Root Beer Posted December 10, 2009 Report Share Posted December 10, 2009 If DW was able to do the things that many others take for granted, she would love to do them. Please don't think we all take those things for granted. Between bladder cancer this past spring, a serious reaction to a medication this past summer, and the flu in October, there was way too much time this year when I couldn't do a thing with my dogs except throw balls off the sofa for them and snuggle - and I was sincerely grateful to be able to do that much. They were amazingly patient and tolerant of those sudden disappearances of their normal structured activities. In fact, this year they showed me what good dogs they truly are. I know I've gone off on a huge tangent, but I certainly didn't mean to offend anyone by suggesting that fetch and ball playing is mindless. Sometimes I play ball and fetch mindlessly, but that's me and it's not an indication of judgment on anyone else. Nor do I lack emphathy for those who cannot do the things I am able to do with my dogs on a regular basis. And I don't want anyone to think that I take the ability to train and play sports with my dogs for granted. Maybe I did before, but I certainly don't now, and never will again. And I don't consider the fact that I enjoy ball games with my dogs a problem, nor do I consider myself their problem. I totally took what Journey said about that as good humored banter. Now, I'm off to go clicker train my intelligent dogs to dance with me. And that's the truth. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carson Crazies Posted December 10, 2009 Report Share Posted December 10, 2009 Hey Julie, there's a ball with the flag on it - Tuff something or other?? It's supposed to be industrial strength, harder to kill, and easier on the teeth. On the relatively rare occasion that I do toss a ball for my dogs I use those. I only toss them a few times though as my yard is small, and the balls get slimy fast. I hate slimy balls. Ick. Anyway, I believe I used to get them at Petsmart. When you have limitations like living in the city (as I do) you're sometimes forced to be more creative. I spend a lot of time dragging my dogs to my friends' places (many thanks be to them) so that they can stretch their legs. Sometimes we do what we have to in order to make things work. I'll admit that tossing a ball makes me cringe so I rarely do it. But there was a time (in the days BS - before sheep) when my dogs and I did a lot of it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lenajo Posted December 10, 2009 Report Share Posted December 10, 2009 oh good grief, both of you! This is what is wrong with a lot of dog training anymore. You can't tell people the truth for all the hurt feelings and tender psyches. Better to let the dog get hurt, or perpetuate a mindless *activity* instead of risking the fall out from speaking up. KG - if you want change you will find a way. My dogs mostly play a hour or so each day with each other, or just lope around the yard. It's more on the weekends often, much more, and during some weeks it's much less lately. Some of them worked and played their little fannies off last weekend, but this week has been all about paperwork so they will get about 30 minues of free play morning and night. Otherwise its house lounging, crate, or kennel. I'll probably work some agility this weekend with those that do that - between catch up on sheep work from being going last weekend. There is no set schedule, and I can fairly say that my dogs are fit. BJ - there are countless low activity/low physical stress things DW can do with Annie to stimulate her mind instead of throwing a ball endlessly. Or is this about what DW likes, or what Annie needs? Nothing wrong with either, or a combination thereof, but lets be honest about whats going on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maralynn Posted December 10, 2009 Report Share Posted December 10, 2009 In truth the quote was abbreviated for the sake of <going to extremes and forgetting that you responded to constructive conversation about safety and ball throwing by threatening to chain your dog up and only let him off only to work> oops, I meant "brevity" Lets keep this constructive please. Nobody has insulted your dog. Well, you have, but he's yours so other than being sad to read it's of non-issue. There is a good point here. Comments that are regular on this part of the forum do perpetuate the myth that the Border Collie needs mountains of repetative exercise to be happy. Playing ball does provide some (questionaly safe) exercise, but very little (mostly none) of the mental exercise that helps keep these dogs focused and sane. So you get fitter...but not saner...dog behavior. A lot like people who run their