Went Back To See Farmer Today

[BorderCollieSam]

She is like a Jackle and Hide, this is a photo i have just taken of her next to me whilst i'm on the PC, she is curled up asleep taking things easy, i've never met such a relaxed and unenergetic dog!

 

Sam is like a race horse, can not be tired, even after running 7 miles, whereas Mel i can never imagine her having the energy to chase sheep around!

 

[Maralynn]

My wife was asking that tonight whilst we were out regarding Sam, because we thought it was him who was responsible for the damage today and we therefore left him in the yard tonight and as i say my wife suggested a crate....

 

I know a lot of people crate their dogs, i went to a house only the other evening and see a dog in a cage, 'personally' (i know there are some on this forum that crate their dogs and each to their own, i'm not saying there is anything wrong with that), however 'personally' i do not like the look of a caged dog....i don't even like to see dogs kept on leads all the time when they are outside, i understand there are dogs that must be kept on leads for one reason or another, however 'in the right place' i like to see dogs run and enjoy themselves, the very thought of seeing a dog in a cage makes me sad...

 

I look at a crate as something that will keep my dog safe while I'm gone. For instance they can't chew things such as a power cord which could shock/possibly kill them and they can't chew/ingest something that could cause a blockage in their system. You can make it cozy and give them something appropriate to chew on and many dogs quickly learn to love their crates. I had Missy's crate put away over Christmas due to needing extra space for the tree and extra family. When I got it back out she couldn't wait to get back in her "den" - the door is always open and she comes and goes as she pleases. Just another perspective to think about.

[BorderCollieSam]

She has just woke up!

 

[bcnewe2]

A crate might make you sad but aren't you sadder with your couch and pillowstorn up and feeling like Mel was upset enough to cause such damage?

 

Some dogs really like the feeling of a crate. It's their hidey hole. She might feel safer in a crate while you are away. You could try one out for a little while, if she gets over her chewing issues or becomes more comfortable in the house when you're away or sleeping you can try without again.

I have crates set right by my bed when I'm raising a young pup, keeps us close and no suprises.

Non of my dogs seem to mind being crated, I don't use them but because they were all crate trained it's no big deal if I need to.

 

Stop looking at it as a cage and look at it as a safe place for Me and your furniturel. It'll make it easier on both of you!

[BorderCollieSam]

A crate might make you sad but aren't you sadder with your couch and pillowstorn up and feeling like Mel was upset enough to cause such damage?

 

Some dogs really like the feeling of a crate. It's there hidey hole. She might feel safer in a crate while you are away. You could try one out for a little while, if she gets over her chewing issues or becomes more comfortable in the house when you're away or sleeping you can try without again.

I have crates set right by my bed when I'm raising a young pup, keeps us close and no suprises.

Non of my dogs seem to mind being crated, I don't use them but because they were all crate trained it's no big deal if I need to.

 

Stop looking at it as a cage and look at it as a safe place for Me and your furniturel. It'll make it easier on both of you!

 

I've just taken a look at Freecycle, somebody on there is offering one, but they posted up at 20:00hrs, i've only just replied at 02:00, would be nice if they still have it available!

[Sue R]

What they said! I felt the same way as you about crates but they do provide safety and security - for the dog and for you, when you can't be there.

 

You may also want to leave some good chewing toys in the crate with her. Something like a Kong toy that is stuffed with something yummy is a good alternative for keeping a dog occupied.

 

Also try using the "search" function to check out separation anxiety topics because there is a lot of information there. Best wishes!

[flyer]

What they said! I felt the same way as you about crates but they do provide safety and security - for the dog and for you, when you can't be there.

 

You may also want to leave some good chewing toys in the crate with her. Something like a Kong toy that is stuffed with something yummy is a good alternative for keeping a dog occupied.

 

Also try using the "search" function to check out separation anxiety topics because there is a lot of information there. Best wishes!

 

 

I had never crate trained either until Colt. He slept in there at night with the door closed in our bedroom until he was about 7 mos. old and then we just left the door opened. He still would go to his crate. He also sought it out to get away from the pup during the past few months.

