BorderCollieSam Posted November 19, 2009 Author Report Share Posted November 19, 2009 Funny story -- my husband was repairing on old barn on a retired farmer's property. All day long he carried tools into the barn and the old Border Collie laid there watching him, even let him pet him and feed him treats. When Ken started to carry the tools out of the barn, the dog sat in front of the door and without even growling, let it be known that Ken wouldn't be getting past him. Ken laid down the tools, and the dog let him pass to get the owner, who called him aside so Ken could remove his tools. That's the kind of protection money can't buy Liz Reminds me of a dog my aunt had years ago called Snoopy Was some sort of Heinz 57 (are you aware of that phrase on the other side of the pond?), he would let you in the house, but getting out of the house without being chased and barked at was a different story altogether! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
geonni banner Posted November 19, 2009 Report Share Posted November 19, 2009 If you are so fortunate as to have never needed a general anesthetic, you may not be aware that it sometimes takes a couple of days for the residual effects to wear off. Also, even Border Collies usually have the sense to slow down when their body has been through trauma. (Unless someone is waving a sheep at them.) I've seen hundreds of spays and neuters and it usually takes the mickey out of a critter for a few days. By the time your boy gets his stitches out he'll be his old self again. Meantime, easy does it. My little rip-snorter of a bitch was positively sedate for a few days, but it didn't take her long to make up for lost hell-raising! She did have a bunch of hot-pink stitches that she never so much as licked - a first, in my experience. Keep an eye on him if he's not wearing an e-collar. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mbc1963 Posted November 20, 2009 Report Share Posted November 20, 2009 As to the question of shrinkage... Yup, it shrinks. When I first got my dog, he had a big old bag a'danglin'. To the point where I asked my vet: don't they snip that skin off?! It looks like he's going to get it snagged on something! Honestly - it was a quite long, loose flap of skin. Yeesh. (The people at the shelter said, "Yes, your dog was quite well-endowed." Not sure if they meant that as a compliment or what. Given that I'm a female, I wasn't that impressed.) It flapped around for maybe a month or so, and then one day I noticed that it was gone. I'm not sure what exactly happens to it, but it will go away. Mary Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mariji Posted November 20, 2009 Report Share Posted November 20, 2009 Excuse me for butting in, but It is important for people to understand that neutering and spaying is not desexing an animal. Sex is what the chromosomes say. Sex is not the "fancy on the outside or fancy on the inside" (as per Mr. Rogers...) equipment the animal has.. Nobody here calls it neutering or spaying, at least far and few between. I don't want to get technical with terminology as "technically" t isn't correct but it is what we call it here in Australia. Mariji, try this link and it will give you more food for thought as to when to spay/neuter your pup - Early Spay Considerations Thanks so much for that. I was adamant on my choice but since reading this thread i was unsure again. I think i may leave it now like i did with my older girl and be very wary if she does come on heat. My vet told me that it is generally a problem when they get older as they have more fat but because my dogs are lean he said Myla was not a hassle to "desex". After all there were no complications whith Myla so hopefully it will as smooth with Echo. It is such a scary time. I was terrified but my girl was like what are you worrying about. She was back to running around (even though i tried to limit her) and was back training in 2 weeks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shetlander Posted November 20, 2009 Report Share Posted November 20, 2009 however none of you were present at the scene and on each occasion it was literally an uninterested stroll with head in the air and then all of a sudden a quick cock leg and wee Nope, wasn't present so won't comment on how quick or crafty your pup was. Still however difficult it may be to know when he will pee on people or inappropriate objects, you can do a good bit of management to not let the behavior occur. So in your example of chatting with people where he has suddenly peed on them, you can be proactive and put Sam in a sit stay or down stay when you stop to you chat. Can't lift his leg on people if he is lounging like a good boy at your feet. In addition to not being able to practice the bad behavior, he is instead practicing acceptable behavior. Same thing with entering the vet's. As soon as you stop by the desk to check in, place him in a sit stay. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
