border_collie_crazy Posted August 9, 2009 Report Share Posted August 9, 2009 ok, today got me curious about the way BCs are built. my mom suggested that most working BCs are not built as well as they should be, she feels that they would be better built the way Happy is, while many are, most are built more like Misty--solidly. the reason is heat. she suggested that the reason the heat does not affect Happy the way it effects Misty is because Happy has a super deep chest that allows better circulation. in more detail: Happy is build exacly like a whippet..I mean her measurments and height/weight all fit EXACTLY that of a whippet. "well defined" tuck is an understatement, her chest is exactly TWICE the size of her waist, she is tall, light and willowy but not breakable. when she moves she trots in short quick steps. Happy is older, heavily coated and Black. Misty is built more like most BCs, strong and lean, but much more solid, and her height/weight raitio is much more typical for a BC, when she moves she trots in long easy steps. misty is younger, smooth coated and half white. the situation: today I took them for a walk, I didnt realize how hot it was so I didnt have water on me, about 20 minuts in, Misty started getting wobbly and dragging her feet, and her tounge was nearly down to the ground, her lips soaked with saliva and dripping, I veered off into the canopy of a local school and had her lay on the cool cement while I called for help, when help arrived with water, Misty needed it desperatly and drank almost the entire container then and there. while all this was going on..Happy wasnt phased a bit, wasnt thirsty, and barley even panting. Im really not sure what to think of my moms point, is she right? is Happy built better to last doing the job? in which case, what about the rest of the working BC popluation that built like Misty? are they not doing just fine? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ejano Posted August 9, 2009 Report Share Posted August 9, 2009 ok, today got me curious about the way BCs are built. my mom suggested that most working BCs are not built as well as they should be, she feels that they would be better built the way Happy is, while many are, most are built more like Misty--solidly. the reason is heat. she suggested that the reason the heat does not affect Happy the way it effects Misty is because Happy has a super deep chest that allows better circulation. in more detail: Happy is build exacly like a whippet..I mean her measurments and height/weight all fit EXACTLY that of a whippet. "well defined" tuck is an understatement, her chest is exactly TWICE the size of her waist, she is tall, light and willowy but not breakable. when she moves she trots in short quick steps. Happy is older, heavily coated and Black. Misty is built more like most BCs, strong and lean, but much more solid, and her height/weight raitio is much more typical for a BC, when she moves she trots in long easy steps. misty is younger, smooth coated and half white. the situation: today I took them for a walk, I didnt realize how hot it was so I didnt have water on me, about 20 minuts in, Misty started getting wobbly and dragging her feet, and her tounge was nearly down to the ground, her lips soaked with saliva and dripping, I veered off into the canopy of a local school and had her lay on the cool cement while I called for help, when help arrived with water, Misty needed it desperatly and drank almost the entire container then and there. while all this was going on..Happy wasnt phased a bit, wasnt thirsty, and barley even panting. Im really not sure what to think of my moms point, is she right? is Happy built better to last doing the job? in which case, what about the rest of the working BC popluation that built like Misty? are they not doing just fine? There is a medical condition that some Border Collies are born with that does not allow them to regulate their heat and they can very quickly go into heat exhaustion....perhaps someone has more specific information on this condition....you might post a note in the health forum. Liz Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
border_collie_crazy Posted August 9, 2009 Author Report Share Posted August 9, 2009 thanks, I had thought it was just Misty, but my moms comment had me pretty confused as it seemed to me, there would be a whole lotta problems in the breed, if it was JUST the way they are built lol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2 Devils Posted August 9, 2009 Report Share Posted August 9, 2009 I can't help with the build of certain bcs determining their ability to regulate better BUT I will say next time don't let Misty drink so much water at one time. You can inadvertently cause Misty to get bloated from inhaling too much air as she drinks. You would be better off throwing the water on her belly than letting her drink too much. My Tempe overheats easily. I just keep an eye on her eyes, tongue and breathing. I can see it in Tempe's eyes that I need to quit and get her inside where it is cooler. Do some research on the board and you will see some things to do with a dog that is overheating and signs to look for... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
juliepoudrier Posted August 9, 2009 Report Share Posted August 9, 2009 The flaw with your mom's theory is that the working border collie's build comes from selection for work. It makes no more sense to say dog X is built better for its purpose than dog Y when neither dog is working stock than it does to use a conformation standard (not picking on your mom--just making a point). While a lot of breeders like dogs with deep chests, it's more for lung capacity (and therefore oxygen exchange = endurance) than for heat tolerance. As you probably know, when you want to cool a dog off quickly, you can hose down the large veins in the armpit and groin region. I don't think there's a correlation between deepness of chest and vein surface area in the armpit region, and as far as I know, that would be the only way a deeper chested dog might be better able to cool itself. It's more likely that the dogs just genetically have different heat tolerances. If they aren't acclimated to the heat, then one could be more susceptible to heat exhaustion/stroke than the other. I've seen superfit dogs of all shapes and sizes succumb to the heat, so I don't think I'd try to draw a connection between structure and heat tolerance as your mother has done. JMO. J. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
border_collie_crazy Posted August 11, 2009 Author Report Share Posted August 11, 2009 thank you! that just confirmed my own argument, her logic didnt make sence to me, but everytime I tried to argue I was just countered with "well the proof is right there isnt it" and would point to Happy..as though Happy is the end all be all of perfection lol. I know Happy is pretty darn near perfect lol, but she is hardly the end all be all of all that is good. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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