twinpines Posted August 5, 2009 Report Share Posted August 5, 2009 THE EDGE powered by AQUA OXYGEN is the USBCHA's newest sponsor. THE EDGE is a liquid water additive that I have used in my dogs for almost two years. I personally feed THE EDGE in a feed slurry once a day with the same effects as a drinking water supplement. After using this product in preparation for the 2008 National Cattledog Finals I talked them into sponsoring my dog to those finals and they have now come on board as an official USBCHA sponsor. Tim Gifford's dog Tip, USBCHA National Finals Nursery Reserve Champion has been receiving THE EDGE for over a year, and Herbert Holmes, USBCHA president has had a dog on THE EDGE this summer and has been pleased with the results. When mixed with your dog’s daily drinking water, THE EDGE Powered by AQUA OXYGEN begins to work immediately after your dog takes its first drink. The proprietary water-splitting technology provides safe and bio-available Oxygen and Hydrogen to every cell in the animal’s body. This quenches vital biological needs of your animal to allow for peak performance and recovery. Above and beyond oxygen and hydrogen, THE EDGE Powered by AQUA OXYGEN provides essential minerals and other trace elements to balance the dog’s anabolic and catabolic processes… ensuring that your dog’s metabolism is properly balanced which results in ultimate nutritional efficiency. In order to see the maximum benefits of THE EDGE an individual dog must be receiving it daily for a minimum of 30 days. The greatest benefits that I have observed in my own dogs are increased stamina, speed, and heat tolerance. To read more about my personal experiences go to www.twinpinesfarms.com/edge Or to go find out more about THE EDGE at www.theedgecanine.com This page is the official USBCHA purchase site. 10% of the gross sales price of every purchase goes directly to USBCHA coffers. Questions are welcome, check it out! Jeff Mundorf Twin Pines Farms Red Oak IA www.twinpinesfarms.com PS Special thanks to Eileen for allowing me to post this notice here! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sue R Posted August 5, 2009 Report Share Posted August 5, 2009 While I have no familiarity with this product, I am grateful for sponsorship for the USBCHA. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeltaBluez Tess Posted August 5, 2009 Report Share Posted August 5, 2009 Will it work for humans? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rebecca, Irena Farm Posted August 5, 2009 Report Share Posted August 5, 2009 Congratulations on getting a great sponsor! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pearse Posted August 5, 2009 Report Share Posted August 5, 2009 Far be it for me to discourage anyone from getting the HA more sponsorship but nothing about this product adds up, Jim's experience with his dog notwithstanding. The web page for this company is one page with no contact information and containing nothing but psuedoscientific jargon and marketing speak. I'm skeptical in the extreme, but if there is a peer reviewed independent scientific study backing any of this, I'd be more than happy to reverse my skepticism. The chemistry and biochemistry involved in the purported mode of action makes no sense. Just to take one example. The main mode of action for this magic formula is supposed to be the splitting of water to give hydrogen and oxygen, and that somehow the oxygen has all of these magical effects. Well, oxygen is oxygen and we (and our dogs) get all we need of it by breathing. Normal oxygen content in plasma is about 3% of total oxygen carriage because oxygen dissolves poorly in plasma. Most of the oxygen in the body is carried as a complex with hemoglobin which in normal humans (and dogs) is about 97% staurated already. So, no magic formula is going to significantly increase the oxygen carrying capacity of blood or fluids, and there's just no way for oxygen created in the gut to reach tissues not within a few cell diameters from the gut. Secondly, Oxygen is not a good scavenger of free radicals. In fact, oxygen is a good source of free radicals as hydroxyl ions (OH-), superoxide (O2-), and peroxide (O2 -2). Spitting water would increase the concentration of hydroxyl (OH-) and superoxide molecules. You'd be better off feeding your dog an antioxidant like vitamin E and/or vitamin C each day. I suspect that this product is a repackaged version of a product called CellFood of which Sloan Kettering says A dietary supplement manufactured by Nu Science Corporation / Deutrel Industries. The manufacturer claims that Cellfood contains 78 colloidal minerals, 17 amino acids, 34 enzymes and dissolved oxygen. This product has been offered for sale via the internet and health food stores based on the unproven theory that cancer, infections, HIV, and degenerative diseases are caused by oxygen deficiency at the cellular level. The theory suggests that delivering high levels of oxygen to body tissues can kill cancer