What do you feed your dogs?

[Tommy Coyote]

I'm just curious.

 

I have got caught right in the middle of the raw food fight. I have to wonder if dogs really do better on raw food.

These people do not believe in kibble of any kind - not even the really good stuff.

 

I feed my dogs Evo in the morning and raw food in the afternoon (its a mix of raw meat, bone, organs and then added vegetables and fruit). And my dogs love it and seem to be doing really well. But its expensive.

 

But I also have to say that as a pet sitter I see dogs that are fed just about everything under the sun. Sadly, most of the dogs I take care of get Pedigree and that is not a very good food but its cheap.

 

A lot of the dogs I see that eat grocery store food look good. There coats are shiny. They seem to have a lot of energy.

 

I'm just wondering how you feel about this.

[Sue_Deutscher]

I read that a lot of commercial dog food is made from animals that can't get up, in other words not fit for human consumption. Also, I read that dead pets from (some) vets are used, and dead pets from shelters. These euthanized pets have that drug that they use to kill them still in their bodies. I don't know whether that is true or not. I can find the links when I get a chance.

 

I saw a documentary on the "How It's Made" series about kibble. I don't know what the brand was, but they took mashed up corn and coated it with animal fat. I don't think dogs digest corn very well.

 

I grind up whole chickens and bake, sometimes with liver (not more than once a week or you get iron toxicity or something like that), gizzards, hamburger, rice, beef knuckle bones (usually raw), cottage cheese, yogurt, and stuff like that but I'm probably forgetting something.

 

I get the chicken for .79 a lb. at the grocery store. At least I'm not spending a fortune at Petsmart anymore, and I feel good about what they're getting. Oh and eggs sometimes. I know they're not getting any bad additives.

 

It's work to cook all that but my kid is all grown up so they're my kids now.

[SS Cressa]

I feed raw (HPPI and raw bones).

 

-One of the biggest benefits is their poop. It doesn't smell as near as bad as kibble fed dogs and it is smaller.

 

-depends on what kibble is fed but they can smell really bad(of course maybe it was just the dogs... it was boxers).

 

-It also seem easier to keep weight off dogs with raw. My sister dogs Conner couldn't loose weight on kibble and he was only getting fed 1/4 cup anything more would make him gain weight! On raw it is much easier to get him to loose weight and he can eat 6-8oz to maintain.

 

-They seem to also build a better muscle mass on raw.

 

I would like to point out these are just observation from me and my friends.

[Sue_Deutscher]

This is where I had started my search. There is a lot of good info and good links.

 

wiki on pet food

 

wait this one is better, it's just about commercial dog food

 

wiki on dog food

[Debbie Meier]

I feed raw when it is easily available and inexpensive, this past winter we were given a few deer and had a call about a downer that had not had not been treated with any drugs that we were able to utilize. The locker in town gives away tongue, heart, liver and rib bones when the person contracting the processing does not want it, which also helps. When we can't find economical raw we feed Kent Native, presently a mix between level 1 and level 3. Feeding raw to our crew has proven to influence the condition to the heavy side of the dogs faster then with kibble. If we could we would feed it exclusively, but it is often times not practical based on our numbers and storage capacity.

 

Deb

[Jack & Co.]

The Search feature on this board will give you tons of information on feeding dogs with both raw and commercial food.

[AllieMackie]

I feed California Natural Lamb & Rice puppy formula at the moment, and Finn also gets a raw bone to gnaw on a bit every day (each lamb shank lasts him three days or so). When he's outgrown the Cali Natural, I intend to start feeding him EVO.

 

The benefits of raw feeding, when done correctly, are endless. I believe that raw is the best way to feed your dog if you have the means, but if you don't, there are plenty of premium kibble diets that are perfectly fine and great for your dog as well. I personally feed kibble for the convienience of it, but I feed Finn the daily raw bone for the raw benefits; his teeth get cleaned, it aids digestion, and he adores the feeling of gnawing on it.