 

I crate trained Bea too and a few nights ago we couldn't find her in the house. Very worried. She was in her crate all tucked up sound asleep.

 

They really do come to love them. It is the most den like little comfy safe place they can be. Just take your time with the training.

[alligande]

We are also firmly in the don't like crates camp BUT as a temporary measure I have come to see their merits. Rievaulx is now 6 months old and is the youngest dog we have had, loves to chew and was not fully house trained when he arrived. He sleeps in a crate at night in our bedroom (where his dog bed will go) and we have a crate in the dinning room where he will have a dog basket. We can leave him in there safely when we are not home and not worry about expensive furniture being eaten, when he gets too wound up in he goes.

One day the crate will leave, as we really don't like having a large metal crate in our house, but it is doing the job.

[BorderCollieSam]

Will give the crate a go, waiting to hear back from somebody to see if they still have it available.

 

Took Mel for a walk through some farmers fields today with Sam, today was the first time i let her off her lead.........

 

It was within approx 5 acre paddock, fenced all around, with a turnstile at the top of the field and the bottom, the field was elevated, we were walking uphill when i let her off her lead, at first she just walked a few steps in front of me and then came back to me and sat at my feet.

 

Then when we got to the top of the hill, there was a football match about half mile away in another field and they were using the whistle (sport/footballers whistle) and were shouting really loudly.

 

Mel took flight and ran, however it was strange how she ran out, i was standing in the middle of the field looking down hill, she ran out wide to the side and continued running all along the edge of the field, do you think this is because she was trained for sheep? As i have seen sheepdogs running wide around the outside of a field.

 

Anyway, i gave her two sharp whistles, Sam returned and recalls immediately on this command and Mel does 'in the house', however she didn't respond in the field, i then told Sam to 'go and get er', he sprinted after her like a race horse, the speed and power Sam has Mel just can not compete with, he managed to run past her and in front of her and stop her in her tracks by barking at her and standing his ground!

 

She then returned when i called her and Sam ran past her on the way back towards me and got back to me first and sat in front of me and Mel ran all the way back to me.

 

Isn't it strange how Sam is much faster running and fitter than a working sheepdog is?

[Maralynn]

Isn't it strange how Sam is much faster running and fitter than a working sheepdog is?

 

Not really. She wasn't actually working in her other home was she? I thought she was a disappointment to the farmer and he didn't really use her? If this is the case, Sam has much more exercise and conditioning then Mel has so it would only make sense that he has more speed/stamina.

[Sue R]

Good for Sam to help with his little buddy when she needed him! About fitness, Mara got it right. And, also, Sam is built like my Dan - kind of like a racehorse and built for speed. Mel is built like my Megan, and not so leggy. One of these days, though, Sam will have a doggie running partner!

[BorderCollieSam]

Good for Sam to help with his little buddy when she needed him! About fitness, Mara got it right. And, also, Sam is built like my Dan - kind of like a racehorse and built for speed. Mel is built like my Megan, and not so leggy. One of these days, though, Sam will have a doggie running partner!

 

Hi Sue, yes i am hoping she will become a good running partner for Sam.

 

It is incredible looking at both dogs as they are so different (physically).

 

As mentioned, Sam is a race horse like your Dan, however Mel is much slower and lower to the ground...and looks more 'the part', however when it comes to performance Sams build is more suited to performance than Mel...

 

They are both purebreed Border Collies, but you would have thought that their would have been a common 'want' in the breed for them to run fast, it therefore puzzles me as to why they are two different types of breed/dogs....

 

Even the other long coated BC's that i see being walked by their owners in my neighbourhood are the same as Mel, a little slow, frail looking etc.,...

[bcnewe2]

There are all different shapes and sizes. But frail is not a sure thing for slow. Raven used to be my fasest dog but to look at her she looks quite small framed, petite but she was a little power house!

Mick s lopey and slow, thick boned, nothing like small or petite about him. But when he wants to he can turn on the speed and keep up with his smaller sisters. Dew is the fastest now, I think it's all youth!

