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A friend of mine who adopted a very nice border collie from me about 7 yrs. ago, is in a rental situation, a side by side house. Since the yard isn't totally fenced in she either stays out with her dogs when they are outside, or if she has to run inside for a minute, puts them on a line. The neighbors on the other side are totally clueless as dog owners and IMO should not have any dog much less keep two dogs that her kids -- college age, brought home. First, some medium sized mixed breed who has some serious behavioral issues, and most recently, a young, unneutered American bulldog. (to give you an example of the type of dog owner I'm talking about, they recently lost a Cav. King Charles spaniel, from what sounded like a blockage. I'm only guessing because they never took the dog to the vet because of not having the money, yet every payday, the woman has the $$ to buy a couple of bottles of vodka).

 

Yesterday, I got a frantic call from my friend. Mick, her border collie, now an old man of about 9 yrs. old, was outside on the line in his favorite part of the yard while she ran inside to get something. While she was still inside, she heard a huge commotion. The idiots she has for neighbors let both the crazy mutt and Am. Bulldog out without checking to see if anyone was outside. They simply opened the door and went back inside. The dogs immediately attacked Mick and nearly tore him apart. It was only when they heard my friends screams that they came out to see what was going on. Two other neighbor guys came running over to get these dogs off Mick. The bulldog fought to have another go at Mick while he was being restrained.

 

They rushed Mick to a veterinary clinic where they immediately took him in and shaved him down. His injuries were a lot more extensive than was immediately apparent -- he's got a thick coat. They immediately took him into surgery and a few hours later, released him to go back home. Although they don't keep animals overnight, they offered to keep Mick, but said if he'd be more comfortable at home, that would be OK too.

 

The owner of the other dogs, while she apologized, tried to blame Mick for what her dogs did, that they didn't like him, the way he stared, but she did offer to pay the bill.

 

Lakewood, where they live, earlier this year passed a dog ordinance banning pitbulls and presas only,

but I went on line and looked up what constitutes a dangerous and/or viscious dog in Lakewood and these dogs would definately come under the "viscious" part of the law --- although I do think that word is too loosely used these days. Dogs which are deemed dangerous or viscious need to be registered, be confined in an enclosure meeting the specs of the law and some other points were brought up for any resident to be able to continue to keep a dog that has been deemed dangerous or viscious.

 

If they cared so little about the King Chas spaniel to not take her to the vet and allow her to suffer a painful death, I doubt that they'd be willing to come up with the money to keep these two dogs.

 

My friend is sort of hesitant to report this because she's afraid of retaliation, but I spoke with her today and the initial shock is worn off and she is good and mad now, in a clear thinking sort of way. I told her it's not a question of should she report it. I told her it's her obligation to report it. Lakewood is a residential area, lots of dog walkers, lots of kids.

 

I think she might be calling the Lakewood cops today to see which way she should go with this.

 

In the meantime, Mick's coat has been shorn away. He has tubes coming out of his neck and has stiches on his back, his abdomen. The vet said a couple more inches, they could have gotten an artery, in which case he'd be dead.

 

Instead of banning breeds, they need to ban idiots like these neighbors, who appear to be some of the most clueless people I have ever encountered.

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Oh wow, I'm sorry that happened to your friend. Is it possible for her to get an enclosure for her dog or fence part of the yard for him to keep him safe? I'd worry about retaliation too. But that's not an excuse not to report. It's only a matter of time before some other dog get hurt if those dogs are allowed to run loose, I'd imagine.

 

J.

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OMG ! You poor thing , Mick...I wish you a speedy recovery . What a horrible thing to happen !

Sea4th , Im also sorry your friend went thru this.

God , people can be sooooo stupid. I think the right thing to do is report it , but understandably being concerned for retaliation. Has there been domestic disturbances at this household too ? If so , there is more of a reason to be concerned about retaliation. I wish these people could be put on a planet all by themselves , without animals !

I hope , once the shock is over , and Mick is out of danger , your friend can come to a conclusion on how to handle this situation .

Maybe these people will move if a report is filed. But in a worse case senario , maybe your friend can find a better place. It's unfortunate , but it might be for the best.

Good vibes coming Mick's way ...from our pack to his...

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WOW. I really hope Mick is going to be ok.

IMO, your friend shouldn't even think twice about reporting. Our city has a vicious dog bylaw as well and they are pretty strict about it. If my dog got attacked, I wouldn't think twice. Retaliation or not. People like this should not own pets period and it's that much more dangerous when they have animals that are either too powerful or have behavioural issues. But that's just me and I once called bylaw on my own roommate because he was leaving his cat outside in the middle of winter (-25 weather) all day long.