horses a few times a week because it gets the hyper bucks out. The horse just get fitter, and the real problem is never addressed. I'm still trying to figure out what is wrong with using fetch a one of the forms of exercise for a Border Collie. Maybe I'm lucky, but it hasn't led to neurotic hyper fit dogs here. I find it is a simple way to exercise 3 dogs at the same time. It isn't the the only thing I do with my dogs but it sure is part of it. Sometimes we play with rules, sometimes without. Yesterday we had nasty weather that started early in the afternoon. The dogs had two 10 minute sessions of fetch earlier in the day and some mental training indoors. Two of them wrestled around a little inside off and on. Then they just chilled for most of the evening. All three, including the one y/o. Yes they still can think, they still work, they still get mentally stimulating training. I guess I just don't see anything wrong with having a few mindless games as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kelpiegirl Posted December 10, 2009 Author Report Share Posted December 10, 2009 Hi Laura Thanks for that suggestion- we've been working sheep about 3 times a week, so we have that- except now the weather tanked My yard is decent sized- the dogs play, and Danny's real good in the house- quiet, unless Lucy gets him to play ;)Typical bitch, rules everything. Truth be told, if there was something else I could do at the house, like work ducks, or something, I would Did you all see that guinea pig and BC video I put up on my blog? Anyway, Danny isn't one of those "hyper" BCs, I suppose mainly from genetics, and also, I taught him to chill as a pup. One of his claim to fames, is when he is tied after working sheep, he will fall asleep sitting up... He's a dang good boy. Hey Julie, there's a ball with the flag on it - Tuff something or other?? It's supposed to be industrial strength, harder to kill, and easier on the teeth. On the relatively rare occasion that I do toss a ball for my dogs I use those. I only toss them a few times though as my yard is small, and the balls get slimy fast. I hate slimy balls. Ick. Anyway, I believe I used to get them at Petsmart. When you have limitations like living in the city (as I do) you're sometimes forced to be more creative. I spend a lot of time dragging my dogs to my friends' places (many thanks be to them) so that they can stretch their legs. Sometimes we do what we have to in order to make things work. I'll admit that tossing a ball makes me cringe so I rarely do it. But there was a time (in the days BS - before sheep) when my dogs and I did a lot of it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kelpiegirl Posted December 10, 2009 Author Report Share Posted December 10, 2009 No tenderfoot here I do allow my dogs free play. Right now, the dogs- all of them are sacked out, including Danny. Since I work a full time job, I want him exercised before I leave, and we play a bit when I come home, otherwise it's chill time. By the way, my Kelpie has more endurance than any dog I have ever seen, will chill all day long, but is at the ready when we go. I also played with her when she was a pup, like I do with Danny. When they are adults, we aren't as regimented. My parents live in the BEST neighborhood for walks. WISH I lived there. I would ALSO be skinnier! oh good grief, both of you! This is what is wrong with a lot of dog training anymore. You can't tell people the truth for all the hurt feelings and tender psyches. Better to let the dog get hurt, or perpetuate a mindless *activity* instead of risking the fall out from speaking up. KG - if you want change you will find a way. My dogs mostly play a hour or so each day with each other, or just lope around the yard. It's more on the weekends often, much more, and during some weeks it's much less lately. Some of them worked and played their little fannies off last weekend, but this week has been all about paperwork so they will get about 30 minues of free play morning and night. Otherwise its house lounging, crate, or kennel. I'll probably work some agility this weekend with those that do that - between catch up on sheep work from being going last weekend. There is no set schedule, and I can fairly say that my dogs are fit. BJ - there are countless low activity/low physical stress things DW can do with Annie to stimulate her mind instead of throwing a ball endlessly. Or is this about what DW likes, or what Annie needs? Nothing wrong with either, or a combination thereof, but lets be honest about whats going on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PSmitty Posted December 10, 2009 Report Share Posted December 10, 2009 I'm still trying to figure out what is wrong with using fetch a one of the forms of exercise