigh compared to last time which was a good sign. And, with the exercise we've given him, he has noticeably better muscle mass and muscle tone on both legs, which should be a real plus for his recovery and rehab. He was quite a bit shaky on his legs at the vet hospital and I used the sling (we use that for two weeks to avoid slips or falls) to help him navigate out to the car. I had hoped he'd be a bit more secure on his feet but I think I was overly optimistic - after all, he'd had the surgery less than 24 hours beforehand. Unlike last time, when he had done all his potty business readily the evening/night following his surgery, this time he did not do either before we left but since he'd emptied out very completely before I left him there, it was not too surprising. And he was not interested in stopping to do any business as his objective was to get to the car, have me put him in, and take him home! It is not uncommon for dogs to take a while before they urinate and up to several days before they defecate, so I wasn't worried. Celt's pretty regular and I knew he would be back to normal in that department before long. PVSEC sent us home with their very conservative outline for recovery as last time. Once I got Celt into the car, he laid down with a huge sigh and slept for two hours straight as I drove us to Shari's where she was ready to take a look at him and do a laser session. He did not wake up until we pulled up at Woodlands Animal Care Center, where Shari practices, and then he tried a little "whoo-whoo" of excitement but it was pretty meager. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sue R Posted June 28, 2014 Author Report Share Posted June 28, 2014 Shari was watching for us (and doggone it, I forgot the camera) and came out to carry in my stuff and take a look at Celt and help us in. In contrast to earlier at the surgical office, he was much more stable on his feet and even using his left leg to bear some weight, which was a relief to us both. Once out of the car and in a place where he could relieve himself, he began to pee - and pee and pee and pee! He felt much better after he'd emptied himself out. Inside, he headed right to Shari's room with purpose. He knows that Shari makes him feel better, even when she makes him work (like on the treadmill). He settled in pretty readily for his laser treatment, falling so soundly asleep that he had to be woken up when it was all over and time to get up and go. He was funny as we began to walk out, leaning to my right - and then we realized that he is accustomed to a weight check after his session, and he was ready to head to the scale. We didn't bother doing that today because he'd just been weighed yesterday. At 42#, we were very pleased because we'd been monitoring his weight and I'd been strict with his food. 42# is his "goal weight" and a full 5# less than the 47# he weighed at his last surgery. Two pluses - ideal weight and better muscling - should contribute to his recovery. Shari proclaimed his incision to be very neat with hardly any swelling, and nicely glued back up. He did quite well walking out, with the casual comfortable attitude that he has after a laser session. While I was checking out, he began begging - he knew Shari has dry liver treats and we forgot to give him one, and my treats for him were in the car. So Shari trotted back into her room for a couple of treats for him, and he watched her excitedly because he knew she was going to get him a cookie. Smart boy! He took a nice nap on the trip home and I put him in his "recovery pen" once here, which was not what he wanted but which he quickly decided was a good place to take a nap - especially after Max the cat laid down just outside the pen where Celt could keep a good eye on him - when Celt managed to keep his eyes open! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
urge to herd Posted June 28, 2014 Report Share Posted June 28, 2014 Glad you got your boy home. He looks pretty settled in, especially with Max to keep him company. Ruth and Agent Gibbs Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sue R Posted June 28, 2014 Author Report Share Posted June 28, 2014 Max (and Smoky) are Celt's idea of interactive TV. He can watch and, in better days, walk around the house following the cat - if the cat isn't so lazy that he just lays around! When that happens, Celt enjoys just lying down and staring. I know it's obsessive behavior, did not realize that I should stop it when it first started and didn't know how to, but fortunately Celt is harmless to the cats and they totally ignore him. He's particularly disgusted when they strop themselves on him - ewww! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maralynn Posted June 28, 2014 Report Share Posted June 28, 2014 Glad everything went well with Celt's surgery and your travels. Hoping he has a speedy and uneventful recovery. And I, too, appreciate the detail with which you write. I hate when someone has to go through something like this with their dog but threads like this one provide a wealth of information for anyone facing this issue in the future. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Camden's Mom Posted June 30, 2014 Report Share Posted June 30, 2014 Two things... 1) I wanted to second (and third, and fourth and so on) my appreciation for the detail in which you write! 2) I know it's only been two days since the last update but I'm just curious how Celt is doing. I was astonished to read in your last post he was already bearing some weight on the leg! Anyways, hoping your boy is hangin' in there and looking forward to the next update on his progress. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sue R Posted June 30, 2014 Author Report Share Posted June 30, 2014 30 Jun 2014 - two days post-surgery Thanks for asking about Celt. Because he was showing a bit of swelling around his hock yesterday, I scaled back his activity a bit on Shari's advice. Some swelling is normal but to avoid over-doing things (an issue I have to grapple with on both Celt's and my part), I'm making a more conscious effort to reduce his activity levels. Fewer potty trips and shorter potty trips are the rule right now. The bruising looks a bit more obvious but a lot of that is simply that the fluids of the internal bruising are migrating both down the leg and to the inner surface of the thigh. Swelling due to trauma or injury often peaks at about 48 hours so we should start seeing a reduction in swelling over the next few days along with "aging" of the bruising. Yesterday's bruising - And today's bruising - Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sue R Posted June 30, 2014 Author Report Share Posted June 30, 2014 And today's bruising on the outside of the leg, where it's real obvious how the bruising is more intense in color and the fluids are migrating down the leg - Today's swelling at the hock, again showing migration of fluids down the leg - When he gets up, he holds that leg up a bit but seems to not have a problem with using it for balance when needed. When I put on the leash and place the sling, and we start to head for the door, I have to remind him to "w.a.l.k" slowly. I use the sling to support his hind end going up or down the two steps between inside and outside but don't use it for support otherwise, just as "insurance" against slipping or falling. It's one of those things that it takes a bit of getting used to, to get it right between the leash and the sling and the dog and me... He can stand on the leg to pee but he has to "think" about it first or he's likely to get off balance. He has to be cautious and prepare his body weight, and then he can do that. He also pooped a couple of good ones today, and he does not squat as deeply as usual, and he holds that leg just a little in front of the other to minimize the flexion when he squats. He is walking pretty well on it, obviously with a limp, but using it more than he did this soon after surgery last time. That's probably because he's a lot better muscled than he was last time and has more strength (and not only in that leg but throughout his body). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sue R Posted June 30, 2014 Author Report Share Posted June 30, 2014 I do his passive range-of-motion (ROM) exercises on his other three legs two or three times a day, and a reduced version of that (the "bicycle pedal") on his surgical leg, followed by a period of cold therapy. This time, I am using CVS Peas, a plastic bag full of gel "peas" that can be frozen and is fairly flexible. I wrap it in two layers of thin toweling to apply and when it warms up enough, reduce the toweling to one layer, always trying to apply the cold without it being too cold on his skin. This helps reduce inflammation and swelling. I've used real frozen peas in the past and also frozen lentils/split peas. I felt an ice pack was too cold and he really hated that. What was the cheapest and easiest (and maybe the best) was a folded, soaked kitchen towel in a zippy bag that I chilled in the fridge. Nice and cold, very flexible, and no chance of being too cold on his skin. He uses his sheepskin as he sees fit - he's got the firm padding inside his crate (which he hasn't chosen yet), the carpet on the floor (where he lies primarily when it's warmer or when he wants to be at "this" end of the x-pen, closer to us), and the sheepskin (which is very cushy but firm, and which I will put on his night bed in our room at night). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gcv-border Posted July 1, 2014 Report Share Posted July 1, 2014 Can't wait to hear how well Celt progresses. I have not seen a collar like that. It looks so much better than the Victorian collars. I have one of the inflatable collars, but Celt's collar looks even better. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sue R Posted July 1, 2014 Author Report Share Posted July 1, 2014 I have an inflatable which is comfortable but which I don't think really does much good. Celt's collar is a "Bite Not" which was recommended to me by Ruth (Urge to Herd) back several years ago, I think when Megan had her tail tip infection/amputation. It is a stiff plastic sheet that is wrapped around the neck and fastened first with the Velcro along the edges and then secured with a wide elastic that also has a Velcro closing. Then there is a nylon webbing that goes around the chest, behind the front legs, which helps hold it in place and prevents it from rotating around (which is shouldn't do much anyway if it's fastened snugly). The collar comes in several widths and Ruth lent me her 5" and 6". The 5" fit Megan who is only 35# and stocky, while I found the 6" to be just right for Celt who is lankier and 42#. When properly fitted, it rests on the front of the shoulders and comes just to the base of the ears, which does give the dog a bit of a "stuck up" appearance at times as he/she tends to hold the head a bit above horizontal. The dog can eat, drink, and get into a variety of comfortable positions with it on. For a situation like this, I find it ideal because it prevents the dog from bending his/her neck in order to get at the wound, which in Celt's case is at his knee. In the case of some wounds, it just won't work because a dog like Megan can manage to contort herself (as in the