[juliepoudrier]

Tommy,

People feed a variety of foods from cheap kibble to complete whole-prey-model raw for a number of reasons. As Debbie mentioned above, some has to do with practicality and cost. I believe that certain premium kibbles are well-made with excellent ingredients, and I wouldn't hesitate to feed them (I do feed them). I also feed raw to some of my dogs, but it's not cheap, even though I can supplement with home-grown animals (i.e., basically an entire sheep costs me just the $55 butchering fee, which makes the price quite reasonable) or leftovers from hunting and fishing. But I can't afford to feed 10 border collies plus a maremma on raw, so those who I think can benefit the most from it are fed raw and the rest get premium kibble. Those that are kibble fed are supplemented with raw meaty bones as well as other "add ons" to their kibble, so even the kibble-fed dogs are getting a varied diet that includes raw occasionally.

 

Generally, what I tell people is to feed the best possible food that they can afford. We may be offended by some of the ingredients in the cheaper foods, but my dogs eat an awful lot of things (poop from all sorts of species, dead animal parts/carrion, drinking nasty water, etc.) I'd rather they didn't and although that doesn't mean they should be *fed* that sort of stuff, it's certainly not going to kill them (generally).

 

I think a lot of people spend a lot of time trying to make others feel bad about what they feed their dogs. I try to remember times when I had no money and still tried to do right by my dogs but had to feed less than stellar foods. I remember when we didn't have all the premium choices and most everybody fed store brands or table scraps. Dogs back then were happy and healthy and generally lived good lives. We know better now, and many of us can do better, but some cannot, and I don't condemn them for not doing better.

 

It's been said here often before, but even some of the best available foods might not be right for an individual dog. I fed Timberwolf Organics to one of my geriatrics for a time, and he couldn't keep weight on. While I was finishing out that food, I added cooked oatmeal to his diet (gasp! a grain) and he was able to maintain his weight. So, if what you're feeding has your dog looking and feeling good, it's probably okay. For folks feeding grocery store brands, yep, they could do better. But as long as the dog is loved and otherwise well-cared-for I wouldn't lose sleep over it.

 

JMO.

 

J.

[bsms99]

There is a ton of good info here: The Dog Food Project

 

Feed your dogs what works for them. Most of mine did great on Purina Dog Chow...which is mostly corn, nowadays. Don't know what used to be in it. I switched to Kirkland because I have one dog who doesn't like PDC. It also has much better ingredients. Some dogs can't tolerate corn, and they MUST be fed a corn-free diet.

 

Kibble doesn't contain dead pets. Some (including Kirkland, I've read) use human consumption quality food. However, my dogs eat horse poop pretty regularly and it doesn't seem to bother them any. Dogs are scavengers. They can eat darn near anything and do well, unless they have an allergy.

 

When I was a kid, we had a poodle who lived to 13 or 14 on Gainesburgers. If a dog can thrive (and he did, TONS of energy) on that nasty stuff, they can survive on ANYTHING.

 

BTW - Gainesburger commercial

[Ms.DaisyDuke]

This topic is covered quite frequently in the Health and Genetics part, you'll find tons of info there. I feed my dog Orijen. It took me a LONG time to find something she would do well on and eat and this is what we landed on. I like it because it is made here in Alberta and there is nothing in it that you wouldn't eat. All the protein is human grade meat. I had a huge problem when that melamine thing happened and I don't even buy food for me that was made elsewhere now. She also gets raw meaty bones every once in a while and I do make her treats out of chicken livers I buy at the grocery store and she will also get a pig foot here and there. I think it does really depend on the dog and how well that particular dog does on what it's eating. I had a lab growing up that eat Ol'Roy (you cant' get cheaper food than that!) and she did amazing on it. Daisy wouldn't be so lucky!