for a Border Collie. Maybe I'm lucky, but it hasn't led to neurotic hyper fit dogs here. I find it is a simple way to exercise 3 dogs at the same time. It isn't the the only thing I do with my dogs but it sure is part of it. Sometimes we play with rules, sometimes without. Yesterday we had nasty weather that started early in the afternoon. The dogs had two 10 minute sessions of fetch earlier in the day and some mental training indoors. Two of them wrestled around a little inside off and on. Then they just chilled for most of the evening. All three, including the one y/o. Yes they still can think, they still work, they still get mentally stimulating training. I guess I just don't see anything wrong with having a few mindless games as well. Count me in this camp as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Root Beer Posted December 10, 2009 Report Share Posted December 10, 2009 Count me in this camp as well. Me three! That was well said! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ooky Posted December 10, 2009 Report Share Posted December 10, 2009 I know Karen and Wendy are only trying to help. And I had to sit here telling myself that for a few minutes before this response, because I have some intermittant hormonal rage that tends to happen lately, which is no one's fault! But I guess I read the "pet people's" responses, and I see a lot of people trying to have fun with their dogs, enjoying a game, some of them training their dogs at the same time, too. I'm not reading nor assuming that they let or encourage their dogs to get dangerous and crazy. On the other side, I see a huge playing up of how unsafe fetch is, and some fairly obnoxious judgemental statements about people wanting to just mindlessly tire their dogs out, not realizing how neurotic their dogs must be and how much they, the pet owners, must be encouraging that. I don't play fetch enough for it to be what "tires" Odin out from day to day, because we only do it a few times a week. But from the tone, I don't know that you'd even believe that - I am a mindless ball tossing pet person with a neurotic dog. When his ACL tears, it will be ALL MY FAULT, and then I'll be sorry. No seriously, if it did tear playing fetch, I would be sorry! But I'm certainly not shooting for that and in fact am actively trying to prevent it. But again, I feel these comments leave no room for that. I'm sure Wendy and Karen will both disagree vigorously, which is their right, but I read the tone as, "you play fetch, you are kind of a bit of a moron, or at least just a lazy owner with no desire to train your dog." Now, again, I DO realize fetch is not an entirely safe activity, in large part thanks to previous comments of Wendy's and Karen's. And BCs do not act like typical other dogs in a game of fetch. And I structure, and limit my fetch sessions because of this. We have for all intents and purposes given up frisbee for this reason too! But I'm not willing to give it up entirely until I get that farm that I swear by DOG someday I know I'm gonna get, and maybe not even then. I like it, DH likes it even more, kids that Odin meets like it a lot, and Odin LOVES it. And if someone else wants to do frisbee, or fetch with their dog, I don't see the need to jump to the worst conclusion possible. To get logical, what if a dog gets an ACL tear playing agility? I know it does happen. Beacuse fetch is the most dangerous activity, is it definitely a person's fault if it happens in that arena (also because in your opinions, it has absolutely no value?) But because it is less likely to happen in agility, and that does have value, it is just an unfortunate occurrence if it happens on the agility field (or whatever you call it)? Or even hobby herding? When we first moved in, Odin actually fell down the stairs, BADLY, for no reason, and I thought he had hurt himself. I mean, with these guys, it seems to me activtity in general = risk, and it depends just as much on the individual dog's personality and genetic build as the specific activity (as in, all these things come into play). Anyway, I guess I'm just saying I have learned a lot from you guys, and will continue to. But this seems like a soapbox to some degree. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sweet_ceana Posted December 10, 2009 Report Share Posted December 10, 2009 It seems we have two different issues that have popped up, both of which I find interesting. The first and foremost being the mental benefits a dog can get from playing fetch. While I agree fetch isn't going to stretch the mind of the dog like herding etc..., I do believe that there is an important bonding factor between a dog and person when they play games like fetch. Obviously there are other ways to bond with your dog, fetch is just one way to get to town. As others have stated there are a lot of ways to incorporate training with playing fetch, so the activity is easy to build on. Playing for playing's sake is something that we share with dogs. Not all animals play past adolecence. Silly play like fetch has its merits as a way to share that uncommon tendancy both species have to play. If either species didn't get something out of it, it wouldn't be a trait that was passed on in all of us. (You could argue here as well that what dogs got out of goofy playing was resources for survival from people and that is their sole motivation, but I'm not going all the way down that road today.) No one here has stated that fetch is all they do, I doubt this is what anyone is advocating. There is a valid point to the statement that you get out of a border collie what you put in. You cannot just physically exercise your border collie and get a good dog. The "border collie's take a lot of exercise," statement makes me cringe a bit. I would say the majority of us here know that if all you do is run your dog, that is all your dog will do. Through the work I have been doing with rescue I can see why that misstatement is used so often. For some people a "dog that needs a lot of work," is a dog that needs a bath. Or, a dog that needs "a lot of your time," is one that you let in the house with you. When you say the word exercise, all of a sudden people realise that they have to be an active participant, and for many, they are no longer interested. I find this observation terribly sad. The second issue is the physical benefits and risks of fetch. There are risks to your dog getting hurt when they run, jump in the air, or dive to the ground to get something. IMHO the reason many of us play games like fetch or frisbee with our dogs is to add physical exercise to their routine. Much like I do yoga and lift weights because I enjoy it, I play soccer and frisbee with my dogs because my dogs and I enjoy it. Most of us won't exercise unless we enjoy what we are doing, and many of us live lives that don't let us exercise ourselves and our dogs in the way that an active farm does. I don't think anyone plays fetch if they hate it. If I could take herding lessons more than once a month, believe me I would. My husband is already scouting places to look for houses so that we can have sheep of our own. Until we are able to move to that dream house we will continue to work our dog's minds on and off sheep and play soccer, frisbee, and occasionaly fetch with our chuck it balls. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoloRiver Posted December 10, 2009 Report Share Posted December 10, 2009 I play fetch with my dogs. It's something they enjoy immensely. When I discover something that they enjoy immensely, I think to myself, "How can I use this to train them to do other stuff?" Lots of good training happens when the reward is a thrown ball, because they LOVE chasing the ball. That said, having dealt with Solo's joint problems I am mindful of how I throw the ball and how they go after it and try to modify the game to make it lower impact. I've known plenty of working dogs who have arthritis and sustained injuries in the line of work so in terms of physical impact I don't think fetch is a particularly evil game to play with dogs. I do mix it up with other activities (like free walking/running, mostly) and they (well mostly Jett now) work sheep so it isn't their only recreational activity. As far as ball of choice, in this house we use racquetballs. They don't go far, because they're so light, but for Solo that's a plus. I like them because they don't get soggy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sue R Posted December 10, 2009 Report Share Posted December 10, 2009 Well, a lot happened while I was at work! I use rubber Chuck-It balls, the few Buddy Glow Balls I have stashed away (good for after-dark and before-daylight games), and a soft but amazingly durable light rubbery ball I get from Helping Udders (doesn't go so far because it's so light but is also good because it's easy to catch and very safe on the teeth, and makes a very slight whistle when it flies so the dogs can follow the motion when they can't see it too well). If I could find the old-fashioned Pinkies of my childhood, I'd try them, too. Lots of good alternatives out there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lizmo Posted December 10, 2009 Report Share Posted December 10, 2009 We do a combination of several games to play fetch, so I don't just practice mindless ball throwing. We do too. Sometimes if he needs to just *run* if we've been cooped up in the house all day, then I'll throw the ball for him. But generally if I have a ball, it's going to be used for training purposes. We mix up ball 'playing/training' alot. We do lots of what Karen talked about, by throwing the ball THEN releasing him. Usually we do alot of calling off before getting to the ball, making him lie down on his way to get the ball, calling back to me, and whatever else I can think of to make it different. The run into things, each other, rip crutiates spinning after erratic bounces, tear pads etc. I'm finding Blaze has started doing this more. He will just take *OFF* then sliiiiiide. Unless the ball is throw really far, then he has a bit more sense to slow down before he gets to the ball. We've pretty much stopped mindless ball throwing for now since he seemed to have lost his sense of judgement. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Journey Posted December 10, 2009 Report Share Posted December 10, 2009 BJ - I think you and I are on different road in the term "mindless" the term is designated for the DOG - not the people. I am sorry if you took it wrong in context it's "mindless" for the dog. Ooky, everyone get's hormonal rages, it's when you can rein it in that you are ahead of the game. Yes, there are many activities that are dangerous, no you can't place them in a padded room (though that's where some belong!). To me though, "mindless fetch" (not the games you expressed in an earlier post) injuries are avoidable to an extent. Sweet Ceana, great post, thanks! Anda, you are so right about them being training opportunities! That's the positive and a wonderful way to look at things! RB, hope things are looking better for you and that 2010 is "uneventful"! Have fun dancing! Merry Christmas everyone, see ya Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
juliepoudrier Posted December 11, 2009 Report Share Posted December 11, 2009 Okay, just afew observations from someone who used to play fetch and frisbee with my dogs and who occasionally still plays fetch with pinecones or if at a pond, with balls that float. 1. Playing fetch with dogs in a group is risky unless only one dog at a time is allowed to do the fetching. Back when I still played ball with the dogs as a group, I had a dog bitten in the face by another as they both went for the ball (the bite wasn't intentional--teeth connected with face as they both went for the ball) and I've got another dog with a permanent (fortunately not disabling) shoulder injury thanks to being slammed into by another dog. I've seen dogs slam into trees and the like because they're so intent on the item being fetched and not really looking where they're going. Nowadays if we're out walking on the "back 40" I will sometimes toss or kick pinecones for the dogs, but I have to be careful and pay attention to what the others are doing because Pip, for example, thinks it's great fun to try to head off (at full speed of course) any other dog who's going after a pine cone. I try to avoid collisions at all costs, which is why I rarely bother to throw anything anymore. 2. Even if the dog is playing alone, it's very easy for them to injure themselves in their enthusiasm. Right before the Edgeworth SDT in October, I threw a pine cone for Kat and in the process of retrieving it she ripped off a toenail and was too lame to run in the trial. I've had injuries like this happen fairly often, as well as sprained/strained toes. Willow actually broke a bone in her leg (metatarsal bone) when she planted a hind leg and spun while trying to snag a ball rolling on the ground. I have two dogs (Willow and Boy) who have knocked out teeth diving for balls rolling on the ground. 3. As you can imagine, these incidents and others finally made me pretty much stop playing fetch with the dogs. Because of my *personal* experiences with injuries while playing fetch with dogs, I choose to do so now only on an extremely limited basis. I will sometimes play catch, where I lob a pine cone directly to a dog to catch (no running necessary), but either my dogs are just terribly accident prone or playing fetch makes them accident prone. Either way I got tired of the vet bills and dogs out of commission when I needed them to be sound and whole, so I pretty much stopped. BTW, Willow was an amazing frisbee dog and I was sorry that I stopped that with her, but she's also a dog who knows no limits (balls to the wall in everything she does) and since she was completely heedless of damaging herself, the safest thing to do was just stop. 4. Pine cones are as great a risk as balls when it comes to dogs slamming their mouths into the ground, so I really can't say that using pine cones is better. But they are free! When Twist was a pup, the only ball I would let her play fetch with was a Holee roller, because it was easy to grab on the fly without bending over much or slamming her mouth toward the