cells, eliminate pathogens, stimulate metabolism and produce oxidative detoxification (1). These claims are based on pseudo-scientific explanations of physical phenomena and biochemical activities. None of the statements made by the company are supported by credible scientific evidence. Oxygen is not likely to be absorbed through the gastrointestinal tract when taken orally There's no principle in biochemistry that would explain the proposed method of action for this substance. It costs $64 for 32oz with a dose being 1/2oz /day, so the cost to use it would be approx $1/day/dog. It probably wouldn't do your dog any harm and if anyone with a large kennel (20 dogs) wanted to do a double blind study (randomly assign half your dogs to the study group, half to the control group. Have someone else prepare numbered water bowls each day half with the formula half without, and not tell you which group was getting which. Then, evaluate all 20 for health and endurance and see if there's any appreciable difference) that would be cool. Sorry to be a wet blanket on a potential sponsor but I'm naturally skeptical about claims like this that aren't backed up by independent peer-reviewed evidence. Pearse Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sheeptramp Posted August 5, 2009 Report Share Posted August 5, 2009 "When mixed with your dog’s daily drinking water, THE EDGE Powered by AQUA OXYGEN begins to work immediately after your dog takes its first drink. The proprietary water-splitting technology provides safe and bio-available Oxygen and Hydrogen to every cell in the animal’s body. This quenches vital biological needs of your animal to allow for peak performance and recovery. " What a load. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twinpines Posted August 6, 2009 Author Report Share Posted August 6, 2009 I will try to answer these questions the best that I can. I am not a scientist, I am a farmer. Diane- They do have a human form of the product that they market as well. I have been told the exact formulation is somewhat species specific though, so don't drink the canine form yourself. Pearse- Although I have a brother named Jim, my name is Jeff. I do not personally know of any independent peer reviewed science. As I said I am not a scientist, I do have an Animal Science degree but I know quite a bit more about genetics and reproduction than physiology. All that I know for sure is that the product has produced in my dogs as advertised, and that I have spoken to the owner of a racing greyhound kennel who buys the stuff by the gallon. He has seen a significant decrease in race times, increased winning percentage for his kennel, and a significant decrease in dogs tieing up and not being able to urinate after they run. They have experimented with the product quite a bit. At first they put the product in their second tier dogs because they were skeptical about it. When their second tier dogs started beating their top tier dogs their skepticism ended, and they put the product in their top tier dogs. Sheeptramp- If you want a response ask an intelligent question like Pearse did and sign your name to it. The only thing I know for sure is that my unscientific experience with this product has been wholly positive. I do not understand how it works completely, but I believe my observations are pretty fair. I hope people keep an open mind an some folks try the product. I would love to hear the results of a blind study as Pearse described. Thanks for your comments and interest. Jeff Mundorf Twin Pines Farms Red Oak IA Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liz P Posted August 6, 2009 Report Share Posted August 6, 2009 I am no chemist, but I majored in biology with a focus on physiology in college and I am a veterinarian. What that company is saying just makes no sense to me. You do not want to split oxygen from hydrogen in cells; it causes a lot of damage. I wouldn't pay money for a supplement like that without long term studies proving that it works as well as long term studies that show it doesn't increase the risk of oxidative damage to cells. More than the expense, I would be extremely concerned about the long term effects this product would have on the dogs. I don't make my dogs lab rats. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