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I agree with Julie....the dogs needs to be reported for the harm they could do to another dog or a child. Now that they have a "taste" of violence, it won't stop. It sounds as though the woman is abusive to her animals as well and should be reported to the SPCA. Also, the vet as a third party could possibly help to place the report. Your friend might not get the money for the vet bill, but if she is reported, the neighbor could be brought up on charges and then the court would order her to pay. She will probably never pay the bill anyway.

 

It is tough to stand up, especially if you don't particularly safe in doing so. But on the other hand, your friend and her animal obviously aren't safe at the moment either. Mick will never breathe an easy breath as long as they are next door. In addition to reporting the incidents, your friend might feel more comfortable moving to another apt. if it was at all possible to do so.

 

Hope Mick does well, and from my experience with chemotherapy, whisper in his ear that hair does grow back! :rolleyes:

 

Liz

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I hope Mick comes out alright.

 

Absolutely report the dogs. Mick was tied up and these dogs just attacked. That makes a vicious dog in my book. I would also tell her to accept the offer to pay for the vets bills.

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I agree with those who say report. You have witnesses, and the dogs that attacked will probably do so again - if not her dog, then another, or even a person. But I would also be looking for a new place to live under those circumstances. A friend of mine had a similar experience and his BC was fatally poisoned. The poison was shoved through a window while he was at the market buying groceries .He did not report either the initial attack or the poisoning. He was afraid to. He lived in a trailer park (I know...) and he was "the new guy." The people there had guns. They were heavy drinkers. My friend moved to a different state, (Colorado) and his current dog, a BC/ pit-bull mix from rescue is turning 14 this year.

It seems inconcievable that there can be such stupid, heedless, vicious people in the world - but there are. I'd go someplace a bit safer.

 

Edited to add: I had great success with putting aloe vera gel on stitched bite wounds. My Dobe once had 67 stiches and the vet said that she would probably always have a limp and limited range of motion. I put it on every two hours that was awake, and the vet was astonished at how little scarring and tissue loss she had. The wounds (on a front leg) healed, leaving a tiny scar where a triangular piece of skin came off, and she had no limp and full range of motion. Good luck to Mick in his healing - poor old fella!

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It's not so stupid or rare as you think. The guy in the house behind mine has been my neighbor for 26 years. Within the last month he has started bullying Jin when he's out with my daughter and at a town hall meeting he repeatedly bumped into me on purpose. Yesterday as we walked out of the wash Jin ran over to say hi and he threated him with a walking stick then threatened me. Now I'm pissed. I told him that I was disabled, Jin was a service dog and that messing with either of us is ill advised and against the law. If a neighbor of 26 years can do that anyone can.

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Update. My friend says thanks for all of your concern and good thoughts for Mick -- who, BTW, is older than I originally thought. Mick is 12 and not 9 yrs. old -- sorry, Mick old boy. She called the Lakewood cops today who immediately transferred her to the dog warden. At first the dog warden said that since it happened on rental property, it's a civil matter, but as my friend continued to tell her the details, the warden began to ask her questions. She asked Mick's age, which apparently factors into her decision as a dog warden to take some action. That he was restrained and when she found out that one of the attacking dogs was an American Bulldog, she told my friend they'll be paying a visit to the neighbors tomorrow. She did say one thing that doesn't quite sit right with me. The dog warden said that the proof is on the owners to prove that the one dog actually is an American Bulldog. If they can't, then the city will consider the AB a pitbull and the owners will be in violation of yet another ordinance. I don't understand the reasoning behind this.

 

My friend said that there has not been one apology or word of remorse from these neighbors. They are pretty much unconcerned and are taking no responsibility for their dogs' actions. They are very blase' about the situation, but refuse to come to the house and look at Mick and the damage that's been done. They blame Mick as an instigator for the attack and for the bite wound the mixed breed got on his front leg sometime during the attack, which they might have to go to the vet for (yeh, right). Mick's got some nerve defending himself! A-Holes.

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Report it for sure. I had a litter of 3 staffy x ACD pups while ago and when they were rehomed one went to a home with a shitzu. They rang me a couple of months after to say they got home and the next door neighbours dogs (3 big pitbull/bullmastiff type dogs) got out and mauled the little pup to death. They were devastated, luckily their other little dog could get away, but Bailey was only a tiny pup so didn't stand a chance.

Your friend needs to do everything she can to make sure these people never have dogs again. I hope her boy heals well.

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She did say one thing that doesn't quite sit right with me. The dog warden said that the proof is on the owners to prove that the one dog actually is an American Bulldog. If they can't, then the city will consider the AB a pitbull and the owners will be in violation of yet another ordinance. I don't understand the reasoning behind this.

