D Strickland Posted July 7, 2009 Report Share Posted July 7, 2009 Does anyone on here feed Canidae grain free ALS ??? Trying to see how it compares to Taste of the Wild. Obvious comparison : Canidae - $49/30lb bag - feed 2 cups for 50lb dog -- 34/18 protein/fat - 3900 kcal/kg TOTW - $41/30lb bag - feed 2 2/3 cups for 50lb dog -- 32/18 protein/fat - 3719 kcal/kg I don't know anything about Canidae or how well dogs do on it ? Thanks, Dave Strickland www.outrunbc.com Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rebecca, Irena Farm Posted July 7, 2009 Report Share Posted July 7, 2009 I used to really like Canidae. Then they changed their formula, had some really weird answers to questions about why, and significantly (I feel), contracted their manufacturing operations to Diamond. Their new formulas aren't that much different from the ones Diamond offers, for much less - and lo and behold they've come out with a product comparable (but more expensive than) Diamond's TOTW. I didn't mind Diamond for a while. Then this winter I was having some trouble with my dogs that were on TOTW and even my guard dogs, who all have iron tummies, were having trouble with the peformance Diamond product they were on. Periodic poopsplosions, is what was happening, often enough to be really annoying in the middle of a wet, nasty, cold and icy winter. I knew I was getting the pup, by late Feb, so I started the "house dogs" on Orijen instead of TOTW. Wow, what a difference. Previously, I've done raw and homecooked, even professionally formulated home prepared fresh food, and the results are comparable to that. I do give about a third raw meaty bones with the Orijen, of course - chicken, lamb, pork, beef bones, etc. I'm very happy with it and I can get it shipped here for free from K9 Cuisine (this is a link). That's a big deal when you live forty five minutes from the nearest source of decent pet food! I also get Eagle Pack Power from here also - when I combine all the food I need for a few weeks I get a total of about 15% off plus the free shipping. I end up paying about what I'd pay for something like Purina Pro Plan at Pet Smart, and it comes to my door. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bcnewe2 Posted July 7, 2009 Report Share Posted July 7, 2009 Wow Becca That stuffs expensive. I could never afford it. Even with supplementing raw. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D Strickland Posted July 8, 2009 Author Report Share Posted July 8, 2009 I used to really like Canidae. Then they changed their formula, had some really weird answers to questions about why, and significantly (I feel), contracteI'm very happy with it and I can get it shipped here for free from K9 Cuisine (this is a link). That's a big deal when you live forty five minutes from the nearest source of decent pet food! I also get Eagle Pack Power from here also - when I combine all the food I need for a few weeks I get a total of about 15% off plus the free shipping. I end up paying about what I'd pay for something like Purina Pro Plan at Pet Smart, and it comes to my door. Orijen is a little pricey !!! Right now TOTW and Canidae grain free cost me $.90 per meal. For Orijen I'd be looking at $1.18/meal from a free ship site ..... or $1.35/meal if I buy from an online store that charges $21 for shipping. That would raise my monthly feed bill from $81 to $108 ....feeding 3 dogs. K9 Cuisine and PAWS choice are the only two sites that I could find that offer free shipping ...but they are out of Orijen. Thanks, Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rebecca, Irena Farm Posted July 8, 2009 Report Share Posted July 8, 2009 You feed like seriously half of the Orijen. Even when I did a straight kcal per gram calc and fed according to that, I found I was overfeeding. Ted eats 4 cups of the average premium 3900 kcal per kilo kibble, plus one pound of RMB. He only eats 2.25 cups of Orijen puppy plus the RMB. His condition is better than it has ever been. Ted on "prey model" raw - perfectly healthy, the day after his annual checkup. I took this photo because I was planning to switch off straight raw and wanted a record of why I was doing that. Ted today: I'm not saying Orijen is right for everyone. Far from it - I don't believe there's one way of feeding that's suitable for every dog out there. I really enjoyed home prepared and did it for a year, but when home schooling responsibilities picked up, and the demands of training Ted increased, I found I didn't have time. Surprisingly, I was happy to find that Orijen wasn't a "next best" but seems to be pretty much the same (but without the control over ingredients, but I no longer have a dog that could be seriously injured by a minor "boo-boo" on the manufacturer's account). I use Orijen Puppy for Ted and (of course) Sam, and the Senior formula for the "house dogs." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D Strickland Posted July 8, 2009 Author Report Share Posted July 8, 2009 You feed like seriously half of the Orijen. Even when I did a straight kcal per gram calc and fed according to that, I found I was overfeeding. Ted eats 4 cups of the average premium 3900 kcal per kilo kibble, plus one pound of RMB. He only eats 2.25 cups of Orijen pI use Orijen Puppy for Ted and (of course) Sam, and the Senior formula for the "house dogs." I have been feeding RAW for 7 years ... the last 4 have been using a Prey model. My oldest dog is having problems with a lot of scratching and her coat is really thinning .... to the point where I can see her pink skin. I'm sure not as sold on RAW as I used to be. Combine that with the price of feeding 3-4 dogs on RAW..... I'll never feed Puke-Rina or Ol' Roy .... but again I don't want to pay tons of money for kibble either. All my dogs are now getting between 2 and 2 1/2 cups a day of the Taste of the Wild. I'll see if I can't buy a bag of Orijen and try it. Dave S www.outrunbc.com Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rebecca, Irena Farm Posted July 8, 2009 Report Share Posted July 8, 2009 If the Orijen fixes your one dog's coat, you might look at copper and zinc levels in your raw diet. If you use a lot of poultry, there's almost zilch of these two important minerals in the diet. Most older dogs can handle this deficit because they build up a TON of reserves over the years. But as I found with my younger dog who was fed raw from the time he came to me, it had less than satisfactory results because he had no reserves, I guess. I imagine that it just depends on whether you can find a lot of meat with high levels of these minerals - or how responsive your dog is to lower levels. Grass fed red meat is the highest. My dogs all did pretty well when their diet was mostly culls from my own sheep flock, supplemented with duck from my flock, and goat, beef and pork from local farms, too. But then I moved and their diet went to mostly chicken. I thought it would be okay because I still did "whole prey" - just, you know, whole chickens, and still made sure they got a variety of other meats once or twice a week. One pup I raised did beautifully, and Ted was healthy and all, but he just wouldn't gain condition no matter how much I fed him. Then (please don't giggle) I had this Chinese crested, and it was the opposite with her. Her condition was perfect and she had perfect teeth and skin, unlike many of her breed. But her hair was terrible. She's supposed to have a really full "poof" on her head and feet and the older she got, it was thinning out and breaking. I started adding supplements as needed (zinc, copper, manganese, and choline), and she responded right away. Again, this isn't a condemnation or even a criticism of raw-based diets. Obviously I'm still committed to the benefits, and totally am cool for those for whom it works. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D Strickland Posted July 8, 2009 Author Report Share Posted July 8, 2009 If the Orijen fixes your one dog's coat, you might look at copper and zinc levels in your raw diet. If you use a lot of poultry, there's almost zilch of these two important minerals in the diet. Again, this isn't a condemnation or even a criticism of raw-based diets. Obviously I'm still committed to the benefits, and totally am cool for those for whom it works. The Zinc and copper makes a lot of sense. My dogs were eating chicken 3 times a week ... grass fed beef from my neighbor one day, culled sheep from my flocks one day, and salmon once day. Not sure what the problem was ....... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rebecca, Irena Farm Posted July 8, 2009 Report Share Posted July 8, 2009 Try simply adding a multivitamin, and one oyster per week to your dogs' diet (a good source of zinc ). A pork kidney (just 4 oz per dog per week) would also help boost mineral intake. Note: I'm NOT a nutrition expert. These are just guesses (somewhat educated) based on what Dave's relating. Don't try this at home. Your mileage may vary. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sue R Posted July 8, 2009 Report Share Posted July 8, 2009 ...poopsplosion... Wonderful word, thanks, Becca! That's one of those words that made me laugh out my nose when I read it, but only because it wasn't happening to my dogs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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