luv2napp Posted February 3, 2011 Report Share Posted February 3, 2011 As most of you know, we've been working very hard with Danny and he's done wonderful. I have a couple of concerns that I thought maybe some of you might know the answer to. Danny tends to pee anywhere, anytime he feels like it. And he is always going out back, each time peeing there. So it's not like he NEEDS to go. Is this a boy thing? (I've never had a boy dog, so am clueless). Is there anything I can do to stop him. I never catch him in the act, so can't scold him. My other concern is that he won't sleep through the night. He'll sleep for a few hours, then is up and ready to play. My feelings on this is that he likes to play out back when it's dark and quiet and there's no scary noises. Try as I might, I can't get him to really play during the day because every sound causes him to run for the door. At night, he does the zoomies, plays with his ball and just has a blast. I admit, though, he has me laughing, even at 3am when I'm dead tired. He's such a goofball! I'm not sure there's anything I can do about this,though. Just wait it out until he gets less and less scared. Thanks for any advice. You all have been great support in these trying months!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PSmitty Posted February 3, 2011 Report Share Posted February 3, 2011 I've heard of those belly band thingies for boy dogs...anyone know if that might work for his peeing issue? I've always thought that housetraining an adult is just like a puppy. You have to have him on a consistent routine and until he's reliable in the house, he's never out of your sight, and therefore never gets a chance to go in the house. I realize, though, that with Danny's background, you're working against years of ingrained behaviors. How is he in a crate? Can you crate him at night so he'll eventually learn a night/day routine? I'd make sure he got some playtime outside, once it's quiet and dark, and try to get some of the energy out, then when you're ready to go to bed, in the crate he goes? ETA: As Greg said, no, this isn't a boy thing. I have three males and they don't mark in the house. I'm afraid it's just more of Danny's puppymill background, than anything else. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greg l Posted February 3, 2011 Report Share Posted February 3, 2011 No....this is NOT a boy thing...Our male does mark outside { or pee over} after our female...BUT he is housetrained and does not mark or pee inside...I don't have any answers as to how to train him other than constant vigilance and maybe the crate if you leave him alone for long periods in the house... Does he pee at night in your room? ...or just when you are not looking?... If he is ok at night when you are around and only pees while you aren't looking maybe a crate or an outside kennel is appropriate when he is left alone. Good Luck...Greg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nancy in AZ Posted February 3, 2011 Report Share Posted February 3, 2011 What sorts of housebreaking techniques have you implemented so far? It's hard to know what suggestions to make without knowing what's been tried. That aside, in addition to the prior suggestions of keeping him within constant sight,(even if it means leashing him to you indoors), and using a crate, I would add that you might use a good enzymatic cleaner like Nature's Miracle to get rid of any trace of prior urine spots. When I acquired Boo, he was 4 years old, un-neutered and un-housebroken. I'd estimate that it took about 3 weeks of consistant vigilance for him to be reliably housebroken. And I just wanted to offer you kudos. I so enjoy seeing Danny's progress. It's the toughest ones that teach us the most, and there is nothing so fulfilling as seeing them blossom. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aljones Posted February 3, 2011 Report Share Posted February 3, 2011 Hi, Diane, As I think you know, I've got a Swafford Survivor of a dog, too...Ody was 12 when we got him, and he was also a challenge to housetrain. He would lift his leg on anything! And he was much tougher to train than either of our other adult male rescues, one of whom was also a senior and had been also an outdoor dog his whole life. I feel your pain but am here to offer hope. To train Ody, we really did have to go to the basics, including crating him if we couldn't be physically with him (when taking a shower, for example) and tethering him to one of us or a nearby piece of furniture all the rest of the time. As Paula mentioned, we just treated him like a puppy. We used a 4-foot nylon leash for the tethering (tried a longer cable, but he just wanted to gnaw on it). It was easy to slip the loop under the foot of the coffeetable, for example, while watching TV in the evenings. Initially, Ody slept in his crate; then, as he became more integrated into the family, both behaviorally and housetraining-wise, we tethered him to the bedpost at the head of the bed. It took many months before he was able to "sleep loose" in the bedroom with us, and I still have to get up and take him out if I hear him stirring and drinking water early in the morning (there is very little lag time between his morning drink and his morning pee). But things are fairly normal now in most ways. And if Ody can do it, I have every confidence Danny can, too! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gcv-border Posted February 4, 2011 Report Share Posted February 4, 2011 All good suggestions so far: tethering to you while inside, crating at appropriate times, consistent routine, etc. Another thing to consider adding is to treat (i.e. small bits of chicken or cheese or steak) Danny whenever he does pee outside. Will he pee when he is on the leash outside? Try walking him on the leash so you can be close enough to treat him immediately when he pees. A couple of years ago I found a hound roaming our property. Around here, hounds are usually kenneled outside since many people use them for hunting. So this girl had no housetraining. I set up a bed for her in the garage, and she certainly peed and pooped in there. She was pretty good on a leash since she was sooo submissive, therefore I was able to walk her outside. I wasn't sure if this would work since she was able to freely poop and pee in the garage (she was not crated), but everytime she p'd or p'd outside, I would praise her and treated her with several bits of delicious food. After 3 weeks, she was "garage-trained" - no more messes in the garage. (In case you are wondering, I did find a local no-kill rescue to take her, and they were able to rehome her.) Jovi Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