FWIW, my bf works at a poultry processing plant and you'd be surprised at what gets sent to the pet food producers! There is no part of the chicken that gets wasted, it's either McNuggets or pet food that gets all the left overs.

[pammyd]

I feed pray model raw

and tbh I find it cheeper and easier than preimium kibble

 

I think the best and most important thing is to try and get a mixture of food and not be suckered into the manufacturers brainwashing that a dog is only healthy fed that one brand of compleat kibble and that alone

 

the same of anything all the time is not healthy or natural for anyone or anything

[border_collie_crazy]

I also feed raw. I do it becuase I see results. Shadownearly died at the age of 4 from what the vet called Premature aging, it was suggested we put her down because she was in so much pain. we switched to raw..Shadow is currently 13 years old. Happy was a very sick puppy, her coat was dull, and flakey, she had terrable gas and would not stop eating poo, my mom had to rush her to the vet and get her on IVs more then once while I was at school. one day as she was eating boiled rice and chicken broth once again, we said screw this and switched her straight to raw..she is nearly 9 years old now and my vet said she is the healthiest dog she has ever seen as she runs for 5 hours before proceeding to scale walls. or Perky, the difference between her and the other senior dogs in a group freestyle routine they did...there was the kibble senoirs stiffly and slowly going throygh the motions..and there was Perky with a giant grin on her face, leaping 3 feet in the air through the entire routine lol. or Ladybug, left in the streets is horrable pain, barly able to walk, reeking breath etc.. would guessed her to have maybe 1 year left to her life..if that. the max age she is now guessed at is 7 years and people are only willing to call her that old because her face is white, by her exuberence and energy alone they guess even younger. Misty is still regularly mistaken for a young puppy. Misty will be 7 years old this year.

 

that said I have no issue with good kibbles, but I am sold on raw for the reasons above lol

[Root Beer]

I feed one of my dogs a complete raw diet.

 

One gets mostly raw, but a half cup of kibble in the mornings, as well.

 

One gets kibble for breakfast and an RBM in the evening.

 

One eats only kibble.

 

The kibble I feed is Taste of the Wild - they all LOVE it and do very well on it.

 

I have pretty much figured out what works best for each of my dogs as an individual, while taking the financial aspect of feeding into account.

[Elizabeth77]

I feed Meg Royal Canin and as a treat twice a week she gets half a can of wet food mixed with the dry.

She seems to do great on this and her coat is very shiny and healthy looking.

[Anda]

Having a very picky dog with a sensitive stomach AND an alergy to chicken, for years I fed him California Natural Lamb & Rice - but he wasn't thilled with the taste, despite all the toppings I'd put on his kibble. He also eats very little. He is 48 lbs and could go through only 10lbs/month of CA Natural. I recently switched him to Taste of the Wild - Bison & Venison, and he totally loves it. He didn't have any problems with the grains (rice) in CA Natural, he just didn't like that food so much. Neither did he enjoy Solid Gold Lamb & Rice. So far we're happy with TOTW and hope it stays that way. The best thing is that I found this food at Vitamin Cottage, a natural grocery store chain here in Denver, and it's more convenient for me than going to the pet store for his food.

[sandra s.]

Usually I feed raw (lots of beef as that's cheapest), but since I've been cleaning up and unearthed some noodle packets that have gotten a little old, they've been having a lot of noodles for a few days (with fish oil and other yummy stinky stuff of course).

[sixx]

I have been interested in starting Seek on a raw diet, but don't know where to start. I am probably going to consult with the granary. I was thinking of getting a costco size bag of mixed veggies.

