WWBC Posted September 22, 2011 Report Share Posted September 22, 2011 Two BAER testing locations listed for GA. Dr. Mark Kent at UGA College Veterinary Medicine, Small Animal teaching hospital Athens, GA (706)542-3221 MKent@vet.uga.edu and Dr Ronald P. Johnson at GA Veterinary Specialists 455 Abernthy Rd NE Atlanta, GA (404) 459 0903 Johnsonr15ucf@aol.com Perhaps the breeder could contact them and schedule the whole litter for BAER testing at a litter rate? Dr Johnson at GA vet specialist is listed as temporarily unavailable. There is another tester in Opelika AL Tha Animal Health Center (334)745-0060, call for appt. arvlel@bellsouth.net Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Journey Posted September 22, 2011 Report Share Posted September 22, 2011 If the pup does not test deaf at that age, then you can be sure it does not have the type of deafness sometimes associated with white pigmentation or blue eyes. Can you be sure? With all the various deafness coming to light recently I am asking is all? Can we be *sure* enough to say this? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Billadeau Posted September 22, 2011 Report Share Posted September 22, 2011 Congenital deafness (deaf from birth) is the type of deafness that has shown some correlation to looks (blue eyes and excessive white on head). If the pup is not deaf at 6-9 weeks it does not have congenital deafness. Eileen was restrictive on the type of deafness she was discussing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pam Wolf Posted September 22, 2011 Report Share Posted September 22, 2011 In response to the poster who implied 3-5 hours too far to take pups for a BAER test, this is why such problems are becoming prevelant in our dogs. People don't want to bother with taking pups for things we can test for. I just had a litter and took them 3 1/2 hours one way for a BAER test (all good, glad to report). Deafness is becoming quite a problem in certain lines and I think we need to be more diligent about checking our dogs for things which could be a major problem in the future. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
roscoe11 Posted September 22, 2011 Author Report Share Posted September 22, 2011 Two BAER testing locations listed for GA. Dr. Mark Kent at UGA College Veterinary Medicine, Small Animal teaching hospital Athens, GA (706)542-3221 MKent@vet.uga.edu and Dr Ronald P. Johnson at GA Veterinary Specialists 455 Abernthy Rd NE Atlanta, GA (404) 459 0903 Johnsonr15ucf@aol.com Perhaps the breeder could contact them and schedule the whole litter for BAER testing at a litter rate? Dr Johnson at GA vet specialist is listed as temporarily unavailable. There is another tester in Opelika AL Tha Animal Health Center (334)745-0060, call for appt. arvlel@bellsouth.net I called Dr. Mark Kent and they told me i would have to go through my vet to get any information. I also email him and it bounced Back. I am not sure what that means. I called Dr Johnson and they told me that they do not do the BAER test anymore. The best thing i guess if I decided to get the white head dog is to have the test done at week 6 before i picked it up. I am emailing the breeder now to see how open she is to the testing. Thanks again for everyones help Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liz P Posted September 22, 2011 Report Share Posted September 22, 2011 When I breed, it is to get a pup for myself. I want to know if my pup is deaf or not, so I am willing to drive long distances and pay to do it. I drove 6 hours each way to get my last litter BAER tested. I've not had a pup test deaf and I hope I never do. I made the decision to BAER test when I had a pup with a solid white head born in my very first litter. Knowing I had those genes in my lines compelled me to screen the puppies I produced. (I also know there is the potential to produce blue eyes in the lines.) As a breeder, I feel that the information can be helpful long term for Border Collies as a whole. On the same note, I hip score every dog, even if I have no intention of breeding that individual. It gives me more horizontal data on the health of the lines. I don't think breeding decisions should be made based on health test results alone, but those results can be used to guide final mate selection. For example, when choosing between 3 studs and 2 of them have CEA N/N results, the third is CEA N/C and your bitch is CEA N/C. The bitch and stud #3 can still be bred, just not to one another. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
roscoe11 Posted September 22, 2011 Author Report Share Posted September 22, 2011 When I breed, it is to get a pup for myself. I want to know if my pup is deaf or not, so I am willing to drive long distances and pay to do it. I drove 6 hours each way to get my last litter BAER tested. I've not had a pup test deaf and I hope I never do. I made the decision to BAER test when I had a pup with a solid white head born in my very first litter. Knowing I had those genes in my lines compelled me to screen the puppies I produced. (I also know there is the potential to produce blue eyes in the lines.) As a breeder, I feel that the information can be helpful long term for Border Collies as a whole. On the same note, I hip score every dog, even if I have no intention of breeding that individual. It gives me more horizontal data on the health of the lines. I don't think breeding decisions should be made based on health test results alone, but those results can be used to guide final mate selection. For example, when choosing between 3 studs and 2 of them have CEA N/N results, the third is CEA N/C and your bitch is CEA N/C. The bitch and stud #3 can still be bred, just not to one another. Liz P do you have any litter coming up I want a pup from you! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liz P Posted September 22, 2011 Report Share Posted September 22, 2011 I've got several dogs I want to compete with extensively next year, so no immediate plans for puppies. My nursery prospect is patiently waiting for me to get in gear and start serious training with her. My other young bitch needs polishing and more miles before she will be ready to compete in open. I do not need another pup, but I do know of some available if you are willing to ship. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