 

 

In my opinion, It's a tomato -tomatoe thing but there are some subtle distinctions. It's an effort to remake the Pit Bull's image.

 

Rather like the difference between a rental property and a home owner! Good grief! That's lack of representation!

 

 

Liz

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Instead of banning breeds, they need to ban idiots like these neighbors, who appear to be some of the most clueless people I have ever encountered.

 

I'm in complete agreement. It would make a great bumper sticker; Don't ban the breed, ban idiot owners.

 

Well wishes from Lewie and me that Mick has a speedy recover and that there are no psychological scars.

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the dogs needs to be reported for the harm they could do to another dog or a child.

Liz

 

Highly unlikely to be a child unless it gets in the way of an attack on a dog.

Dog - dog and dog - human aggression are very different things.

But yes, it needs to be followed up.

 

Pam

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when she found out that one of the attacking dogs was an American Bulldog, she told my friend they'll be paying a visit to the neighbors tomorrow.

 

That just seems so freaking wrong to me. Breed shouldn't matter. What matters is that Mick was attacked and injured because of the negligence of the attacking dog's owner. Period. The end. Nothing else matters. I'm glad the authorities were contacted, but I hope that this does not become a breed thing.

 

I was very glad that when my dog was attacked (by an OES of all things) that the cops were willing to get involved immediately. The owners of the dog were breaking the law and endangering my dog and that was the bottom line. Then again, we don't have BSL here. Dangerous dogs are labeled dangerous because of their behavior, not the shape of their heads.

 

Good thoughts to Mick. I hope he doesn't have any longlasting effects from his terrible experience.

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I'm in complete agreement. It would make a great bumper sticker; Don't ban the breed, ban idiot owners.

 

I totally agree. My first dog choice was actually a Pit bull. Being from NZ every dog owned by a "macho" man or boy is a pit bull. And it's funny how these are the dogs that attack. They had no choice they were raised that way to have their ears cut and to look big and aggressive. They are beautiful family dogs and don't deserve the bad rap they get. I would just die for a red nosed pit bull, tan and white, just beautiful. I tried asking the council when i moved to Australia but there was no way you could even legally own one. Although i have heard of people backyard breeding them with mastiff crosses. Anyway its the people that raise them not the breed. Although once it gets to that point the dog should be put down but the owners should be banned from ever having any other dogs. Poor puppies and poor Mick for having to suffer because of some stupid idiots that don't care for their dogs.

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I certainly don't want to see this made into a breed specific thing either. What I wrote was my interpretation of she told me of her interpretation of what the warden said. My friend is no dummy, but remember, this is second hand information, so I don't want to criticize what the warden's intention was. I'd like to think the situation was enough to act upon without it being a breed specific thing, so I called my friend today to ask what was the factor that caused the warden to say, "OK. This is serious. We're coming out". She said at first the warden thought it was a spat between two dogs on the same property, but when she heard how serious the injuries actually were, the age of the dog injured and the breed of the attacking dog were the 3 things that apparently clinched it. The important thing is that they came out today, looked at photos my friend took of Mick and went to the neighbor's house where there was no answer and they left a note. They're taking this seriously and they told my friend that in cases this severe, usually the treating vet calls the dog warden.

 

As far as being a danger to a human -- yes, it is different than dog to dog aggression -- a lot different, but if these dogs decide that the shih-tzu being walked by a young girl in the neighborhood is fair game, the dogs become dangerous to the kid -- a leg, an arm, a face in the way might have catastrophic consequences. Although I can't speak for this particular AB, the mixed breed does have some human aggression. I also think the AB will be the scapegoat for the mutt. In knowledgable hands, he might actually be a nice dog. Operative word here is "knowledgable" because his current owners are dumb as a box of rocks.

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That just seems so freaking wrong to me. Breed shouldn't matter. What matters is that Mick was attacked and injured because of the negligence of the attacking dog's owner. Period. The end. Nothing else matters. I'm glad the authorities were contacted, but I hope that this does not become a breed thing.

 

I was very glad that when my dog was attacked (by an OES of all things) that the cops were willing to get involved immediately. The owners of the dog were breaking the law and endangering my dog and that was the bottom line. Then again, we don't have BSL here. Dangerous dogs are labeled dangerous because of their behavior, not the shape of their heads.

 

Good thoughts to Mick. I hope he doesn't have any longlasting effects from his terrible experience.