desertranger Posted August 21, 2009 Report Share Posted August 21, 2009 Smart water for dogs. Another dumb idea to separate you from your coins. The same products are available for people and don't work any better than anything I do for myself before going out for the day. I do not agree with the theory that doctored water, adding Oxy, electrolytes or other supplements is any better than anything else. even the old standby gatorade is better than what they're marketing today. The trick to working long and hard is to be well hydrated and have a good electrolyte balance before you start and to maintain that hydration and balance throughout the day. Realize that once you (or your dog) fall behind the water curve the only way to stop it is to cease activity and re-hydrate with water a proper electrolytes. Bear in mind it can take several days to rehydrate after being severly dehydrated and heat stressed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cgt Posted August 21, 2009 Report Share Posted August 21, 2009 Last trial I went to, I smoked too much and downed an entire fifth of whiskey. My open dog did really well. Conclusion? Anecdotally yours, charlie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pearse Posted August 21, 2009 Report Share Posted August 21, 2009 Last trial I went to, I smoked too much and downed an entire fifth of whiskey. My open dog did really well. Conclusion? Anecdotally yours, charlie Anecdotally nothing. The fact that you were too hung over to blow your whistle explains everything. Pearse (whose depth perception is so far off these days that I'm putting a "gate" whistle on my dog knowing that if I just tell him to put the sheep through the gates, he'll stay on line without me). P.S. Apropos of my recent Sheepdog-L post that should read <humor> I'm putting a "gate" whistle on my dog </humor> lest I spark yet another debate about farm dogs vs trial dogs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Billadeau Posted August 21, 2009 Report Share Posted August 21, 2009 I've often wondered why working dogs need electrolyte supplements (in addition to what's in well balanced feed). Do they sweat away the electrolytes? Are they loosing electrolytes by panting? Do they piss more electrolytes following heavy work than following rest? Are electrolytes (Cl-, Na+, K+, Ca2+, etc) changed by the body during work? I've often wondered if supplements simply increase water intake following heavy work and improved rehydration is the key. Electrolyte Replacement in Urban Search and Rescue Dogs: A Field Study DISCUSSION Dehydration is a risk to USAR dogs. Subtle changes in osmolarity are usually sufficient to trigger thirst and subsequent rehydration through ingestion of water. In such stressful situations as high-intensity USAR missions, dogs may not be interested in drinking. There are no studies to determine whether USAR dogs develop dehydration or electrolyte imbalances during training exercises or deployments. The use of oral electrolyte and carbohydrate supplementation in USAR dogs was investigated in this field trial based on previous studies that have shown such supplements to be beneficial to athletes of other species.1,7–9 Despite the finding of statistically significant changes from baseline in sodium, chloride, and total solids in the electrolyte-supplemented dogs in the winter group, all values remained within normal reference ranges. The low initial values and increase in glucose at the end of the summer exercise were attributed to the delay in analysis resulting in increased glucose consumption10 in the earlier samples. Most studies evaluating electrolyte and carbohydrate changes in exercise have been performed with high-endurance athletes (e.g., sled dogs, horses, humans) or sprinters (e.g., greyhounds). 1–7,11 Humans and horses experience large losses of sodium and potassium in sweat during exercise.11–13 Canine athletes do not dissipate significant amounts of heat through sweat but rely on evaporative cooling via therespiratory tract.14 Electrolyte losses through panting are minimal in dogs. As a result, it is uncommon for dogs to develop clinically significant exercise-induced electrolyte changes. In extreme conditions, however, canine endurance athletes may develop electrolyte changes due to increased urinary losses.6 In addition, Labrador retrievers are reported to have statistically significant increases in sodium, potassium, and chloride immediately after 10 minutes of continuous retrieving drills.15 Similar to our study(despite statistical significance), the Labradors’ electrolyte values remained within the normal reference range. Even with minimal physiologic evidence to support the use of replacement electrolyte solutions in working dogs, supplementation may be recommended to increase palatability and fluid consumption. The addition of Electramine ® to fluids did not result in increased fluid consumption in this study, and two dogs actually refused to drink the solution during the winter exercises. Labrador retrievers reportedly have an increased incidence of exercise intolerance during field trial work.16 None of the dogs in this study had any history of exercise intolerance, nor did they become exhausted, dehydrated, or show any clinical signs of electrolyte changes. They did, however, experience injuries and illnesses similar to those experienced by dogs at the Oklahoma City bombing site.17 Dogs at the summer training site incurred footpad injuries from hot tar and gravel. One dog cut its leg during the winter exercises and required sutures. Mark Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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