 

Seek is very picky when it comes to kibble. I had her on Evo when I first got her, then I switched to First Mate for 3 or 4 months (blueberries and chicken). She would barely eat the First Mate after awhile. Then I decided to use Royal Canin. Every animal I ever had loves the stuff. Don't know why. So I got her the Active Special 25 Royal Canin. She loves it! I also give her salmon oil every day. Sometimes raw ham bones, or pumpers (pig heart), or Turkey patties (dog treats). Once in awhile I give her a can of Merrick soft food (wingaling, grammy's pot pie, thanksgiving day dinner). She was underweight when I got her, at a 32 pounds. Now she is almost 40 pounds. The weight came on when I started feeding her Royal Canin.... or maybe it's all the treats from training?? I train her daily to keep her mind busy (which she loves), and I feed her Zuke's natural treats.

 

How does everyone feel about canned food? It has less calories than kibble. I just don't know if it's junk food or not. It seems to have healthy ingredients, and real meat....

[Carson Crazies]

If I could afford the time and money to feed all of my dogs a completely raw diet I'd do it in a heartbeat. As it is now, they're fed a kibble based diet along with various toppings, including eggs (from Julie's chickens, lol), fish, cottage cheese, crockpotted stuff, and the occasional RMB. I fed a totally raw diet to my arthritic dog when she originally came up lame, but found out after a year or so completely by accident that she does better on certain ones of the grain free kibbles than what I was feeding her.

 

I come from a school of doing what works, and what you can afford to do WELL whether it be a time, or money thing. I also don't think it's an all or nothing thing. The way I see it, even a little bit of unprocessed food has to be better than nothing but processed food.

[juliepoudrier]

Sixx,

I feed canned food (premium brands) as a topping to my dogs' kibble daily. I divide one can between six dogs because the kibble is complete so the canned is just basically a top dressing, but I think it adds a bit of taste variety to their food. I add all sorts of other stuff to my dogs' kibble too--eggs from my chickens, browned meats including organ meats, cottage cheese, yogurt, canned fish, leftovers from human meals, etc. I wouldn't feed strictly canned food because it's mostly water so I think you'd have to feed a lot of it to meet your dog's nutritional needs, but as an odd-on I think it's fine.

 

Pammyd,

I think numbers of dogs, storage capacity, and availability of reasonably priced meats plays a large role in whether someone can feed raw economically. I've done the math and can't see a way to feed 10 dogs on raw as cheaply as I can feed them on a good quality kibble. So I compromise with my add-ins and the RMBs and other stuff I give them.

 

Anda.

Funny about the TOTW. Both Laura and I ended with dogs with blow-out diarrhea on the bison variety, although they can eat the other varieties just fine. I guess that just goes to show that individual dogs have individual needs when it comes to what you feed....

 

J.

[Carson Crazies]

Anda.

Funny about the TOTW. Both Laura and I ended with dogs with blow-out diarrhea on the bison variety, although they can eat the other varieties just fine. I guess that just goes to show that individual dogs have individual needs when it comes to what you feed....

 

HAH! I was just getting ready to say that! Yep, the bison one gave Ginger the backdoor trots, but the fish one is the bomb. She tolerates the chicken one OK, but seems to do best on the fish. As for the CN, my dogs don't seem to just love the taste, but it does seem to do well for my harder keepers, if one of them needs weight put on.

[Liz P]

Innova adult dog food and Evo because I get it for free. I used to feed Eagle Power Pack when my dogs were working and Purina One during the off season. Now that Purina Pro Plan is available I would use that for the off season. Yeah, I know, Purina. Big evil dog food company, right? I don't think so. They put their money where their mouth is. They have full time vets on staff and decades of research behind their food.