 

I have a feeling besides being out of shape Mel hasn't quite let herself go. Just give her half a chance to get a bit more comfy in her surroundings and I think she'll blow you away!

[Jedismom]

i then told Sam to 'go and get er', he sprinted after her like a race horse, the speed and power Sam has Mel just can not compete with, he managed to run past her and in front of her and stop her in her tracks by barking at her and standing his ground! She then returned when i called her and Sam ran past her on the way back towards me and got back to me first and sat in front of me and Mel ran all the way back to me.

 

I'm still amazed that he did this for you. Really? Did you train that? Amazing dogs!

[BorderCollieSam]

I'm still amazed that he did this for you. Really? Did you train that? Amazing dogs!

 

 

Border Collies are very knowing, whenever i say something to Sam he looks at me like a human with his ears pricked up and ready to leap into action - i am sure others BC's are the same.

 

He knew what i was asking of him the other day because i inherited two cats from my mum/dad but i am allergic to them, i therefore cannot have these cats in he house. I purchased a dog kennel for them and placed it in the back garden for them to live in, they seem happy, however whenever they get the chance they run into the house and i have to run around the house and try and get them out.

 

Sam knows now that when i say 'get em out' i mean to get the cats out, and he runs around the house after the cats (doesn't bite or hurt them) but runs after them, manages to get under the tables (which i can't!!!) and if they don't move he puts his two front legs lowered to the floor in a half down position with front down and rear upright, legs wide apart and barks at them and moves towards them until he moves them out!

 

He has been a true helper to me in every sense of the word, i'm very very happy with him.

[BorderCollieSam]

Update on Mel:-

 

Mel is coming along nicely, she is off the lead now at all times but only when deep in fields and away from any roads.

 

Its still difficult to get her outside from the house, as if i call her towards me whilst i'm standing in the house at the door with her lead, she bolts away and won't come near me. However, if i go outside the house and leave the front door open, and i call her, she comes flying out through the door to me and goes onto her back for her belly to be rubbed and tickled!

 

She still gets spooked by the shot gun noise from the farmers bird scarers, she bolts in full sprint for about 150ft, but i keep walking in the direction we 'were' before the noise and i call her as i continue walking and she soon flies back to me without me having to go and get her.

 

Sam is still helpful and flies after her when i tell him, which leads me on to another subject.

 

I've found a fantastic way of working Sam at a distance. Sam enjoys chasing after her, he doesn't hurt her, but runs after her, gets in front of her, and blocks her from running any further away by standing his ground and going down onto his front legs whilst barking at her.

 

I've found Mel to be a fantastic tool for me to get Sam working at a distance, as i can let him go out after Mel, wait until he circles her, and then give him the down and stay commands and then tell him to 'go get her' again.

 

It isn't cruel, they are playing together, Sam loves it as he just loves running, and Mel seems to like it as she runs around with Sam in the field and they just seem to both enjoy themselves at the same time i'm getting some valuable training in for Sam - and what better distraction than another dog! My guess is if i get Sam used to working out at a distance with another dog, then if i can at some point get some sheep then he's already got good distance commands whilst having distractions so hopefully he'll be a little way there....

 

Some of you who have been following this thread may be aware that Sam has been neutered, however shortly after getting Mel, she came into season. When we got Mel she was skin and bones, you could literally feel every single bone in her small fragile body. However, she has put on loads and loads of weight, and we are wondering if she was already in season when we got her and possibly one of the farmers other dogs has got to her and she could be in pup? How do we tell?

[Sue R]

I'm glad to hear that Mel is coming along nicely and that she and Sam are the best of friends.

 

As for the door issue, I wonder if she was treated harshly for going though the doorway without permission. I think, with time, she will get better and better at this as she trusts you more and more, and as old, bad memories might fade a bit more.

 

Won't comment on the Sam-and-Mel in the field, but it sounds like you are doing a very nice job giving this little girl a happy home! Best wishes!