workindogs Posted September 22, 2011 Report Share Posted September 22, 2011 In response to the poster who implied 3-5 hours too far to take pups for a BAER test, this is why such problems are becoming prevelant in our dogs. People don't want to bother with taking pups for things we can test for. I just had a litter and took them 3 1/2 hours one way for a BAER test (all good, glad to report). Deafness is becoming quite a problem in certain lines and I think we need to be more diligent about checking our dogs for things which could be a major problem in the future. Pam, I'm the person that suggested that certain services aren't available nearby and might have an issue getting such tests done. I would add, that if a puppy buyer wanted a BAER test, I might suggest that they do it themselves....I would guarantee the pup. Keep in mind that my line is BLACK FACTORED...highly BLACK FACTORED. I have no reason to believe that such a test is necessary for my pups or of any benefit to my 'breeding program'. Furthermore, I generally prefer dark lines.....personal preference with the added benefit of not producing excessive white. I have had a similar situation where I've sought to buy a puppy from a certain line because I was very interest in the particular cross and working potential....however I had concerns about CEA. The puppy in question was coming from a remote area from a breeder of limited means. I had reason to ask for an eye test but the resources were not accessible to the breeder and the breeder didn't believe there would be an issue....so the breeder guaranteed the pups eyes and I had the test done when the pup arrived. The closest ophthalmologist was 4 hrs away and the pup tested clear. If I'd insisted that the test be done by the breeder it would have been an undue burden and prohibitive expense on an already unprofitable sale ($500 per pup does not make any breeder rich).....the breeder would have chosen to sell the pup to someone else. Since the test was important to me, I made the effort and expense to get the pup tested. If the pup had come up affected, then we would have had a 'complication'...however I was comfortable with the integrity of the breeder and his willingness to make it right. The biggest driver in my interest in one cross over another is the working potential of the puppy. I certainly inform myself about potential health issues in a line....but if the breeder doesn't share my concern then it's my choice: either pass on the litter or get the test done myself. If I don't trust the breeder, then I don't buy a pup...no matter how fabulous the cross might seem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
roscoe11 Posted September 22, 2011 Author Report Share Posted September 22, 2011 The problem i have in waiting until i get the pup to do the test is two fold. One, if I wait until I get the pup and it has hearing problems I then miss out on the other dogs in the litter. The other problem is getting the dog back to the breeder she is 5 hours away. That is 10 hours round trip. Besides I bet I am going to grow attach to the pup, which will make it hard to give up. I have email the breeder about testing the white headed dog. I have not heard back from her. I would be willing to pay for it or at least split the cost. I am interested in her response. I think it will be a reflection on what kind of breeder she is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
juliepoudrier Posted September 22, 2011 Report Share Posted September 22, 2011 Roscoe11, I think someone else has already mentioned this, but the breeder could do simple tests that would tell whether the pup hears (startle noises with no other pups around for the pup in question to cue off of, for example). Such tests won't tell if the pup is unilaterally deaf, but you will know that the pup can hear. Depending on what you want out of the pup, that may be enough to satisfy you. Down the road if you had reason to believe the dog was a uni versus fully hearing, you could get a BAER test. Just another thought, as I know plenty of dogs with a lot of white on their heads who hear just fine.... J. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
luv2napp Posted September 22, 2011 Report Share Posted September 22, 2011 This behavior is a very typical one for unilaterally deaf dogs (looking in the wrong direction from where the sound is coming from). The dogs do learn to compensate for being deaf in one ear to the point where you can't even tell unless you carefully watch their behavior. Well, I'll be darned. I guess I shouldn't be surprised, since he IS a puppy mill rescue. We noticed this behavior the first day we got him, but chalked it up to him not being used to such open spaces, and where a sound comes from. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dogger_woggers Posted September 23, 2011 Report Share Posted September 23, 2011 Sorry, dumb question... What is a BAER test? Is it a DNA test or do they actually test the dog's hearing? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NCStarkey Posted September 23, 2011 Report Share Posted September 23, 2011 BAER is the abbreviation for brainstem auditory evoked response, and yes, it does test the actual hearing of the dog/puppy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Diana A Posted September 23, 2011 Report Share Posted September 23, 2011 I know of a few dogs in agility and obedience who are unilaterally deaf. It does not seem to be a hindrance to them. It's a big problem in working the sheep once you get up to long distances, because the dog relies so heavily on auditory signals that get hard to hear at that distance. But for what you intend to do with the dog, a uni would not be an issue I think. So the suggestion about the breeder doing some type of startle test is a good one - you'll know at least you aren't dealing with a completely deaf dog and it's something very easy for the breeder to do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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