[Anda]

Speaking of full blown up diarreah (this is a dogs and foods subject, so induldge me ), I determined that what gave Ouzo the mother of all diarreah so that he ended using Chris' bathtub on two separete occasions was VITAMIN E. Yup. Human grade, Walmart type - Spring Valley - 400 IU. Given along with his fish oil caplets. He didn't have any problems in the past when I gave him another brand of vitamin E. At least we know now how to avoid D (or should I call them E) bombs

[Jersey Girl]

For those of you that feed raw with bones and do not grind the bones, how do you start? How do you tell what size bone your dog can handle without choking or trying to swallow whole. Everything that I have read is that the bone should be big enough that they have to chew it, and not be able to swallow it whole. Anyone have suggestions as to what to start with for a 40lb border collie. I have fed a mixture of raw (no bones though) but with kibble to keep it complete as the raw didn't contain the bones and it was just one kind of meat like chicken to see how she liked it (loved it) but I haven't been brave enough to add bones as part of the meal. I fed EVO for awhile, but finally got the medium to larger bag and she didn't eat it fast enough and at the end of the bag was getting sick from it, someone I know suggested it might have gone bad as there are no or very low amounts of preservatives in it. Has anyone had this experience with any of the raw kibble foods. She did well on it otherwise.

 

Jersey Girl

[pammyd]

Is your dog a gulper or a chewer?? if you give him bigger things does he chew them

Mia (who is 10Kg) I gave her a chicken thigh 1st to see how she did - how about a chicken 1/2 - they cant swallow that down

then you get an idea of how they will eat

 

My 2 like to gnaw everything so they are fine with pretty small bones like choped ox tail

[Ooky]

Funny about the TOTW! I have been forbidden to feed it as it gives Odin terrible gas. And while this may be coincidence, I swear, and so does DH, that he loves to run up to DH right before he's going to cut one and then does it like the French ("in [his] general direction" ). So, TOTW is out.

 

We now feed Nature's Variety Prairie and rotate through bags with different meat sources (chicken, beef, lamb, and salmon). Odin loves it. He also gets a bit of Instinct beef canned cat food as a topping (since we have it for the cats anyway). I supplement his diet with olive, fish, and flaxseed oils, yogurt, occasionally cheese (although I often get in trouble for that one too), and he gets raw multiple times a week - RMBs, lamb necks, or about 4-8 oz of whatever meat we're having for dinner. I also try to give him veggies but he's not a big fan, like any kid This diet works well for us currently, it is relatively affordable and I get lots of compliments on his non-doggy smell and nice shiny coat.

 

About the raw-only diet and the OPs original question: I have thought about it a lot, and while I think it is probably a very good diet for a dog, especially if you are doing it well, I don't really think dogs' evolutionary diet is the "full prey model" or even all raw meat. They are the same species as wolves (different subspecies), but how they are so different is that they have evolved (significantly) to live with and be domesticated by humans. For example, I have read that dogs' facial expressions have changed to be measurably more like humans' than what wolves' are like, and that dogs are the only animals that can follow a human's gaze or pointing finger to look at something (rather than the finger itself). Chimps apparently won't even do that. My point being that I believe that while the full prey model may be the ancestral diet from 10,000-15,000 years ago, dogs have probably been eating various degrees of human food, including cooked grains, for a long time. As a result, dogs are probably more omnivorous than their ancestral condition, and my bet is many dogs are fine with grains. Why do some dogs do so poorly on them? Well, my human friend has terrible food allergies and she also has to avoid every grain but buckwheat, which has nothing to do with *her* ancestral diet (actually, she's chinese-american and can't eat any rice - how sad is that?!) I'm betting something like that comes to play in the really bad cases with dogs found to be intolerant of grains. I definitely agree that just like for people , there is a diet that is best for each individual, so if your dog does the best on the full prey model and it saved his life or something, I'm not discounting that. But I just don't believe that it would automatically be the "best" diet for every dog for the reason I often read, which is that it is their ancestral diet, and thus what they are "supposed" to be eating. Dogs are carnivores, yes, but it is a continuum, not a category.

 

The poops really are less mess when Odin has eaten a lot of bone though, I do agree with that!

 

As for the kibble, I feed a really good quality kibble and do not have qualms about it the way I would Ol Roy (for example). Really, kibble is very convenient. If I didn't feed it, I'd still probably switch to a combo of home cooked (including non-wheat grains) and raw.