 

It's unfortunate that breed does matter, in many cases. As we've discussed at length, AKC breeding practices, as well as back yard breeders, can be the ruination of any breed of dog, health or temperament wise. This breed in particular has been the victim of specific breeding and handling practices directed toward taking its natural tendencies to the point of real aggression. Add to that, owners who don't understand the breed, rescues that aren't properly vetted, and you've got a real mess where incidents like this dog attack are all too common.

 

As for dog-dog or dog-human, an aggressive dog is an aggressive dog and there are many unknown triggers. For example, most people have experienced a good, curious sniff if they own a dog or a cat themselves and meet another dog.

 

Hope Mick is doing better and that the vet also steps up to report. It helps the owner out.

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Mick went back to the vet today to remove the tubes. Mick, who is Mr. Ain't Life Grand, apparently has some psychological after effects from the attack. In the waiting room, he he'd bark and growl at every large dog who came through the door --- totally out of character for Mick.

 

Another interesting bit of information, a friend of the neighbor's family works the reception area at the vet's office. Although she didn't give her a name, the person at the billing desk who checked my friend out when they were done, told her that she -- my friend -- was also responsible for the attack on her dog because Mick was tied outside. My friend has not had a good nights sleep since the attack, is an emotional person anyway, called me crying and told me. My reply to her was that it's not in that person's job description to pass judgement or offer opinion about Mick's or anyone elses situation, that her job is strictly clerical. I told my friend to march right back in there and ask to speak to the treating vet and complain to the vet. She did. I guess they'll be having a little chat with their billing person.

 

Still, no word of apology. It's bad enough to imagine the pain Mick endured, but to see this old boy who has always had a wonderful temperament react in such an uncharacteristic way almost hurts more.

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Mick went back to the vet today to remove the tubes. Mick, who is Mr. Ain't Life Grand, apparently has some psychological after effects from the attack. In the waiting room, he he'd bark and growl at every large dog who came through the door --- totally out of character for Mick.

 

Another interesting bit of information, a friend of the neighbor's family works the reception area at the vet's office. Although she didn't give her a name, the person at the billing desk who checked my friend out when they were done, told her that she -- my friend -- was also responsible for the attack on her dog because Mick was tied outside. My friend has not had a good nights sleep since the attack, is an emotional person anyway, called me crying and told me. My reply to her was that it's not in that person's job description to pass judgement or offer opinion about Mick's or anyone elses situation, that her job is strictly clerical. I told my friend to march right back in there and ask to speak to the treating vet and complain to the vet. She did. I guess they'll be having a little chat with their billing person.

 

Still, no word of apology. It's bad enough to imagine the pain Mick endured, but to see this old boy who has always had a wonderful temperament react in such an uncharacteristic way almost hurts more.

 

Poor Mick...he might well settle down a bit once he's feeling better. And you are correct, the billing person has no right to make statements like that. Good grief. What ever happened to simple kindness?

 

Liz

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The scenario where a child (or adult) gets mauled when the incident started as dog-dog aggression is sadly not uncommon.

 

It's a common misconception that because a dog is dog aggressive "Next time it might be a child".

However, if a human gets too close to a dog on dog attack, it is perfectly possible that aggression may be redirected onto the person.

This does not mean that the dog will go out of its way to attack a person.

We've all been bitten by our JRT when seperating him from our hound but no way is he human aggressive. In fact, he's the one I trust most with children.

 

Pam

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It's a common misconception that because a dog is dog aggressive "Next time it might be a child".

However, if a human gets too close to a dog on dog attack, it is perfectly possible that aggression may be redirected onto the person.

This does not mean that the dog will go out of its way to attack a person.

To be clear, I was referring to the danger of a child or adult intervening in dog-dog aggression, often in an attempt to protect the K9 victim.

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Poor Mick...he might well settle down a bit once he's feeling better. And you are correct, the billing person has no right to make statements like that. Good grief. What ever happened to simple kindness?

 

Liz

 

Poor Mick ..I hope he gets back to his old self again soon. He is tramatized something bad , and so is his owner. I could only imagine the heartache she must be going thru. All she can do is hold Mick tight and pray for a quick recovery for both of them. Time heals .

As for the vet recept, should be slapped upside the head ! I would personally like to do it too ! :rolleyes:

She should be fired for bringing on a ton more stress that Micks mom did not need !! I cannot believe someone would actually say that , to the owner no less who is tramatized and in shock. Oh please just give me 5 minutes in a empty exam room with this recept idiot !! I dont like violence but this just needs to be handled with a fist or two.

And if the vet or office manager doesnt take immediate action against this person , I would ask for Micks records and find another vet .

Some people arent happy in life and feel that everybody else should be just as unhappy.

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