ground at speed while chasing it. 5. I really miss having a pond next door. The best exercise I could ever give my dogs year round was fetching balls in a pond. As either Karen or Wendy noted, in a pond the dog is swimming and the ball is floating, so the fetching behaviors that could cause injury on land don't exist. I'd kill to still have easy access to a pond. 6. What do I do for my dogs for exercise? Long walks two or three times a day. Yes, I have the luxury of some acreage on which to walk them and they can go at their own pace, dive into puddles, dig, chase one another, or whatever. Yes, I also have sheep in my backyard. But other than the minimal daily chores, the dogs don't get worked daily, so they're not getting that for exercise. They actually seem pretty darn content to just hang out with me. I very occasionally play fetch with the puppy in the house--very few throws, very short distances. I will play tug some and they have plenty of cow hooves to chew. No one is going insane with this rather limited exercise schedule. As a side note, I also have had two dogs injured with sticks. Willow (who else?) was one. A boy tossed a stick for her and she caught it end first and ended up with a puncture wound in the roof of her mouth right at her esophagus. Twist injured herself in a similar manner while chewing on a stick when it slipped and stabbed the roof of her mouth. The only time I play with sticks with my dogs is if I can throw the stick into a body of water because the stick will be floating when the dog gets to it, so I don't have to worry about injuries like the one Willow sustained. Anyway, obviously me and my dogs are something of the Calamity Janes of the world of playing fetch, but it really was enough to turn me off to the whole thing. My dogs still try to get me to throw things for them, but they are seldom rewarded and they don't seem any the worse for it. Not passing judgment on anyone, just elaborating on the risks that others have mentioned. I believe when Karen mentions mindless entertainment, she's referring to the behaviors like I've described here that can result in injury, sometimes severe. The dog is often thinking of nothing but "gotta get that ball" and so is mindless of its own safety and wellbeing. Like I said, maybe I've just been extraordinarily unlucky, but interestingly, none of the younger dogs--whom I've never really played fetch or frisbee with--have had the kind of injuries that the older dogs have.... Just my two cents and using myself and my dogs as an example that Karen isn't just being alarmist. J. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shetlander Posted December 11, 2009 Report Share Posted December 11, 2009 I used to find fetch a boring activity -- until Quinn. His joy in the game is infectious. We have a number of variations to the game, but the majority of the time it is simply me throwing and him retrieving the ball or the Frisbee. Mindless, relaxing and the only way he can truly run, given where we live. I like the rubber chuck-it balls, myself but need to check out the whistling version! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
geonni banner Posted December 11, 2009 Report Share Posted December 11, 2009 Being agoraphobic I “don’t get out much.” That is to say, I can’t go far without having anxiety problems. I don’t drive, so my dog’s exercise options are limited. We do fetch and Frisbee a lot. There’s a big vacant lot half a block from my place. She loves it, and I love watching her love it. It gets me out every day, and pushing on that invisible barrier that would push me back into the house and not let me out if I didn’t push back. (I was housebound for 5 years, so I know whereof I speak here.) I’ve had dogs all my life. Sometimes one, sometimes three or four. They all did a lot of fetch and not one of them ever got hurt at it. Now, I know from my experience with Sugarfoot that BCs are different from “other dogs,” and I have seen for myself how Sugar is much more intense (about everything) than other dogs. Maybe this is why some of you have had experiences with injuries with fetching games. I understand that BCs need mental exercise as much as the physical kind, and I do things every day with my dog that challenge her mentally. Some of what I do is training, some is simple games like “find it.” But really, sometimes it seems that it gets to be a competition between owners to see how many behaviors you can train. When I was a kid there was a TV commercial for Kennel Ration dog food that went, “My dog’s bigger than your dog, my dog’s bigger than yours…” The new version is, “My dog knows 273 behaviors and has a vocabulary of 1001 words.” I’m a pet owner. I’m not a rancher or a serious dog sport competitor and probably will never be