[Laurae]

I would caution you against having Sam work Mel, especially if you plan to introduce him to stockwork later. Often, dogs who learn to work other dogs on their own are less likely to want to take the corrections necessary for working stock with a partner later on.

 

 

 

 

Not that I expect anything but excuses and reasons why this won't apply to you and your dog in response.

[rushdoggie]

I would take her to the vet to see if shes just filling out or if she is pregnant. Typically a pregnant dog will have her weight low and only in her abdomen and a fatter dog will have her weight all over, in addition are her nipples extended?

 

But to know for sure, take her to the vet and have her looked at.

 

I have read this whole thread today and it has made me smile to think of her with you. I have a dog that I was given as he was a sheepdog washout. Hes now 12.

 

Ross has always been nervous in the house as he was not raised and socialized to the noises and things that happen in a house. When I got him nothing terrified him more than silverware. If I picked up a spoon he would tear away like someone had picked up a gun...

 

Over the years he has come around quite a lot. Because of his fears indoors we worked together outside first to learn things I needed him to know, then gradually moved indoors to practice them. He has "safe spaces" in the house that I leave open for him (my bed, hahaha) and his open crate and when he feels too much pressure in the house he escapes to his safe places. I also have a securely fenced yard so I installed a dog door for his benefit...when I am home he can escape outside as well.

 

It took time, patience and consistency for us to learn to live together well. He is such a wonderful boy, totally worth the time spent working through his fears. He has earned obedience and agility titles with me and seemed to really enjoy the working part of our relationship...he loves long romps where he can be off lead in the woods or at the river. He is very obedient and has a rock solid recall we built through Leslie Nielson's Really Reliable Recall program. He will always be nervous indoors (and as he has always had a fear of men) will always be nervous of my husband. But my husband and I understand him, and we accept who he is. I have no regrets of taking him home.

 

I hope for you to have the same wonderful relationship with your Mel and six years from now you can look back and see how far you have come together.

[urge to herd]

Shonie 'worked' other dogs from the time I first saw her at her foster home. I wish I knew then what I know now. Her intense staring, that I let go on because I thought it was cute, made it impossible to get her focus on me or anything else. The staring and following contributed to the bad feelings that erupted after we brought a 3rd dog into our home.

 

It's not a good thing for either Sam or Mel. Please don't let him do that to her.

 

Ruth

[BorderCollieSam]

Yes the improvements in her are really fulfilling she now has so much more confidence she runs holding her tail higher now instead of right up between her legs like she did when we first took her on it looked like she didn't have a tail!

 

She has even learnt now how to giv me kisss, I got my first 'proper' one today on command 'give me kisses'!!

 

I havnt checked her nipples yet, although yes she is showing the extra weight low down, also forgot to mention she runs whn off the lead and ends up stopping every couple of knifed for a lay down and starts panting until I catch up with her and then she gets back up and starts walking/running again.

 

By the way, Im glad to hear I'm not the only one who has had to give their bed up to their dog!

[pansmom]

Shonie 'worked' other dogs from the time I first saw her at her foster home. I wish I knew then what I know now. Her intense staring, that I let go on because I thought it was cute, made it impossible to get her focus on me or anything else. The staring and following contributed to the bad feelings that erupted after we brought a 3rd dog into our home.

 

It's not a good thing for either Sam or Mel. Please don't let him do that to her.

 

Ruth

 

Glad Mel is opening up, but I second the above, and I don't think it's really very compassionate to let Sam work the cats either. Vala has the instinct to do a similar thing for me but I don't let her, after folks here reminded me of what I'm about to remind you. Imagine how the cats feel in that situation. Imagine how Mel feels. It is your job to interact with the cats or Mel, and to do it positively and without scaring the other creature(s). Even if Sam is being nice, you're using him as an intermediary and enhancing his status while detracting from theirs and possibly scaring them. He's barking, stiffening up, etc. That is not very nice to the cats or Mel. Cats and Mel are not stock.

 

Also please do take Mel to the vet to see if she's pregnant! She sounds like I feel...