juliepoudrier Posted November 20, 2009 Report Share Posted November 20, 2009 ^^ Exactly. And he doesn't even have to be on a leash. J. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BorderCollieSam Posted November 20, 2009 Author Report Share Posted November 20, 2009 Nope, wasn't present so won't comment on how quick or crafty your pup was. Still however difficult it may be to know when he will pee on people or inappropriate objects, you can do a good bit of management to not let the behavior occur. So in your example of chatting with people where he has suddenly peed on them, you can be proactive and put Sam in a sit stay or down stay when you stop to you chat. Can't lift his leg on people if he is lounging like a good boy at your feet. In addition to not being able to practice the bad behavior, he is instead practicing acceptable behavior. Same thing with entering the vet's. As soon as you stop by the desk to check in, place him in a sit stay. I understand exactly where you are coming from, however although i don't want my dog peeing up people (honestly) i also don't want to be too regimental with him. He knows his commands, performs them pretty much faultlessly, is very responsive and obedient, and i like to give him freedom and let him feel relaxed until we do our training.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shetlander Posted November 20, 2009 Report Share Posted November 20, 2009 I understand exactly where you are coming from, however although i don't want my dog peeing up people (honestly) i also don't want to be too regimental with him. I'm hardly regimental with my dogs but if I had one who was developing such an obnoxious behavior, yeah, I'd do everything I could to prevent the behavior from becoming ingrained and therefore harder to break. Plus, and this is just me, I don't see having my dog resting at my feet (not getting nose to nose with an agressive dog, not eating something I'd much rather he didn't, not wandering off, not peeing on the nice lady minding her own business, etc.) while I'm distracted as regimental. Well, good luck with the problem and hope Sam is feeling more himself today. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
juliepoudrier Posted November 20, 2009 Report Share Posted November 20, 2009 Yes, by all means don't control Sam while you're around other people chatting. Soon enough it won't matter if *you* want to socialize; no one will want to talk to you if your dog is allowed to continue to lift his leg on them because you don't want him regimented. Are you for real, or has this discussion turned into you trolling? J. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Little Bo Boop Posted November 20, 2009 Report Share Posted November 20, 2009 I would have to ask why you bother coming here to obtain advice about your dog. You have a dog that "you" have allowed to develop a bad habit. You've been given excellent advice, and what do you do? berate the folks giving the advice, and then come up with excuses as to why you can't , 'keep him on a leash', no sit stay, 'because you don't want to be 'too regimental' with him? huh? Sounds like thats what he needs. And like Julie said, keep it up and you won't have to worry about socializing much longer, the folks will be headed in the opposite direction when they see you and Prince pee stain headed in their direction. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kelpiegirl Posted November 20, 2009 Report Share Posted November 20, 2009 Weird. Seems like this topic is being haunted by a Poltergeist. First, the fact that said dog peed in the vet's office- not a big deal. I have, on occasion had several of my dogs do this. It happens, it isn't exactly free of other dog smell, and a fun place. Second, watch the scrotum- some dogs can have complications where there is a bleeder in there- a blood vessel was not adequately crushed, or ligated, and you can have a build up of blood, which can be major in some instances, and must be dealt with with promptness. Third, keep him quiet for now- do what the vet tells you to do, and look for issues with the incision- undue swelling, redness, and pus. Fourth, dogs will embarrass you sometimes, not matter what you do. I have a Boxer who one day, while at a dog show, walked up to a girl I didn't really like, and lifted his leg on her. Luckily it was raining, and she was wearing her Frog Togs. Anyway, good luck with your boy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sue R Posted November 20, 2009 Report Share Posted November 20, 2009 Thanks to Julie P, Karen, and many others who have given good advice. Of course, it's all largely been refuted, in anticipation of which is why I have kept my fingers off the keyboard except for one post early on. Giving sound advice to some people is like throwing water at a duck - it just rolls right off or, perhaps even more so, the duck will just shake it off if it's not to his liking. Special thanks to Boop and Julie, for saying what I have avoided saying but which needed to be said. I should know by now to not even read topics posted by BCS, who knows everything there is to know anyway, and certainly not to care about Sam because, after all, BCS already knows everything there is to know about dog care. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shetlander Posted November 20, 2009 Report Share Posted November 20, 2009 Weird. Seems like this topic is being haunted by a Poltergeist. Huh? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Laura L Posted November 20, 2009 Report Share Posted November 20, 2009 BCS your dog is still young, still learning, you've been given some good advice why not just try it? Wasn't that the reason that you were asking? No need to tell anyone if works, then there won't be a chance for them to say "I told you so". Laura Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kelpiegirl Posted November 20, 2009 Report Share Posted November 20, 2009 In reference to a dog getting neutered, and FOUR pages of bluster that follows Huh? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maralynn Posted November 20, 2009 Report Share Posted November 20, 2009 I understand exactly where you are coming from, however although i don't want my dog peeing up people (honestly) i also don't want to be too regimental with him. He knows his commands, performs them pretty much faultlessly, is very responsive and obedient, and i like to give him freedom and let him feel relaxed until we do our training.... He's a teenager. He needs structure and guidelines. Especially if he's peeing on people... It's not going to hurt him to put him in a down stay for a few minutes and people will be impressed by well behaved he is. If you had a toddler that kept running up and hitting people, would you allow him freedom to continue doing so? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mum24dog Posted November 20, 2009 Report Share Posted November 20, 2009 I understand exactly where you are coming from, however although i don't want my dog peeing up people (honestly) i also don't want to be too regimental with him. He knows his commands, performs them pretty much faultlessly, is very responsive and obedient, and i like to give him freedom and let him feel relaxed until we do our training.... The purpose of training ought to be so that your dog will perform the necessary behaviour when you need it in real life. This is one of those occasions. If you don't use what you have taught your dog, what was the point? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Journey Posted November 20, 2009 Report Share Posted November 20, 2009 Actually the neutering of Sam will be a great benefit to the breed. After all since we're "too regimented" there will not be any unwanted puppies while this dog is acting like a miscreant and pissing off (or rather ON) people. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Little Bo Boop Posted November 20, 2009 Report Share Posted November 20, 2009 I know someone who'd appreciate a little regimentation ;-) If not for us, do it for Frosty! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Samsonsworld Posted November 20, 2009 Report Share Posted November 20, 2009 LOL! He doesn't look good in yellow. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anda Posted November 20, 2009 Report Share Posted November 20, 2009 Poor snowman.. not even in Colorado is he safe from the yellow stream Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BorderCollieSam Posted November 22, 2009 Author Report Share Posted November 22, 2009 I would have to ask why you bother coming here to obtain advice about your dog. You have a dog that "you" have allowed to develop a bad habit. You've been given excellent advice, and what do you do? berate the folks giving the advice, and then come up with excuses as to why you can't , 'keep him on a leash', no sit stay, 'because you don't want to be 'too regimental' with him? huh? Sounds like thats what he needs. And like Julie said, keep it up and you won't have to worry about socializing much longer, the folks will be headed in the opposite direction when they see you and Prince pee stain headed in their direction. Little Bo Boop, There is Advice and there is Sarcasm and in some posts there is damn right rudeness. However, i certainly don't mind rudeness or Sarcasm, i actually like a bit of banter, providing the offender can accept a little in return, which many have already displayed a reluctness to accept. As for advice, take a look at the post by Kelpiegirl above, that is advice......without the rudeness.... Back on topic. With regard to me loosing the socialisation due to Sam peeing on people, many in the park have allready started wearing their waterproof trousers......... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BorderCollieSam Posted November 22, 2009 Author Report Share Posted November 22, 2009 Thanks to Julie P, Karen, and many others who have given good advice. Of course, it's all largely been refuted, in anticipation of which is why I have kept my fingers off the keyboard except for one post early on. Giving sound advice to some people is like throwing water at a duck - it just rolls right off or, perhaps even more so, the duck will just shake it off if it's not to his liking. Special thanks to Boop and Julie, for saying what I have avoided saying but which needed to be said. I should know by now to not even read topics posted by BCS, who knows everything there is to know anyway, and certainly not to care about Sam because, after all, BCS already knows everything there is to know about dog care. Have you got an issue with male 'quak quaks'? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BorderCollieSam Posted November 22, 2009 Author Report Share Posted November 22, 2009 BCS your dog is still young, still learning, you've been given some good advice why not just try it? Wasn't that the reason that you were asking? No need to tell anyone if works, then there won't be a chance for them to say "I told you so". Laura I don't mind accepting being wrong, however to 'some' on this forum if you aren't prepared to accept their advice due to any number of reasons that you don't agree with, they seem to take it personally and need to result to sarcasm, rudeness, and when i return the same level of response they go into defence mode! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BorderCollieSam Posted November 22, 2009 Author Report Share Posted November 22, 2009 The purpose of training ought to be so that your dog will perform the necessary behaviour when you need it in real life. This is one of those occasions. If you don't use what you have taught your dog, what was the point? Yes i quite agree, however when the other owners dog is running around in the field i think its a little unfair on Sam to be grounded, literally, don't you? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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