either, given my financial prospects, but I can tell when my dog is happy. And she’s happy when we play ball, play Frisbee, wrestle, play tug-o-war and do training. She’s also happy when we just hang out or cuddle. I’m saving my pennies to take my dog to sheep in the spring. If it goes well then I will try to scrape together enough for us to get monthly lessons. I’m doing it for both of us. If we can expand our horizons and do a fulfilling activity, I’m all for it. Being on the BC Boards for a few months has helped me to understand a lot of things, like why the AKC sucks, and how BCs should be bred for working traits and working traits alone, and lots of other things that I can pass on to my dog-owning friends. I have nothing but admiration for those who raise, train, work and trial Border Collies. You are special people with special dogs. But I wouldn’t trade my long-legged little nutball rescue dog for the best trial dog on four legs. She’s MY dog, and the best in the world to me. We play fetch. And we love it! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShoresDog Posted December 11, 2009 Report Share Posted December 11, 2009 This thread is very strange and, in between some good advice and suggestions, it's kind of offensive. Why would Lenajo and Journey automatically assume that playing fetch is necessarily mindless, repetitive, and dangerous? Given that most people who post here really care about their dogs quite a lot, wouldn't it make more sense -- and be a lot more constructive -- to start with an assumption that the posters were playing with their dogs in creative and safety-conscious ways? "Fetch" encompasses a whole lot of different ways of playing and can incorporate a lot of training and reinforcement of self-control etc. I got my back up a bit reading this -- I'd just returned from spending an hour on the beach with Daisy, ball and Chuck-it in hand. She'd been on her own most of the day, and we needed some outdoor, run-around time. We live in a pretty dense neighborhood, and dogs are supposed to be on-leash at all times, so without getting in the car and driving somewhere, the beach early in the morning or late in the evening is our outlet. Anyhow, we walked along the beach in the dark, Daisy wearing a flashing light, enjoying many of our favorite ball-play variations. Daisy doing long down-stays followed by a huge ball toss in her direction; Daisy retrieving the ball from the water; Daisy carrying it out into the water, dropping it, and watching the waves carry it back to shore; me trying to throw the ball over the Scripps Pier (possible with a Chuck-it!); digging holes and burying it (that would be Daisy); hiding the ball under the big piles of kelp that Monday's storm deposited (that would be me or Daisy); etc., etc. It was just play, for crying out loud, and it wasn't repetitive or obsessive. In fact, I get a lot of entertainment out of how creative Daisy's variations can be! And you should see her try to get Juno to play her games, when she's along. In my view, it's good exercise and good fun. And those of you who have property where your dogs can be outside playing with each other or "loping around" should try to remember that not everyone has that luxury. My dogs mostly play a hour or so each day with each other, or just lope around the yard. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
martySQ Posted December 11, 2009 Report Share Posted December 11, 2009 I hesitate to make a reply... seems the topic here has shifted and I don't want to post something wrong. in the wrong spot.. I don't like the tennis ball style chuck it balls... mostly because they are heavy, easy to chew the fuzz off of, and they are 2 halves of a rubber ball glued together. They fall apart very easily. I'd like to find the solid ones. We have tennis balls fall victim to the lawn mower now and then too..so it's hard at first look to know if it is dog mangled or mower mangled. We had a cheap dog toy tennis ball that Bess pulled the cover of fuzz off of, and that is her all time favorite rubber ball. It is light, bounces well, and doesn't hold the slobber much, and none of the grit... wish I could remember where that one came from. Funny... the cover of fuzz came off in one piece it seems if I remember right. It does show where the seams would have been though, so maybe it came off in 2 pieces. Bess will bring her Kongs to me to toss if she is out of balls sometimes too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alaska Posted December 11, 2009 Report Share Posted December 11, 2009 If you find this "boring", I feel sorry for you: I give my dogs 5 or 10 tosses with the Chuckit every morning before I leave for work, and I don't care who knows it! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kelpiegirl Posted December 11, 2009 Author Report Share Posted December 11, 2009 So, last night, after I had just found that a tumor had reappeared in one of my dogs, and had logged off the computer, Danny went out for his last bathroom break for the evening, and slipped on the paver (ice), he immediately came up lame. No ball play there. Just a stupid mis-step. With me blaming myself for their being ice there. This morning he appears okay, but I won't be playing retrieve until ice is gone. Poor boy, this morning really stunk for him. I guess that's just growing up. It honestly was just too cold- 19 degrees for me to be out there too! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shetlander Posted December 11, 2009 Report Share Posted December 11, 2009 If you find this "boring", I feel sorry for you: I give my dogs 5 or 10 tosses with the Chuckit every morning before I leave for work, and I don't care who knows it! Love the photo! Before this turns into a 12 Step Meeting ("My dog's name is Quinn and we play lots of fetch every day." "Hi, Quinn's person!"), here is a favorite photo of Quinn playing one of his versions of "Extreme Frisbee": kelpiegirl, hope your doggies will all be ok! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PSmitty Posted December 11, 2009 Report Share Posted December 11, 2009 This thread is very strange and, in between some good advice and suggestions, it's kind of offensive. Why would Lenajo and Journey automatically assume that playing fetch is necessarily mindless, repetitive, and dangerous? Given that most people who post here really care about their dogs quite a lot, wouldn't it make more sense -- and be a lot more constructive -- to start with an assumption that the posters were playing with their dogs in creative and safety-conscious ways? "Fetch" encompasses a whole lot of different ways of playing and can incorporate a lot of training and reinforcement of self-control etc. I got my back up a bit reading this -- I'd just returned from spending an hour on the beach with Daisy, ball and Chuck-it in hand. She'd been on her own most of the day, and we needed some outdoor, run-around time. We live in a pretty dense neighborhood, and dogs are supposed to be on-leash at all times, so without getting in the car and driving somewhere, the beach early in the morning or late in the evening is our outlet. <snip> And those of you who have property where your dogs can be outside playing with each other or "loping around" should try to remember that not everyone has that luxury. I was out last night and just now catching up. I gotta agree 100% with Ooky and Jan. They just said it better than I could have. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
juliepoudrier Posted December 11, 2009 Report Share Posted December 11, 2009 Wow, I certainly didn't mean to offend anyone. Just wanted to note that the risk of fetch games is real. Obviously I still play fetch some, but on a limited basis, because I'm still managing to damage my dogs.... Jan, I have to say that if I had a beach to play fetch at, I'd be there every day if I could! Twist and I played a lot of fetch when she was a pup and I worked in Hampton, VA, and could take her to the beach daily. That was so much fun, and I think the sand made it a whole lot safer for her. Julie, I hope Danny just tweaked something and will be a-ok and that your vet can come up with a treatment plan for Nikke that gives her another few years with you. J. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
urge to herd Posted December 11, 2009 Report Share Posted December 11, 2009 I was gonna stay out of this one, but yeah, we were fetch-a-holics once upon a time, before old age crept up on the dogs. When I first got Samantha, I literally did not know what a border collie was. The trainers I knew, (none of whom were herding or working dog trainers) told me to give her plenty of physical exercise and to teach her lots of tricks to keep her from being bored. So, that's what I did. And that's pretty much how it went with Shonie and Buzz. I'll do things a little differently with the next beasties, because of what I've learned, but fetch will be part of any dog's life who lives with us. It's got a lot of things to recommend it, IMO. Can a dog get hurt? Sure, but anyone can get hurt pretty much doing anything. Do us humans need to be mindful and make it an interactive sort of thing? Sure again, but where is that not true in any intelligent animal's world? It's a game that is hightly adaptable in lots of situations, and is so easily used as a training tool. Why would I give it up? Ruth Sam and Shonie - We don't get to play fetch nearly enough anymore, just because we're old and creaky Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.