luv2napp Posted February 4, 2011 Author Report Share Posted February 4, 2011 Thanks for all the great suggestions. I don't crate him anymore, as he was totally freaking out whenever I tried to get him in there. Then he would bark constantly. So what I ended up doing was leaving his crate open and just closing the door to "his" bedroom whenever I'm gone. It's working out great. We now have him sleeping in the bedroom, where he has a nice bed in my closet. At first, he was great. Now, he ends up getting up in the middle of the night, and getting himself into trouble. My curtains have been ripped from the wall and he started peeing. He peed again last night. I just read this, so I'm going to try tethering him close to me tonight and see how that works. (I don't know why I didn't think of that before...I had him tethered to me constantly for the first couple of weeks we got him). It just doesn't make any sense....he KNOWS he's supposed to do his business outside. He goes out at regular intervals....I just say to him "lets go potty" and he runs for the back door. He goes out and does his business. I praise him everytime! Again, thanks for the suggestions. I'll just keep plugging along. He really is a good boy. Oh, and he now knows how to play ball. And the funny part is he plays by himself! He'll bat the ball around with his paws, toss it in the air, go fetch it and then start over again. He's so fun to watch. Does my heart good to see him so happy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aljones Posted February 4, 2011 Report Share Posted February 4, 2011 Thanks for the update, Diane. I hope the tethering at night works; my husband and I definitely learned to sleep more lightly during this period of Ody's housetraining, but it was a huge help. I happened to think of one other thing, too: have you had Danny checked for a UTI? I know it's not particularly common for male dogs to develop UTIs, but apparently I have very weird male dogs because each of mine has had at least one over the last few years. It seems like a good idea to rule out a medical problem, though, since it sounds like this is a change in his behavior (I'd misunderstood your OP, thinking he'd never been reliably housetrained instead of that this problem has re-developed recently). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Star Posted February 5, 2011 Report Share Posted February 5, 2011 Tethering worked like a charm for us, too. Star was 12 weeks when we got her and had spent all her time outside or in kennel. Only concept she had was stop and drop. At the point when I knew she knew what she was supposed to do, I tethered her to me. Took perhaps three weeks, maybe two. At night, we just took her water up mid evening and she made it through the night just fine--kind of like don't give a potty training toddler drinks before bedtime. I would be shocked, now, if she pottied in the house. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sue R Posted February 5, 2011 Report Share Posted February 5, 2011 Does my heart good to see him so happy. Your Danny is a very fortunate dog to have you, and this is the sentence that does *my* heart good! I'm glad to see that you are working through this and trying to figure out what will work for you and Danny. You've had some good experience and you've gotten some great ideas. I'm sure you will be successful in time. I'm sure you've done this but don't forget to use a good enzymatic spray/cleaner for the spots where he has gone inside. Even a little smell remaining can make a spot hard to resist, and the habit gets stronger and stronger each time he does it. Very best wishes! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
luv2napp Posted February 5, 2011 Author Report Share Posted February 5, 2011 Well, the tethering didn't work! He chewed right through it. He was up most of the night, so by 5am I just shut him in "his" room and shut the door. He barked for a while, but I ignored it....truthfully, I was too tired to care if he peed or tore up anything by that point. He finally settled and I got a few hours sleep. I think tonight I'll try putting him in his room, then take him out around 4 and then put him back. The reason I feel I should take him out at 4 like that is during the week that is when my husband gets up for work and Danny wakes and wants to go out. So on the weekend, I assume I should stick to the same schedule? I've had border collies for 20 years (all rescues) and have never had a problem. I feel very inept when it comes to Danny. But I know it will work out. My friends and family have told me that they don't understand how I put up with it, THEY would never take in a dog like him. And they keep asking me WHY I did it. Esp. the Mother-in-law. I don't understand non-dog people! Sorry, got off topic. Thanks again! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Star Posted February 7, 2011 Report Share Posted February 7, 2011 Well, the tethering didn't work! He chewed right through it. He was up most of the night, so by 5am I just shut him in "his" room and shut the door. He barked for a while, but I ignored it....truthfully, I was too tired to care if he peed or tore up anything by that point. He finally settled and I got a few hours sleep. I think tonight I'll try putting him in his room, then take him out around 4 and then put him back. The reason I feel I should take him out at 4 like that is during the week that is when my husband gets up for work and Danny wakes and wants to go out. So on the weekend, I assume I should stick to the same schedule? I've had border collies for 20 years (all rescues) and have never had a problem. I feel very inept when it comes to Danny. But I know it will work out. My friends and family have told me that they don't understand how I put up with it, THEY would never take in a dog like him. And they keep asking me WHY I did it. Esp. the Mother-in-law. I don't understand non-dog people! Sorry, got off topic. Thanks again! I can't see how tethering wouldn't work in the way meant here--were you tying him up to something at night perhaps? I tied Star to myself all day long (of course, I mostly work from home so this was an easy thing to do). That way, she couldn't sneak off and potty when I wasn't looking. I took her out frequently (every 20 mins like a brand new puppy) for the first few days, then went longer and longer. I used a long leash which she never tried to chew through but you might try giving him a bone or something to chew on besides the tether? If I couldn't tether her, she went outside or (since it was winter) I gated her into the kitchen. But only had to do this a couple of times. She also had a favorite room to sneak off into (though it wasn't exclusive). At the suggestion of others on this board, I blocked entry to that room completely (and kept it that way for a long time even after I thought we had the problem solved). Maybe that would help you, too? I didn't even worry about nighttime except to take up her water in evening. She would sleep through the night anyway so that was the easy part for us. I think the real key was to break the habit--just a few days. Maybe take it one piece at a time--daytime first, then nighttime--would also help? Keep your patience--I think the more frustrated I got the worse she was. Almost like a little three year old willfully disobeying to push my buttons. And I also think it's great that you are giving Danny a wonderful home! Do we really care what the MIL thinks, anyway? And now I must go....all this talk of pottying..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
luv2napp Posted February 8, 2011 Author Report Share Posted February 8, 2011 I can't see how tethering wouldn't work in the way meant here--were you tying him up to something at night perhaps? I tied Star to myself all day long (of course, I mostly work from home so this was an easy thing to do). That way, she couldn't sneak off and potty when I wasn't looking. I took her out frequently (every 20 mins like a brand new puppy) for the first few days, then went longer and longer. I used a long leash which she never tried to chew through but you might try giving him a bone or something to chew on besides the tether? If I couldn't tether her, she went outside or (since it was winter) I gated her into the kitchen. But only had to do this a couple of times. She also had a favorite room to sneak off into (though it wasn't exclusive). At the suggestion of others on this board, I blocked entry to that room completely (and kept it that way for a long time even after I thought we had the problem solved). Maybe that would help you, too? I didn't even worry about nighttime except to take up her water in evening. She would sleep through the night anyway so that was the easy part for us. I think the real key was to break the habit--just a few days. Maybe take it one piece at a time--daytime first, then nighttime--would also help? Keep your patience--I think the more frustrated I got the worse she was. Almost like a little three year old willfully disobeying to push my buttons. And I also think it's great that you are giving Danny a wonderful home! Do we really care what the MIL thinks, anyway? And now I must go....all this talk of pottying..... Hi, thanks for your response. I wasn't losing patience, just sleep. I was VERY tired by this time. By the way, that mean face icon on the front of the paragraph was a typo...I don't know how it got there. I tethered him at night, beside my bed. That's why he was able to chew through without me knowing. I think I was sleeping VERY deeply. Anyhow, I think we've finally found a solution. He now goes into "his" bedroom at night, with bones, toys and his kennel that he can go into if he wants. He's been doing great. Also, he has just learned how to play ball. It's been five months since I adopted him and it was like a light switch was turned on in his head. "Oh, THIS is what I'm supposed to do!" So we've been playing ball out back several times during the day and he gets worn out. Thank goodness. Here's a couple of videos of him playing: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Star Posted February 9, 2011 Report Share Posted February 9, 2011 Well, sounds like you are on your way. By the way, I have thought this but not said it--I think Danny is one of the most handsome border collies I've seen! Maybe he can be a model some day! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
luv2napp Posted February 9, 2011 Author Report Share Posted February 9, 2011 Well, sounds like you are on your way. By the way, I have thought this but not said it--I think Danny is one of the most handsome border collies I've seen! Maybe he can be a model some day! Thanks so much for the compliment! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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