case of her tail, where she'd curl her hind up like an armadillo in a defensive posture) and get at the lower hind leg, lower front leg, etc. So I think it's very useful for everything *but* lower limb and end of tail situations. With Megan's tail, neither the cone nor the Bite-Not would suffice because she would just curl herself up and get the tail to her mouth which is how she took care of the original infection we were treating by doing her own self-amputation. Then we had to take her to Ed's brother's vet (we were visiting in NC) to have the amputation neatened up and bandaged, etc. The vet put on the cone that was "her size" and found her capable of unbandaging her tail with that so when we picked her up, she was outfitted with a 30" cone tied with bandaging to her collar to keep it on (it was way too big to stay on with her small head). And since there was still a risk of her managing to get at that tail tip, we also put on the Bite-Not. A combination of a physical barrier (cone) and a motion inhibitor (Bite-Not) did the trick long enough for the tail to heal. No wonder she finds her right-sized cone to be not a problem! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sue R Posted July 1, 2014 Author Report Share Posted July 1, 2014 1 Jul 2014 - four days post-surgery The news of the morning is that while the bruising color is still migrating down the leg a bit, leaving the upper part of the leg less "colorful" and the lower leg more "colorful", the swelling appears to be reducing around the hock. I'm staying home with him an extra day so he can continue on the Tramadol at three times a day, and when we scale that back to twice a day (which is the interval for the Rimadyl and antibiotic), then I can be gone for much of tomorrow and to work on Thursday, at which point I will have three days around and about home before the normal work schedule resumes. I hope to get some photos later. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sue R Posted July 1, 2014 Author Report Share Posted July 1, 2014 I didn't get photos but we are back from Shari's where he had another laser treatment. Why do I think these are good for him? He's excited and eager to see Shari - usually, as we drive up, he's woo-woo-wooing all the way from the main road to the clinic. When he heard Shari's door open (and it was out of sight from where we were in the waiting room), his tail immediately went to wagging gently and he moved to look and see if she was coming for us. In her treatment room, while he doesn't like to get on the mattress for his treatment (none of my dogs do, it has a plastic liner under clean blanket she covers it with), once he's laid down on it, he is content to be treated and makes that obvious. Then, when he gets up, it's time for a feel-good whole-body shake. And he walks out always with an I-feel-good stride. Anyway, Shari was pleased to see that the bruising, while very obvious, was showing some signs of lightening up (healing). The swelling had reduced greatly since Monday and is almost gone at this point. His ability to walk on the leg is better with each visit although we still keep him on a short leash and use the sling for "insurance" - not to hold him up but to prevent him from possibly slipping or falling down, as he almost did once when he was too excited about getting a cookie and feeling too good to be cautious! Neither Shari nor I can get over the huge improvement we see this time around - how not confining him like I did (as the vet instructed) two years ago for an extended period of time has resulted in a stronger, fitter, leaner dog that appears to be bouncing back from surgery much more quickly, with strength, and with a very positive attitude. Meanwhile, we continue with the ROM exercises twice or three times a day, followed by some cold pack therapy, and do all outside the pen (or bedroom, if it's nighttime) movements on leash and with the sling in place except for pottying. Shari did feel he could walk just a little bit more on his potty trips, maybe a trip out to the blueberry patch when I'm picking as long as he lies down while I pick and he rests (the far end of the patch is maybe 200' from our door) or some lying down outside while I'm doing something in the yard, but not *too* much activity overall. And he produced another big poop this morning, getting back into a more normal routine for him, and a good indicator that his insides are doing well. I guess I'd rate today as "feeling good" for both of us! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sue R Posted July 2, 2014 Author Report Share Posted July 2, 2014 2 Jul 2014 - five days post-surgery Big changes in the leg in just a couple of days - reduced bruising coloration, reduced (almost non-existent) swelling, hair beginning to get soft as it grows. Inside the leg with incision - And inside the thigh, close-up of knee joint area with incision - He still has some blotchy red areas but even they are fading. They are just obvious because the tissue around them has returned mostly to its normal pale coloration. The incision looks good, nice and dry and tight, without any discoloration indicating infection or stress. The little semi-circle of dots inside the thigh puzzled both Shari and I until we realized that might have been a place where an incision retractor was gripping. It's like maybe five very tiny, very thin scabs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sue R Posted July 2, 2014 Author Report Share Posted July 2, 2014 Outside of the leg - Outside of the hock from the side - Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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